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Old 06-18-2015, 01:13 PM
 
Location: SW Florida
9,766 posts, read 7,050,021 times
Reputation: 14300

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lacerta View Post
It is just so hard to draw the line somewhere. For example: I'm about 100 pounds overweight. But I fit decently fine into a regular airline seat (I don't even extend the existing seatbelt all the way, let alone need an extension), and I wear the smallest womens' plus size. If I was 10 pounds lighter, I could fit into non-plus size clothing. I just carry my weight differently than some others. I'm smaller around than some people who weigh 50 pounds less than me.

My husband, on the other hand, is fairly slim, so we buy 2 tickets and I just encroach a little tiny bit on his space. But he is 6'5" and a lot of that is legs, so he almost always has his knees in the back of the seat in front of him, so they cannot recline. So should he have to buy a second ticket for the seat in front of him? It is a slippery slope.

If it was a perfect world, they'd put obese people 2 for every 3 seats, and put tall people in the seat behind the middle of those, since no one would need to recline that one (they could charge all three of these people for 1/3 of the empty seat). Or better yet, make the seats further apart and wider. But it isn't a perfect world.
But then the airlines couldn't cram so many paying passengers in those spaces, and they might lose a little revenue. Can't have that, doncha know?

I've sat next to people who were considerably overweight, and who could have easily encroached into my space, and yet they didn't do so. I think it must have taken quite a bit of effort on their part as they "sucked it in" somehow. They kept their arms more or less in front of them and their shoulders sort of hunched up somehow, and I don't know what else. I think doing this must have been uncomfortable for them, but I must say I appreciated their consideration.
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Old 06-18-2015, 02:59 PM
 
4,445 posts, read 3,536,542 times
Reputation: 5304
Quote:
Originally Posted by annerk View Post
An "emotional obese person is cursing out your ticket agents and creating a very uncomfortable scene for everyone" should not be allowed to fly. Period.
You know as well as me the airlines will NOT take that hard stance. It's nice to post on a message board but no airline would ever kick off an obese paying customer because they didn't purchase two tickets to accommodate their girth.

I'm not telling you what's right or wrong. Just talking about reality. You think any airlines are going to take that PR hit. Especially with viral videos these days.

Airlines will just smile and move on. Keep the customers happy.

It's easier to deal with a customer who has to sit next to said obese customer than dealing with an awkward situation with the actual obese customer.

Which scenario do you think the airline would choose:

1) Inform obese passenger that due to their girth they are required to purchase two seats or risk not getting on the flight. Or even worse telling them the flight is full and since they are too large to fit in one seat they will have to wait until the next flight.

2) Let obese passenger sit and see if any other paying customers complain about the situation. If not smile and move on. If so, quietly give complaining customer a perk such as discount or free upgrades on future flight.

99/100 airlines will pick #2

Most people are sympathetic to obese passengers and usually grin and bear it. They will protest silently or anonymously on message boards such as these. if they complain they'll get a perk and move on.

Airlines know how the human mind works. Even on these boards I have not heard many if any people post that they actively spoke up directly towards offending obese passenger. They understand the situation and don't want to make a bad situation worse and understandably sensitive to the obese passengers position.

They will quietly complain to a flight attendant or directly with the airline.
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Old 06-18-2015, 03:11 PM
 
26,590 posts, read 54,627,330 times
Reputation: 13019
Quote:
Originally Posted by IShootNikon View Post
You know as well as me the airlines will NOT take that hard stance. It's nice to post on a message board but no airline would ever kick off an obese paying customer because they didn't purchase two tickets to accommodate their girth.

I'm not telling you what's right or wrong. Just talking about reality. You think any airlines are going to take that PR hit. Especially with viral videos these days.

Airlines will just smile and move on. Keep the customers happy.

It's easier to deal with a customer who has to sit next to said obese customer than dealing with an awkward situation with the actual obese customer.

Which scenario do you think the airline would choose:

1) Inform obese passenger that due to their girth they are required to purchase two seats or risk not getting on the flight. Or even worse telling them the flight is full and since they are too large to fit in one seat they will have to wait until the next flight.

2) Let obese passenger sit and see if any other paying customers complain about the situation. If not smile and move on. If so, quietly give complaining customer a perk such as discount or free upgrades on future flight.

99/100 airlines will pick #2

Most people are sympathetic to obese passengers and usually grin and bear it. They will protest silently or anonymously on message boards such as these. if they complain they'll get a perk and move on.

