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Old 07-26-2011, 12:27 PM
 
1,324 posts, read 2,059,578 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wheelsup View Post
What a well thought out rational argument. However you fail to realize that the fast food industry is nothing like the airline industry.

For starters, and the biggest distinction, is the airlines deal in a perishable product. When that flight pushes, that is it, it's gone. Fast food, on the other hand, stores their food in the freezer and uses it when needed. You might point to other industries that deal in perishable products, like say concert sales. Have you looked at how much money an average concert nets?

When I worked at Pizza Hut, a medium pan supreme pizza cost the company $3.25 in costs to make, everything from materials to labor to the gas used to cook it. That pizza was sold for $10.99, a markup of over 300%. Airlines profit margin is in the neighborhood of 3%-5% (in a good year). Even the contract carriers are limited to a 5%-10% profit.

Capital investments. A fast food joint can be started for a couple hundred thousand dollars and run by a handful of people, 3-4 plus a general manager. An airline? Just one aircraft is in the tens of millions. Then you have pilots, dispatchers, mechanics, flight attendents, gate agents, ramp agents, cleaners, parts department clerks, HR, ticket sales, and general office staff that keeps track of training requirements etc. In short, it's expensive.

Just some small reasons why you can't compare one industry to another...
Great Rebuttal. I think people have an unrealistic expectation of airlines, whether they see vintage footage of yesteryear and expect the same amenities, or just assume the airline is fully responsible for everything that goes wrong in a flight.

A couple more reasons to add to your points above

> Unlike fast food, an airlines key metric of on-time arrival/departure can be controlled by forces outside their control: weather, gate availability, airspace traffic
> Airlines are more service oriented than fast food, which is product oriented. You can stored unused patty and use it the next day. An empty seat on a plane is immediate lost revenue.
> Because there is more logistics involved in switching a flight to a different time/city, than it is to add/remove a pickle.
> Operating an airplane requires specific skillset and significant training, than frying french fries
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Old 07-27-2011, 09:39 AM
 
1,461 posts, read 1,289,327 times
Reputation: 790
Here are a few examples of why the industry and its employees are not respected.
1) Detroit airport - elderly man's flight is canceled - he is left alone and wanders about until a traveler helps him while airline personnel walk by.
2) Pittsburg - elderly passenger being pushed in wheelchair by airline employee - employee pushes chair and lets go, lets him ride uncontolled a few feet and does it repeatedly
3) Chicago - passenger breaks down crying on floor after flight canceled. Airline employees step over him.
4) Denver, same as #3
5) Las Vegas, flight on runway for three hours, one free drink. Flight arrives in Philly around 1 am. No one to greet passengers or tell them what to do. They sleep on the floor. Included is this one is an elderly passenger who is related to me.
6) Luggage does not arrive with me. One day later the airline calls they have my bag. They won't deliver it. I go the airport. It is ruined. Have to drive back a month later to get a replacement bag. They could have delivered it on a shuttle van.
7) Denver - heavy man sits in a row of chairs at the end, no one else in the row, the row lifts from the floor - he is the ballast at the bottom. Passengers have to help him while airline personnel walk by.
Just a few observations from an infrequent flyer. I know there are a lot worse stories.
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Old 07-27-2011, 02:59 PM
 
Location: Viña del Mar, Chile
16,411 posts, read 26,282,342 times
Reputation: 16497
Quote:
Originally Posted by newhandle View Post
5) Las Vegas, flight on runway for three hours, one free drink. Flight arrives in Philly around 1 am. No one to greet passengers or tell them what to do. They sleep on the floor. Included is this one is an elderly passenger who is related to me.

I stayed at a hotel and had pretty terrible service not too long ago.. It was near death actually, I was starved and laying on the ground, in a near death situation.


The reason was because there was no guidance from a hotel employee to explain that I should go out the exit door to leave, and also nobody to tell me that I should eat.
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Old 07-27-2011, 03:36 PM
 
2,065 posts, read 4,186,600 times
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If low cost flights are the excuse for awful service, someone in the industry should draw the line somewhere imo.

