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Old 07-08-2011, 03:29 PM
 
288 posts, read 133,713 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jasper12 View Post
Completely opposite experience from Morgain, you can't "know" what a sociopath is "like" by seeing the person on tv. Review information from people who know the person, past behavior of person, work history, school history, a complete psycho-social picture emerges. I would not diagnose Casey Anthony, but I have worked with many young people like her, based on her psycho-social history that is available. Also revealing are her notes to her BFF in jail.

Also note, there is a huge difference between male sociopathic behavior, and female sociopathic behavior.
The elements you list as being necessary to diagnose someone as a sociopath/psychopath is accurate, IMO. What I"m saying is that those people talking in the media and calling her those names do not have access to that information. No one is releasing any positive information which they may have discovered from talking to people in her past. Her school teachers from the time she started school until she quit should have been interviewed, as well as friends and co-workers over the years. I haven't seen any indication that an unbiased investigation like that has taken place. Work history.....she did work for awhile.....I haven't heard anything from the people who worked with her there. The investigation of her psycho-social history is very, very incomplete. There should have been an investigation of her medical history, a neuropsych to determine if there is any brain damage, etc., as well as an investigation into the sexual abuse claims and the verbal abuse by her mother claims. Her former boyfriend and his father are the only people I've seen so far that HLN has allowed to speak out , and the boyfriend's father's description of her, IMO, indicates she is not a sociopath. ALL sociopaths are not murderers, btw.

ALL of the above things would have been brought out from credible sources and investigations during the penalty phase if she had been convicted of capital murder. Mental health experts would have examined her, would have had access to all the information discovered thru investigation of her friends, school history, and co-workers, etc. Then a diagnosis would have been made.

 
Old 07-08-2011, 03:42 PM
 
Location: Nassau, Long Island, NY
16,408 posts, read 28,889,976 times
Reputation: 7268
Quote:
Originally Posted by Morgain View Post
The elements you list as being necessary to diagnose someone as a sociopath/psychopath is accurate, IMO. What I"m saying is that those people talking in the media and calling her those names do not have access to that information. No one is releasing any positive information which they may have discovered from talking to people in her past. Her school teachers from the time she started school until she quit should have been interviewed, as well as friends and co-workers over the years. I haven't seen any indication that an unbiased investigation like that has taken place. Work history.....she did work for awhile.....I haven't heard anything from the people who worked with her there. The investigation of her psycho-social history is very, very incomplete. There should have been an investigation of her medical history, a neuropsych to determine if there is any brain damage, etc., as well as an investigation into the sexual abuse claims and the verbal abuse by her mother claims. Her former boyfriend and his father are the only people I've seen so far that HLN has allowed to speak out , and the boyfriend's father's description of her, IMO, indicates she is not a sociopath. ALL sociopaths are not murderers, btw.

ALL of the above things would have been brought out from credible sources and investigations during the penalty phase if she had been convicted of capital murder. Mental health experts would have examined her, would have had access to all the information discovered thru investigation of her friends, school history, and co-workers, etc. Then a diagnosis would have been made.
I am sure CA has been thoroughly examined but there are medical privacy laws, so if you are waiting for everything you mention in your post to be disclosed to the public at large, you will be waiting a long time.

The former BF and his father are some of the few people to say anything positive about her. I don't think HLN has control to stop anyone else who wants to come out to the media at large and defend CA.

So what diagnosis did the boyfriend and the father make? "Not a sociopath!" What is their expertise in that you trust them so much or do you like them because they said positive things about CA? As for his father's statements which you are putting so much creedence into, his son was only a couple with CA for SIX SHORT MONTHS, so really how well do you think this man knew CA or how much time do you think he really spent with her? If he described her as "insecure," how big of a conversation do you think they had on the occasions they met? A description of insecure tends to conjure up a quiet little mouse.

You accuse everyone else of grasping at straws if they call her a sociopath, but really you are doing the same feeble "grasping" except your "diagnosis" is that she's NOT a sociopath. At this point, none of us really know the truth, but you can tell from someone's actions and behaviors WHAT they are and IMO her actions and behaviors go more towards the sociopathic and troubled side than not.