Airlines know how the human mind works. Even on these boards I have not heard many if any people post that they actively spoke up directly towards offending obese passenger. They understand the situation and don't want to make a bad situation worse and understandably sensitive to the obese passengers position.

They will quietly complain to a flight attendant or directly with the airline.
Actually they can and do. First they will ask for volunteers, but if no one does, the obese person is offloaded. It DOES happen. I've SEEN it happen.

Passengers are becoming increasingly vocal and intolerant of having their space encroached upon. It's only going to get worse as we get fatter and people get less tolerant of giving up the space they paid for.
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Old 06-18-2015, 04:09 PM
 
563 posts, read 385,149 times
Reputation: 1158
Default It is so obivious, it hurts

Quote:
Originally Posted by botticelli View Post
This topic has been beaten to death.

And I will reiterate my position: you pay the same, you get the same. Whether you are 300 pounds, or 6'6'', or 9 month pregnant, or have terminal cancer, it is all irrelevant. The airlines are not in the business of charity. You want more, please pay for it.

Mod cut.
I could not agree more! Well said.
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Old 06-18-2015, 09:38 PM
 
8,980 posts, read 8,120,601 times
Reputation: 19502
Quote:
A normal weight for a 6'2" man is around 180. You're "overweight".
Not the real world. The U.S. Army has a chart that is realistic for people of different weight at different ages. I weighed exactly what the Army (and Navy) are looking for when I finished Boot Camp in December 1950 in peak physical condition. I was 200 pounds then as I am now. The 180 pound weight would be for someone with a very slight build. If a man of my size is normal, and long bodied as I am which adds to the weight weighed 180 pounds we would be sickly and weak looking. I am quite a little under what is normal for a man my age 84. I have a strong muscular build, not fat. In fact my bone mass tests, put me in the top category with extra strong and large bones that add to the weight.

Quote:
If you take up two seats, you should pay for two seats. It isn't up to the airline to take the loss. It isn't up to a passenger to render half of his seat to an obese flyer. If you can't fit in one seat, drive or take the train.
If a person is tall and in top health, why should they pay more because an airline decided to reduce the seat size by 1/3rd to load on more passengers? Why should I be expected to pay twice what a short 5 ft man pays? I have no more control over being tall than he had being short. In other words, why should a tall man have to pay more to sit in an airplane, than some little half pint shrimp. My cardiologist put me onto the following chart for weight to height and says that the medical world considers this an excellent guide to health.

U.S. Army Height/Weight Chart - Males

Quote:
Airlines bear no responsibility of making you overweight people comfortable. if you don't like the comfort level, don't do business with them. There are still billions of people of regular size that find the seats completely fine. The problem really is some people can't afford the price of the service they require, and whine about it.
Again tall people often need more room not only in height, but width. At the same width as a short person in proportion to their height without being obese they still need more room to sit than a short person. I used to work with a young man that was 5 ft even tall. He could dress well in the boy's (not men's) department for half of what the rest of us paid for our clothes. He had to buy in the boy's department as he was not big enough to even buy clothes in the men's department. His wife was 4'10" tall. She had to buy her clothes in the young teen girls department. They were both perfectly formed and very good looking people and made a great looking couple till they got around normal size people. Then they looked like a couple of young kids playing dress up.

Quote:
If you don't like the crammed space, you don't have to take their flights. It is that simple. If you need more space, buy two seats, or upgrade to first class. If you say "who can afford that"? Well, too bad, air travel is not a human right, but rather a luxury products. Billions of people in the world can't afford to fly. If you can't afford it, then don't travel, problem solved!
On the other hand, if a person is tall and due to being normal build in relation to their height, why should they have to pay a premium to be able to travel? Or do you think being small should be able to travel for half what tall people pay. Boy is that discrimination. I grew up in an area of California where there were two sizes of people. Italians mostly short who ran dairies. Scandinavian (which I am), with most men 6 foot plus. They considered each other to be equal as human beings. If one was overweight, it was normally the short people. The tall people were like me, with very few overweight. But some people think that half the population in the area, should pay extra to fly, because of their heritage that gave them height.
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Old 06-18-2015, 09:54 PM
 
Location: BC, Arizona
1,170 posts, read 795,763 times
Reputation: 2377
Quote:
Originally Posted by oldtrader View Post
Not the real world. The U.S. Army has a chart that is realistic for people of different weight at different ages. I weighed exactly what the Army (and Navy) are looking for when I finished Boot Camp in December 1950 in peak physical condition. I was 200 pounds then as I am now. The 180 pound weight would be for someone with a very slight build. If a man of my size is normal, and long bodied as I am which adds to the weight weighed 180 pounds we would be sickly and weak looking. I am quite a little under what is normal for a man my age 84. I have a strong muscular build, not fat. In fact my bone mass tests, put me in the top category with extra strong and large bones that add to the weight.