Considering the quality of the service most (not all!) employees provide - from the moment one calls for reservations to the moment one leaves the airplane - tickets should be much cheaper; just pay for gas, maintenance, and the pilot himself.

Paying cheap or not, passengers are people, and everyone should be treated with respect.
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Old 07-27-2011, 04:46 PM
 
4,919 posts, read 19,896,013 times
Reputation: 6217
Quote:
Originally Posted by Miaiam View Post
If low cost flights are the excuse for awful service, someone in the industry should draw the line somewhere imo.

Considering the quality of the service most (not all!) employees provide - from the moment one calls for reservations to the moment one leaves the airplane - tickets should be much cheaper; just pay for gas, maintenance, and the pilot himself.

Paying cheap or not, passengers are people, and everyone should be treated with respect.
But thats the problem, you are getting the level of service your paying for. People want low cost, they get low service! Airline tickets are cheap and the level of service your getting is a reflection of the price. If you want better service, stop complaining and whinning when the airlines raise ticket prices to cover that better service.

But since people buy based on cost and not service, I don't see why they expect more. Currently your paying prices as if shipping at WalMart so don't expect Neiman Marcus service.
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Old 07-27-2011, 06:15 PM
 
1,461 posts, read 1,289,327 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PacificFlights View Post
But thats the problem, you are getting the level of service your paying for. People want low cost, they get low service! Airline tickets are cheap and the level of service your getting is a reflection of the price. If you want better service, stop complaining and whinning when the airlines raise ticket prices to cover that better service.

But since people buy based on cost and not service, I don't see why they expect more. Currently your paying prices as if shipping at WalMart so don't expect Neiman Marcus service.
I would pay more instead of being treated as if I was in a group of cattle. I am sure others are now like me, if it is within a day's drive, the car or rail is the way to go.
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Old 07-27-2011, 06:51 PM
 
Location: The Raider Nation._ Our band kicks brass
1,854 posts, read 8,752,582 times
Reputation: 2310
The majority of our fleet has 8 first class seats, and roughly 150 coach seats. That's because out of all of those people going to one place, we can barely find 8 people that are willing to pay more for better service.

If people were truly willing to pay more, and not just give lip service, half the plane would be first class.
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Old 07-27-2011, 11:08 PM
 
Location: Viña del Mar, Chile
16,411 posts, read 26,282,342 times
Reputation: 16497
Quote:
Originally Posted by newhandle View Post
I would pay more instead of being treated as if I was in a group of cattle. I am sure others are now like me, if it is within a day's drive, the car or rail is the way to go.
Speak for yourself, go buy a first class ticket but don't push to make prices higher for the rest of us who aren't here to complain!
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Old 07-28-2011, 06:33 AM
 
1,461 posts, read 1,289,327 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by burgler09 View Post
Speak for yourself, go buy a first class ticket but don't push to make prices higher for the rest of us who aren't here to complain!
I am not complaining, just making observations on rudeness, incompetence and alternatives.
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Old 07-28-2011, 09:39 AM
 
Location: Colorado
4,308 posts, read 11,821,870 times
Reputation: 4425
Quote:
Originally Posted by PacificFlights View Post
But thats the problem, you are getting the level of service your paying for. People want low cost, they get low service! Airline tickets are cheap and the level of service your getting is a reflection of the price. If you want better service, stop complaining and whinning when the airlines raise ticket prices to cover that better service.

But since people buy based on cost and not service, I don't see why they expect more. Currently your paying prices as if shipping at WalMart so don't expect Neiman Marcus service.
So you're saying because people can't afford to pay for first class they deserve to be treated like cattle?! That the airline industry is perfectly right to despise and ignore the MILLIONS of people paying the basic cost simply because they are being frugal or because they are business travellers whose company won't allow them to buy a more expensive seat?! WTF?
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