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Old 04-19-2009, 06:39 PM
 
11,933 posts, read 21,523,778 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tande1n5 View Post

Actually, even JetBlue flies some "horrid 2x2's", the Embraer E-Jets (so does United).
United doesn't operate E-jets, the smallest plane they have on their certificate is the 737/A320. Republic operates some EMB-170s as United Express however.
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Old 04-19-2009, 07:52 PM
 
Location: Some place very cold
5,500 posts, read 20,064,328 times
Reputation: 4220
One time I had to move my seat because the man next to me was so big that he was spilling over onto me. But the airline had extra seats, so I don't see why they should charge him.

The worst thing on airlines is sitting next to and having to endure a loud obnoxious child. Maybe they should charge extra for that.
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Old 04-19-2009, 08:02 PM
 
8,240 posts, read 15,247,501 times
Reputation: 3679
I would never call anyone by an insulting name, but come on. Facts are facts. If you weigh significantly more than most people, you should have to pay more. Just like if your bags are heavier than others. It's common sense.
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Old 04-19-2009, 09:51 PM
 
2,639 posts, read 5,217,438 times
Reputation: 2352
Quote:
Originally Posted by wheelsup View Post
Many airlines have tried that, none are still operating at this time. In other words, your idea is a flop, customers won't pay for it.

The public wanted deregulation. The public wanted discount carriers. The public wanted cheap airfare. So be it. Destinations will continue to get cut over the next decade as well, leaving small towns high and dry for air travel.
Two of you said the same thing.

I am not talking about large seats on a plane with small seats. I am talking about an alternate flight where there are nothing but executive level seats at a REASONABLE price.

What the airlines tried before is this whole notion of "First/Business/Executive/Priority Class". I don't want a classification. I want a whole airline that is just bonafide comfortable and roomy. And the price should be reasonable - they charge 2 grand for those class seats. 2 grand = too much for a plane ride.

When I book a flight I look for the plane that offers the best features. Sometimes that results in a more expensive flight, but so what? I care to be comfortable. Part of the reason I choose Southwest more often than not (JetBlue doesn't have enough destinations). Southwest has no "Class" type seating, and if you get a seat near the front of the plane, the seats are just fine, with no ripoff pricing.
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Old 04-19-2009, 10:45 PM
 
Location: Mission Viejo, CA
2,498 posts, read 10,288,860 times
Reputation: 1598
Quote:
Originally Posted by revelated View Post
Two of you said the same thing.

I am not talking about large seats on a plane with small seats. I am talking about an alternate flight where there are nothing but executive level seats at a REASONABLE price.

This is exactly what Eos Airlines, Silverjet, Max Jet, L'Avion, etc.... where: All executive level seating airlines that charged lower fares and they all failed. They were one class airlines of all executive class with bigger seats, just like Southwest is a one class airline of all regular economy seating.

Here is a sample Silverjet seat that offered everything you wanted: All executive class seating, low fares, food, snacks, and IFE. But the business model failed because the ticket prices needed to be higher to cover the reduced seating.
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Old 04-19-2009, 11:02 PM
 
2,639 posts, read 5,217,438 times
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What you're not getting is this.

They tried it BACK THEN. Back in the days when yes, the cost of the features and whatnot were so high as to make it necessary to overcharge. Depreciation has occurred. What used to cost $1,000 now can be had for a couple hundred bucks. In fact, if you took the seats Southwest is using, and simply removed every other row, then move all of the seats back half a row, you'd be fine. Bring back meals - use Meals on Wheels, cost maybe $6 per customer - not that much of an increase to the ticket price.

I know what you'll say. "But then less people could fly!!1" Yes, exactly. Less people = less noise = more comfort. Then just commission a few extra planes. Keep the majority of the planes the whole sardine can type of plane where you cram as many people as possible in, but have maybe 4-5 planes whose sole purpose is to provide the most comfortable experience. No need to increase ticket fares but maybe $50 per customer.

