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Bigger problems than road congestion in Toronto. In 10 years all the shoddy condos will be exposed for the frauds they are and become what a professor at UT termed "Glass Ghettos." Before living in Toronto I would believe this report, after living here, not at all. Could be one of the best cities in the world for smokers though or inhaling secondhand smoke. Been here 3 months and that was 3 months too long and I'm on my way out.
It is just one list. These Journalists set their criteria and published a list, and based on the criteria these are the cities selected. It is kind of difficult to argue with the results, no matter what it is entitled.
If you do not like this list, there are quite a few others that do not mention Toronto in their Top 10 or 25. So just default back to one of those if it fits your views better.
Personally, give me the Monocle list. Tokyo, Copenhagen, Munich, Berlin, Hong Kong, Madrid, Paris, Barcelona....some of my favorites there.
But in no way am I going to argue with one list, plus how can you argue that Toronto is not a livable city? It is safe, clean, the economic centre of a prosperous G8 country, urban in a good way? Surely there are worse examples to follow out there on this earth.
In the link you posted only monocle's survey doesn't have T.O in top 25.. Mercer is 15 and of couse EIU's number 4... Being in the top 15 of two lists is pretty good and there are probably others that rank it highly as well.. We all have our own personal prefs....
Oddly enough read up on the founder and E in C of Monocle Tyler Brule - a Canadian who lived in Toronto and makes no bones about his personal issues with the city!
Look, Buffalo is obviously not the best, I was just trying to make a point.
I cannot believe these "journalists" could not find more "livable" (their word, not mine) cities than Toronto. Most diverse, most exciting, sure. But most livable? Not even close. Big, diverse and exciting does not necessarily equate to livable.
Im sure the rankings are accounting for International cities of a certain size of course... Its not pretending to say the measured cities are tops in liveability for all cities - sheesh.... If you want quaint small to medium city living Toronto isn't a good match for you and that is cool - you always have London Ontario.
I sure wish other magazines, catering more to the lower classes, would do their most livable city polls. The Economist? You know the type of people who subscribes to that magazine!!!
In the link you posted only monocle's survey doesn't have T.O in top 25.. Mercer is 15 and of couse EIU's number 4... Being in the top 15 of two lists is pretty good and there are probably others that rank it highly as well.. We all have our own personal prefs....
Oddly enough read up on the founder and E in C of Monocle Tyler Brule - a Canadian who lived in Toronto and makes no bones about his personal issues with the city!
So this is some conspiracy aimed at Toronto? : )
If you compare how Monocole gathers their list vs. Mercer and EI, you can see that much of the criteria is the same. Where Monocole differs is that it factors in culture strongly and modern amenities that a younger population of a city wants and demands.
This is why you see Japanese cities like Tokyo do well on the Monocole list and not Mercer or EI. Some people want to live in a more inspiring place, with tons of hustle and bustle day and night, in addition to being orderly, safe, etc....
I can't comment with any authority on the EI list, because I have never been to Australia nor New Zealand. As I said though, the Moncole list has many more places I would run to live in vs the EI list. You may not agree and that is fine.
It is just one list. These Journalists set their criteria and published a list, and based on the criteria these are the cities selected. It is kind of difficult to argue with the results, no matter what it is entitled.
If you do not like this list, there are quite a few others that do not mention Toronto in their Top 10 or 25. So just default back to one of those if it fits your views better.
Personally, give me the Monocle list. Tokyo, Copenhagen, Munich, Berlin, Hong Kong, Madrid, Paris, Barcelona....some of my favorites there.
But in no way am I going to argue with one list, plus how can you argue that Toronto is not a livable city? It is safe, clean, the economic centre of a prosperous G8 country, urban in a good way? Surely there are worse examples to follow out there on this earth.
Agreed. Nothing against Toronto, but cities like Berlin are just on another level. The large amount of public amenities, huge transit network, safe streets, not to mention VERY affordable housing and low living cost (food and alcohol are so so cheap compared to TO...). Take the U-Bahn or S-Bahn from anywhere in Berlin, and in 20 min you'd be in the middle of Brandenburg Gate, Reichstag, Holocaust Memorial, Deutsches Historisches Museum, countless art galleries... Take the S-Bahn 10 min east and you'd be in the middle of Alexanderplatz - center of former East Germany surrounded by statues of Karl Marx, grand 1950s boulevards, and imposing Soviet facades. What more can you ask on your free time...