Last edited by I_Love_LI_but; 07-08-2011 at 03:53 PM..
 
Old 07-08-2011, 03:52 PM
 
Location: Nassau, Long Island, NY
16,408 posts, read 28,889,976 times
Reputation: 7268
Quote:
Originally Posted by Morgain View Post
Well, I'm certainly speculating about all of this, too. However, I am basing some of my opinion on the interview I heard with the father of her former boyfriend. He said Casey spent a lot of time at their house over the span of about six months. He said he thought that she was very insecure in the sense that she wanted to "belong" and to please people. He and the former boyfriend said that what they were seeing on TV during the trial was not typical of her. The boyfriend also said that the mother, Cindy, verbally abused Casey in front of him. Plus all this talk about her being a sociopath/psychopath has been coming from very, very biased sources, IMO.

I have actually met real honest to god sociopaths/psychopaths through my work, and I don't see those characteristics in her. Those people are often extremely charming but ultimately they don't care what anyone thinks of them. That's not true of Casey Anthony. I don't hear anybody describing Casey Anthony as very charming. Charming people are well liked by others. IMO, Casey has very low self-esteem.

Also keep in mind that she has been in isolation for about three years, and that she surely must have had advice regarding how she should behave in court. Her defense team would have been remiss if they didn't discuss that issue with her. So what you're see from Casey now is sheer relief and joy that she is not headed to death row. Think about it. Wouldn't you be pretty happy to have that trial behind you and to know that you were not going to be executed by the state at some point. I see her as a very young woman behaving like a young woman who may very well have been sexually abused at a young age. Girls like that have learned that their entire value is wrapped up in their sexuality and pleasing men! Now she has to learn that she is more than just a sex object and that she is capable of doing far more in life than just pleasing a man or all men.
How do you know that?

Too bad you cannot meet her in real life and get to know her.
 
Old 07-08-2011, 04:22 PM
 
288 posts, read 133,713 times
Reputation: 110
Quote:
Originally Posted by I_Love_LI_but View Post
I am sure CA has been thoroughly examined but there are medical privacy laws, so if you are waiting for everything you mention in your post to be disclosed to the public at large, you will be waiting a long time.

The former BF and his father are some of the few people to say anything positive about her. I don't think HLN has control to stop anyone else who wants to come out to the media at large and defend CA.

So what diagnosis did the boyfriend and the father make? "Not a sociopath!" What is their expertise in that you trust them so much or do you like them because they said positive things about CA? As for his father's statements which you are putting so much creedence into, his son was only a couple with CA for SIX SHORT MONTHS, so really how well do you think this man knew CA or how much time do you think he really spent with her? If he described her as "insecure," how big of a conversation do you think they had on the occasions they met? A description of insecure tends to conjure up a quiet little mouse.

You accuse everyone else of grasping at straws if they call her a sociopath, but really you are doing the same feeble "grasping" except your "diagnosis" is that she's NOT a sociopath. At this point, none of us really know the truth, but you can tell from someone's actions and behaviors WHAT they are and IMO her actions and behaviors go more towards the sociopathic and troubled side than not.
What makes you SURE she has been examined, in particular by those passing judgment on her on TV every night??? I'm positive that those people have not had any mental health expert evaluate her nor have they done an unbaised social history investigation. They are just "guessing" based on the very limited and biased information out there. These people also seem to think they can read her mind, know all of her history, JUST BY LOOKING AT HER IN THE COURTROOM ON TELEVISION!! Geeezzz. Even that sillly little saying about "you can't judge a book by its cover" seems wise compared to what these talking heads are doing. Those people could have sent investigations experienced in doing social histories out to talk to all those people who knew Casey through the years, friends, neighbors, former school teachers, without need a medical release from Casey Anthony. If those people wanted to talk to someone about her, there is absolutely nothing to stop them from sharing their experiences of her. But, no, the talking heads didn't want an unbiased look at her past. They wanted to look at every horrible thing they could find, and that's what they did. Shame on those people in the mental health field who got on TV and said the things they did without any more information than they had.

