Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
This thread is silly. We've established that both Toyota FJ's and Jeep Wranglers make very good off roaders.....which is something that just about any serious automotive enthusiast already knows.
And there is the 20% of people who buy jeeps/trucks/4x4s and wheel them. Every jeep I see in my area is usually spotless with not even a scratch or spec of dirt on it. ( new models only the old ones are so beat who knows. I'm speaking only new not used market purchases)
It's no different than the guy who buys a f350 diesel 4x4 but never tows. The amount of people who buy 4x4s to actually wheel them is a industry average 15%. Some polls say 10 some say 20%. Supposedly 60% of jeep owners go off road and 80% of rubicon models go off road. But most people consider a dirt road or camping off road. I don't know many people who will buy a 45k jeep and go off road rubicon trail with it. In fact I know no people who will do that.Maybe second hand at 20k.
Most people simply do not go off road to the scale of the rubicon. I used to go off road a lot. But my off road was the typical go in the woods camping/hunting/fishing. In some cases I had to use 4wd. I have never done the Rubicon. I have gone on a lot of Forest trails in my smaller 85 4runner when I had it.
Isusu Amigo had the same problem. With the V6 it was actually pretty quick with lots of power and had a good frame unlike the remainder of the mini utes.
Fjs are okay but they do look like two different vehicles welded together to make one.
And there is the 20% of people who buy jeeps/trucks/4x4s and wheel them. Every jeep I see in my area is usually spotless with not even a scratch or spec of dirt on it. ( new models only the old ones are so beat who knows. I'm speaking only new not used market purchases)
It's no different than the guy who buys a f350 diesel 4x4 but never tows. The amount of people who buy 4x4s to actually wheel them is a industry average 15%. Some polls say 10 some say 20%. Supposedly 60% of jeep owners go off road and 80% of rubicon models go off road. But most people consider a dirt road or camping off road. I don't know many people who will buy a 45k jeep and go off road rubicon trail with it. In fact I know no people who will do that.Maybe second hand at 20k.
Most people simply do not go off road to the scale of the rubicon. I used to go off road a lot. But my off road was the typical go in the woods camping/hunting/fishing. In some cases I had to use 4wd. I have never done the Rubicon. I have gone on a lot of Forest trails in my smaller 85 4runner when I had it.
After seeing a chained up Suburban driving up an Alaska glacier river where we had been hard pressed to run ATV's, I realized that it's the driver, not the tool.
After seeing a chained up Suburban driving up an Alaska glacier river where we had been hard pressed to run ATV's, I realized that it's the driver, not the tool.
Pretty much. If you don't know what you're doing, it doesn't matter what you're driving.
And there is the 20% of people who buy jeeps/trucks/4x4s and wheel them. Every jeep I see in my area is usually spotless with not even a scratch or spec of dirt on it. ( new models only the old ones are so beat who knows. I'm speaking only new not used market purchases)
It's no different than the guy who buys a f350 diesel 4x4 but never tows. The amount of people who buy 4x4s to actually wheel them is a industry average 15%. Some polls say 10 some say 20%. Supposedly 60% of jeep owners go off road and 80% of rubicon models go off road. But most people consider a dirt road or camping off road. I don't know many people who will buy a 45k jeep and go off road rubicon trail with it. In fact I know no people who will do that.Maybe second hand at 20k.
Most people simply do not go off road to the scale of the rubicon. I used to go off road a lot. But my off road was the typical go in the woods camping/hunting/fishing. In some cases I had to use 4wd. I have never done the Rubicon. I have gone on a lot of Forest trails in my smaller 85 4runner when I had it.
Even the most ardent off-roader's vehicle spends most of its time on the pavement. It's true that most 4WD buyers these days are "strip mall" 4-wheelers who wouldn't know how to drive their vehicle on a true backcountry trail if their lives depended on it. That is the reason that most current 4WD's sold in the US have been "wussed out" to the point that they are not really backcountry capable without at least some aftermarket modification. That didn't used to be true, but it sure is now.
There are a few SUV's that still are backcountry capable--the FJ and Rubicon are two, for example. The other end of the backcountry capable size spectrum is the 3/4 ton and up 4WD pickups. That is why many fleet users whose vehicles see rough use on unimproved roads or trails are opting for them instead of 1/2 ton trucks. The 3/4 ton diesel 4WD pickup that I use for my work (which does involve driving on some pretty awful backcountry trails on occasion) I seldom use for towing a trailer, but the frame, powertrain, and suspension components are designed to withstand off-road use (especially while carrying a load) must better than a lighter-duty half-ton pickup. With the diesel engine, it also gets as good or often better fuel economy than a gas half-ton and doesn't strain itself a bit hauling a load or at high altitude.
Even the most ardent off-roader's vehicle spends most of its time on the pavement. It's true that most 4WD buyers these days are "strip mall" 4-wheelers who wouldn't know how to drive their vehicle on a true backcountry trail if their lives depended on it. That is the reason that most current 4WD's sold in the US have been "wussed out" to the point that they are not really backcountry capable without at least some aftermarket modification. That didn't used to be true, but it sure is now.
There are a few SUV's that still are backcountry capable--the FJ and Rubicon are two, for example. The other end of the backcountry capable size spectrum is the 3/4 ton and up 4WD pickups. That is why many fleet users whose vehicles see rough use on unimproved roads or trails are opting for them instead of 1/2 ton trucks. The 3/4 ton diesel 4WD pickup that I use for my work (which does involve driving on some pretty awful backcountry trails on occasion) I seldom use for towing a trailer, but the frame, powertrain, and suspension components are designed to withstand off-road use (especially while carrying a load) must better than a lighter-duty half-ton pickup. With the diesel engine, it also gets as good or often better fuel economy than a gas half-ton and doesn't strain itself a bit hauling a load or at high altitude.
I drive a 7.3 diesel f250. Its a 99. Main issue with it is its freaking long and I can't take it on tight trails. My off road consists of wooded trails and muddy dirt roads and I get pin striping on it some areas where I go hunting I have desert type of terrain. But nothing wild like the rubicon. It would never do the rubicon with this truck. It's not set up for that type of off road.
My wife has a actually fairly capable 4x4 ( from reviews I read) but it has never been used off road. It has not even seen a dirt road. It's never towed a trailer or been raced or abused. Once in a while when its raining I throw it in 4 hi and drive it down the street just to make sure 4x engages. But its a mall X 4. I offered to take it hunting once. She laughed at me. We bought it because the 2wd was not much cheaper and I usually get her hand me down vehicle when we buy a new one.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