I understand that Toronto is not really comparable to Berlin, due to different histories and development patterns. And frankly I don't think Toronto should try to become one of those European cities. To me, Toronto certainly has potential to become a modern Chicago or an NYC in its own right sometime in the future. Maybe start off with a better transit system and get those new streetcars rolling and not wait till 2017+...
Last edited by bostonkid123; 08-20-2014 at 07:37 AM..
Agreed. Nothing against Toronto, but cities like Berlin are just on another level. The large amount of public amenities, huge transit network, safe streets, not to mention VERY affordable housing and low living cost (food and alcohol are so so cheap compared to TO...). Take the U-Bahn or S-Bahn from anywhere in Berlin, and in 20 min you'd be in the middle of Brandenburg Gate, Reichstag, Holocaust Memorial, Deutsches Historisches Museum, countless art galleries... Take the S-Bahn 10 min east and you'd be in the middle of Alexanderplatz - center of former East Germany surrounded by statues of Karl Marx, grand 1950s boulevards, and imposing Soviet facades. What more can you ask on your free time...
I understand that Toronto is not really comparable to Berlin, due to different histories and development patterns. And frankly I don't think Toronto should try to become one of those European cities. To me, Toronto certainly has potential to become a modern Chicago or an NYC in its own right sometime in the future. Maybe start off with a better transit system and get those new streetcars rolling and not wait till 2017+...
Don't even get me started on Berlin man, love that city to death. My sister has lived there for about a decade and has no desire to leave, and I do not blame her one slight bit.
Cities like Berlin are a bit too edgy to finish in the Top 10 of most of these lists, despite having all the amenities needed to make a city truly livable. Same way mega cities like NYC, London, Paris, Tokyo and Hong Kong typically do not score well because they are much too large and intense.
Some folks crave edgy and intense though, thankfully these lists are just good for sh*ts and giggles and nothing much else.
Don't even get me started on Berlin man, love that city to death. My sister has lived there for about a decade and has no desire to leave, and I do not blame her one slight bit.
Cities like Berlin are a bit too edgy to finish in the Top 10 of most of these lists, despite having all the amenities needed to make a city truly livable. Same way mega cities like NYC, London, Paris, Tokyo and Hong Kong typically do not score well because they are much too large and intense.
Some folks crave edgy and intense though, thankfully these lists are just good for sh*ts and giggles and nothing much else.
Yea, Berlin is some next level stuff. It just doesn't seem like it could exist.
The odd thing is, I find Montreal to have a similar thing going but smaller in scale.
Don't even get me started on Berlin man, love that city to death. My sister has lived there for about a decade and has no desire to leave, and I do not blame her one slight bit.
Cities like Berlin are a bit too edgy to finish in the Top 10 of most of these lists, despite having all the amenities needed to make a city truly livable. Same way mega cities like NYC, London, Paris, Tokyo and Hong Kong typically do not score well because they are much too large and intense.
Some folks crave edgy and intense though, thankfully these lists are just good for sh*ts and giggles and nothing much else.
Same here. Studied at Freie Universitaet in Dahlem-Dorf and lived around Innsbruecker Platz S-Bahnhof near where JFK gave his "Ich bin ein Berliner" speech. Rent was only €600 for fully furnished, renovated 1 bed apartment in a beautiful 100-yr old building. Paradise for history/culture buffs.
Below is a system map of Berlin's public transit network. This map only includes subway (U-Bahn), suburban train (S-Bahn), and regional train service. Berlin also has a very extensive LRT not shown on here. Yep, love Berlin to death, don't get me started...
One thing I will say about Berlin's public transit - something that could be taken up by TTC - is that their single ride fares are higher. About $3.80 Canadian Dollars for 2 zones, and $4.66 CAD for all 3 zones in the network, one way. The city is also VERY strict about checking tickets. During my last visit, I was fined 40 Euros on the spot for forgetting to stamp my ticket at the ticket machine - even though I had just bought a brand new ticket. You literally have to follow transit regulations to the letter, regardless of whether you are a casual visitor or long-time resident. After fining me, the transit employees also stopped a rowdy group of tourists probably from America, and all hell broke lose because those guys put up a real fight. They have a zero-tolerance policy against "black riders" - Schwarzfahren.
Sorry Toronto for hijacking this thread. Now end of our Berlin rant.
Last edited by bostonkid123; 08-20-2014 at 09:04 AM..
Big, diverse and exciting does not necessarily equate to livable.
Toronto is big and diverse, yes. However it is overrated, terribly overpriced and falls somewhat short of exciting unless you happen to be a misplaced rube from rural Newfoundland.
If I didn't have to work here, I wouldn't waste my time coming here at all.
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