If a person is tall and in top health, why should they pay more because an airline decided to reduce the seat size by 1/3rd to load on more passengers? Why should I be expected to pay twice what a short 5 ft man pays? I have no more control over being tall than he had being short. In other words, why should a tall man have to pay more to sit in an airplane, than some little half pint shrimp. My cardiologist put me onto the following chart for weight to height and says that the medical world considers this an excellent guide to health.

U.S. Army Height/Weight Chart - Males



Again tall people often need more room not only in height, but width. At the same width as a short person in proportion to their height without being obese they still need more room to sit than a short person. I used to work with a young man that was 5 ft even tall. He could dress well in the boy's (not men's) department for half of what the rest of us paid for our clothes. He had to buy in the boy's department as he was not big enough to even buy clothes in the men's department. His wife was 4'10" tall. She had to buy her clothes in the young teen girls department. They were both perfectly formed and very good looking people and made a great looking couple till they got around normal size people. Then they looked like a couple of young kids playing dress up.



On the other hand, if a person is tall and due to being normal build in relation to their height, why should they have to pay a premium to be able to travel? Or do you think being small should be able to travel for half what tall people pay. Boy is that discrimination. I grew up in an area of California where there were two sizes of people. Italians mostly short who ran dairies. Scandinavian (which I am), with most men 6 foot plus. They considered each other to be equal as human beings. If one was overweight, it was normally the short people. The tall people were like me, with very few overweight. But some people think that half the population in the area, should pay extra to fly, because of their heritage that gave them height.
So you think it's fair to encroach on your neighbor's space - their comfort is less important than yours?
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Old 06-18-2015, 10:07 PM
 
Location: Georgia, USA
23,440 posts, read 28,306,241 times
Reputation: 29041
Quote:
Originally Posted by AnesthesiaMD View Post
Thats not a bad idea, but you do lose the arm rest. And you wouldn't want them to go too high or else the middle person may start feeling a bit claustrophobic on long flights.
Keep elbows in their place with My Plane Space - My Plane Space

Share an armrest with the middle seat:

Soarigami: The end of armrest wars on planes? | Daily Mail Online
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Old 06-18-2015, 10:12 PM
 
Location: BC, Arizona
1,170 posts, read 795,763 times
Reputation: 2377
LOVE that video!!!
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Old 06-18-2015, 11:54 PM
 
Location: California
657 posts, read 488,341 times
Reputation: 965
As someone who's a fairly avid weight lifter I find this a bit intriguing. While I've never had an issue with my waist spilling into other people's space I've had issues where my shoulders have pushed into other individual's arm rests and seats. How do we deal with this? I feel like seats could be slightly better.

I'm 5' 9.5'' and 182 lbs with a 33 inch waist. So I'm not massive, but I still find my shoulders to be a problem.
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Old 06-19-2015, 01:14 AM
 
8,980 posts, read 8,120,601 times
Reputation: 19502
Quote:
So you think it's fair to encroach on your neighbor's space - their comfort is less important than yours?
The only reason that a tall person like myself, may encroach on a neighbors space, is a problem caused by the airlines, when they reduced the width of seats to put more seats on the plane. And small people get angry that they cannot lean their seats back, as our knees are in the way. A result due to the airlines reducing the distance between seats.

It is not my fault the airlines did this, and I should have the same rights to fly as the short person.

The corporations only look out for medium to small people. They ignore the taller people in this country.

Airlines make too small seats to add more passengers in a plane. Auto makers do not put enough height in the typical automobiles for a tall person (and 6'2" is not overly tall) to be able to sit up or even get into most cars. For this reason since the 1970s, I have always had to drive large expensive cars, pickups, and mid size to large SUVs. Fuel efficient cars are the worst, as they lower the roof line to decrease the wind resistance, and get better mileage.

When I go car shopping I feel like they make cars for midgets. You cannot drive, with your head bent over and your head against the roof of the car. I always wanted a nice sports car like a Porch which I could afford very easily, but there was never one with head room. John Wayne the actor was known to always drive station wagons, and had the roof raised about 5" so he could sit up in one for that reason.

You have to special order a living room chair to fit you. In my younger days I spent 10 years in the furniture business so I know and have had many men over 5'10" tall having the same problem.
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