It CAN be done. This isn't the 80's. Prices are a lot lower on surplus parts now.
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Old 04-19-2009, 11:37 PM
 
Location: Mission Viejo, CA
2,498 posts, read 10,288,860 times
Reputation: 1598
Quote:
Originally Posted by revelated View Post

This isn't the 80's. Prices are a lot lower on surplus parts now.
They weren't from the 80's.

Silverjet: Founded 2006, dead 2008
Eos Airlines: Founded 2004, dead 2008
MaxJet: Founded 2003, dead 2007
L'Avion: Founded 2006, Merged into Open Skies 2009

You might want to read some articles why all premium/executive/what ever you want to call it airlines fail:

Why All-Business-Class Fails - Business Travel Column - Joe Brancatelli - Seat 2B - Portfolio.com
Why niche airlines fail (http://www.travolution.co.uk/blog/2009/03/why-niche-airlines-fail.php - broken link)
Rise and fall of all-business class airlines
WalesOnline - Business - Columnists - Business class is bad business

I don't think you will find many articles [if any] supporting the need for all executive class airlines. People are paid to think and research these types of things and if there was a market, it would be served. Every time someone tries to serve the niche, the airline dies.
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Old 04-20-2009, 05:10 AM
 
Location: Norwood, MN
1,828 posts, read 3,360,180 times
Reputation: 881
Quote:
Originally Posted by Asheville Native View Post
Absolutely, I got stuck beside some stinking fat sweating slob that wanted a portion of my seat to spread out his more than ample butt. The arm rest stayed down, and his fat butt didn't encroach on my seat. He wasn't happy, but I I had an air gap between me an this sweating fat slob.

Had the air crew told me that armrest must remain up to accommodate him, I would have demanded a different seat, but plane was full, or I'll just get off and catch another flight, I will not be plaster to the side of this slob for 2+ hours. To really make things worse, the flight originated from Tampa in the summer, he was soaking wet from sweat.
Wow, I sense you are one of these kindly people that is just full of compassion.
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Old 04-20-2009, 12:20 PM
 
812 posts, read 3,583,505 times
Reputation: 370
Quote:
Originally Posted by wheelsup View Post
United doesn't operate E-jets, the smallest plane they have on their certificate is the 737/A320. Republic operates some EMB-170s as United Express however.
Right. I was just in the middle of making another complicated point and trying to glaze over having to explain that since most people see UEX=UAL to begin with, but it's certainly true.
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Old 04-20-2009, 07:40 PM
 
2,639 posts, read 5,217,438 times
Reputation: 2352
Quote:
Originally Posted by missionhome View Post
They weren't from the 80's.

Silverjet: Founded 2006, dead 2008
Eos Airlines: Founded 2004, dead 2008
MaxJet: Founded 2003, dead 2007
L'Avion: Founded 2006, Merged into Open Skies 2009

You might want to read some articles why all premium/executive/what ever you want to call it airlines fail:

Why All-Business-Class Fails - Business Travel Column - Joe Brancatelli - Seat 2B - Portfolio.com
Why niche airlines fail (http://www.travolution.co.uk/blog/2009/03/why-niche-airlines-fail.php - broken link)
Rise and fall of all-business class airlines
WalesOnline - Business - Columnists - Business class is bad business

I don't think you will find many articles [if any] supporting the need for all executive class airlines. People are paid to think and research these types of things and if there was a market, it would be served. Every time someone tries to serve the niche, the airline dies.
Look at the articles you posted. They all talk about sky high gas prices. Gas prices aren't sky high anymore.

Then they go on to talk about poor distribution. I addressed that already. It shouldn't be "business" class. It should just be a premium service, priced right for anyone who wants a better level of flight service. The problem is the airlines want to price it way too high.

Things will fail if you price them too high. They won't fail if you price them fairly.

I repeat what I said before. If a well known airline like Southwest created such a flight AND it was priced reasonably for what you get - $400-$500 over "economy" flights - people would eat it up. Charging 500% more than economy is what caused those others to fail. Also, pricing based on features that no longer apply, caused them to fail. You notice that airlines aren't dropping the baggage check fees or the rate hikes now that gas prices are down - know why? Because they know they can get away with it.
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