The father said that during the six months Casey and his son were a couple that Casey was at their house "all the time".........that she ate meals with them, that she watched TV with them, etc. etc. He said that at first he found her to be just a girl with a bubbly personality and pleasant to be around. However, the more he got to know her, the more it became apparent that she really wanted to "belong" and to please people, to be liked, and that when she would give you a hug it seemed like she was saying, please protect me.

My position is that I do not assume she is a sociopath based on the fact that the diagnosis of sociopathy seems to have been made on INCOMPLETE information. I know how to do a social history investigation for these very kinds of evaluations; no unbiased investigation has been done regarding Casey Anthony.

As for HLN not being able to control what people said about Casey on their programs, I beg to differ. I watched many of those shows just to see if they would bring on credible defense attorneys who would disagree with what their PAID analysts had to say. There was on very well-respected and experienced successful defense attorney on by the name of Janie Weintraub. She tried to point out the ways in which the state's case was lacking, and without exception throughout the entire trial, the host of the shows (few shows) where she appeared, would talk over her and cut her off after only a couple short sentences, and move on to an attorney who would hammer Jose Baez and Casey Anthony. AFTER the verdict came back, I've noticed that a few other shows have had Ms. Weintraub on and at least let her finish her thought before moving to someone else. HLN show hosts cut off everybody who said anything positive about Jose Baez or Casey Anthony. I saw it. The interview with the ex-boyfriend and his father was conducted AFTER the verdict in the case. Nobody put them on PRIOR to the verdict.

Btw, I'm saying we don't know whether or not she is a sociopath and that IMO, based on my past work experience, it's possible that she is not. I'm saying that all those who are so sure she is a sociopath and who are going on to write about her as if they can read her mind, have to be guessing and have to be basing their opinons on what has been put out there by Nancy Grace and all her HLN co-workers.
 
Old 07-08-2011, 04:31 PM
 
288 posts, read 133,713 times
Reputation: 110
Quote:
Originally Posted by I_Love_LI_but View Post
How do you know that?

Too bad you cannot meet her in real life and get to know her.
I know that from my work experience.

I have no interest in meeting her. I just have a natural dislike for "lynch mobs." Surely this young woman is far more complex than the one-dimensional evaluation of her in the media contends.
 
Old 07-08-2011, 04:52 PM
 
Location: Nassau, Long Island, NY
16,408 posts, read 28,889,976 times
Reputation: 7268
Quote:
Originally Posted by Morgain View Post
What makes you SURE she has been examined, in particular by those passing judgment on her on TV every night??? I'm positive that those people have not had any mental health expert evaluate her nor have they done an unbaised social history investigation. They are just "guessing" based on the very limited and biased information out there. These people also seem to think they can read her mind, know all of her history, JUST BY LOOKING AT HER IN THE COURTROOM ON TELEVISION!! Geeezzz. Even that sillly little saying about "you can't judge a book by its cover" seems wise compared to what these talking heads are doing. Those people could have sent investigations experienced in doing social histories out to talk to all those people who knew Casey through the years, friends, neighbors, former school teachers, without need a medical release from Casey Anthony. If those people wanted to talk to someone about her, there is absolutely nothing to stop them from sharing their experiences of her. But, no, the talking heads didn't want an unbiased look at her past. They wanted to look at every horrible thing they could find, and that's what they did. Shame on those people in the mental health field who got on TV and said the things they did without any more information than they had.

The father said that during the six months Casey and his son were a couple that Casey was at their house "all the time".........that she ate meals with them, that she watched TV with them, etc. etc. He said that at first he found her to be just a girl with a bubbly personality and pleasant to be around. However, the more he got to know her, the more it became apparent that she really wanted to "belong" and to please people, to be liked, and that when she would give you a hug it seemed like she was saying, please protect me.

My position is that I do not assume she is a sociopath based on the fact that the diagnosis of sociopathy seems to have been made on INCOMPLETE information. I know how to do a social history investigation for these very kinds of evaluations; no unbiased investigation has been done regarding Casey Anthony.

As for HLN not being able to control what people said about Casey on their programs, I beg to differ. I watched many of those shows just to see if they would bring on credible defense attorneys who would disagree with what their PAID analysts had to say. There was on very well-respected and experienced successful defense attorney on by the name of Janie Weintraub. She tried to point out the ways in which the state's case was lacking, and without exception throughout the entire trial, the host of the shows (few shows) where she appeared, would talk over her and cut her off after only a couple short sentences, and move on to an attorney who would hammer Jose Baez and Casey Anthony. AFTER the verdict came back, I've noticed that a few other shows have had Ms. Weintraub on and at least let her finish her thought before moving to someone else. HLN show hosts cut off everybody who said anything positive about Jose Baez or Casey Anthony. I saw it. The interview with the ex-boyfriend and his father was conducted AFTER the verdict in the case. Nobody put them on PRIOR to the verdict.

Btw, I'm saying we don't know whether or not she is a sociopath and that IMO, based on my past work experience, it's possible that she is not. I'm saying that all those who are so sure she is a sociopath and who are going on to write about her as if they can read her mind, have to be guessing and have to be basing their opinons on what has been put out there by Nancy Grace and all her HLN co-workers.
I know the talking heads on HLN did not examine her, nor did their "experts!" I also do not follow every word they say and believe it's true. I posted a couple of whoppers I caught from Nancy Grace's show on HLN on C-D in this forum. I also saw Janie Weintraub get dissed and I would have preferred if they let her say her piece. While I too have noticed that HLN DOES tend to take the camera off those on their show who don't go according to the party line, HLN is not the only news channel out there and cannot control the rest of them, so where were more CA supporters on other channels? However, we have yet to have CA released and see the multitude of shows about her life ... perhaps more people with positive things to say about her will come out of the woodwork now.
 
Old 07-08-2011, 04:56 PM
 
Location: Nassau, Long Island, NY
16,408 posts, read 28,889,976 times
Reputation: 7268
Quote:
Originally Posted by Morgain View Post
I know that from my work experience.

I have no interest in meeting her. I just have a natural dislike for "lynch mobs." Surely this young woman is far more complex than the one-dimensional evaluation of her in the media contends.
What do you do for a living that you can discern that CA is not one of those people who don't care what others think of her?

I agree she is much more complex than what has been portrayed in the media so far. Now that she has been declared "not guilty" there will be many more media reports to come starring her which I suppose will be more detailed.
 
Old 07-08-2011, 05:47 PM
 
706 posts, read 1,168,733 times
Reputation: 438
Quote:
Originally Posted by Morgain View Post
I know that from my work experience.

I have no interest in meeting her. I just have a natural dislike for "lynch mobs." Surely this young woman is far more complex than the one-dimensional evaluation of her in the media contends.
That's an interesting statement. I also wonder what makes her tick. I see her as evil, conniving and detached. But I wonder if something made her that way? I really am curious. No excuses, just trying to understand how a young woman can do such a thing with a child. I've always felt women have a very special bond with their children, different even than a father's love.

I'm not sympathetic towards her but is there something we can learn from someone going so wrong.
 
Old 07-09-2011, 03:42 AM
 
12 posts, read 16,501 times
Reputation: 31
You know what they say out of small towns come small minds. What was that "Now the devil is dancing" bit she said after Casey Anthony was found not guilty. There was NO evidance pointing to her murdering so why does that make the devil dance... Because in her mind she was guilty. She talks down to people on her show. I don't even watch it any more. She is too biased. Always a one way street and it is her street.
 
Old 07-09-2011, 03:47 AM
 
12 posts, read 16,501 times
Reputation: 31
There is more to it than anyone will ever know. What I don't understand is with all the laws that they can make why can not you be put under, the old truth serum so to speak. I am sure that would come under a violation of your rights but it would clarify a person innocent going to jail or a person guilty going free.
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