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Old 08-04-2011, 02:34 PM
 
Location: Nassau, Long Island, NY
16,408 posts, read 28,892,751 times
Reputation: 7268

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Three Wolves In Snow View Post
Whether you like it or not, some times, there is NOT enough evidence to convict someone. It does not matter what we "think" happened, it matters what evidence shows us. If there is no fricken evidence, you cannot convict. Why on earth is that so difficult for some of you to understand?
Some of us believe there WAS enough evidence to convict in this case, "emotions" fully omitted. It boils down to a fundamental difference of opinion. Of course you will side with the poster(s) who most closely mirror your own opinion and I will side with the ones who most closely mirror mine.

 
Old 08-04-2011, 04:07 PM
 
9,528 posts, read 4,870,157 times
Reputation: 3876
Quote:
Originally Posted by Three Wolves In Snow View Post
By a show of hands, (and be honest), how many of you watched every last minute of that trial, including jury selection? How many of you watched the hours and hours and hours and hours and hours and never missed a single moment, not even a minute, not even 30 seconds to go use the restroom, how many of you watched every. single. moment. of that trial?

I have.

And while I sit here and read page after page of people thinking with their emotions, people stating "this was proven, that was proven", (no, the cadaver dog was retired after this because it had been giving false positives, they didn't set up the cars in the way they should have been set up to get an accurate reading from the dog, etc so there goes the dog theory...it was stated, accurately, that chloroform can be found due to a number of chemicals and reactions, and, coincidentally, the guy, (I forgot his name), who testified that CA had searched on her computer some high number of times for "chloroform" actually was not true. His test was inaccurate and he went back and stated that it was inaccuarate that in fact, her computer showed ONE search for chloroform, and let's not forget that her bf's MySpace page had that stupid "motivational poster" of some guy putting a cloth towards his date's face and the caption saying something about getting her with chloroform...gee, maybe she looked up how to spell the word...the "science" for the scent of decomposition in the car is not proven science and while DNA may have been that way once as well, it cannot be taken as gospel truth because it is. not. proven., no one knows, not even Dr. G, no one knows how Caylee died and without knowing HOW she died, it is impossible to say who killed her, there was no evidence tying Casey to Caylee's death no matter how many times some of you keep saying it's so, the duct tape was NOT found on the mouth, it was NOT found on the mouth, it was NOT found on the mouth, there is no evidence that Caylee was ever in the trunk of the car.....need I fricken go on?!?!?), I think that most of you did not watch the entire trial and base your opinions simply on snippets from the news or some talking head. NOTHING was proven. Absolutely NOTHING was proven.

ALL we know is that Caylee is dead. Casey was the last person seen with her, yes, but that's all we know. We do not know how she died, we do not know if she was in the trunk of the car, (no evidence), we do not know if Casey did it, (no evidence), we do not know if she used chloroform, (no solid evidence), we do not know if she put duct tape over her mouth and nose, (it was not on her mouth and nose)...everything was speculation.

We know Caylee died. We know Casey was the last to be seen with her. We know Casey lied her ass off about the whereabouts of her daughter. That is ALL we know and despite what some of you lynch mob wish, that is NOT enough to prove that CA murdered her child.

You may not like the American Justice system but that's too bad because that is what we have and that is better than being guilty until (or in some places never), proven innocent.

Would you rather live in a country where women have to prove they were not raped by sticking their tongue to the bottom of a hot pan and if they pull away that means they are lying?

I'll take the American Justice system that, yes, sometimes lets people get away with crimes, over other systems in this world.

I watched the whole fricken thing. I suggest some of you go and watch the whole fricken thing. It took me weeks to watch it.

You are more than welcome to watch it and then come back, using FACTS, NOT emotions, to prove your points.

I don't care what Nancy Grace says, I don't care what Aphrodite Jones says, I don't care what some guy's aunt's sister's boyfriend's boss said. Stop allowing other people to think for you.

Here's the link...it's going to take you quite awhile. No fast forwarding, no skipping, I don't care how boring it gets for you. If you get up to make a sandwich, use the bathroom, go to work, have a life, put it on pause and start from where you left off. Watch every. single. moment. Watch the entire thing:

VIDEO ARCHIVE: Casey Anthony Murder Trial - The Casey Anthony Case News Story - WFTV Orlando (http://www.wftv.com/caseyanthony/28083402/detail.html - broken link)

Bosco is not a "know it all", he's one of the few here who is actually using RATIONAL thought. Some of you are accusing him of being happy that CA went free. You don't know what he thinks about that. What he's doing is sticking with the evidence and facts. He's not running on emotion. I don't want anyone on my jury, should I ever be accused of something, who is going to speculate and judge based on their emotions instead of evidence and facts.

Whether you like it or not, some times, there is NOT enough evidence to convict someone. It does not matter what we "think" happened, it matters what evidence shows us. If there is no fricken evidence, you cannot convict. Why on earth is that so difficult for some of you to understand?
You reject the testimony alleging shockingly high chloroform levels and signs of decomposition in the trunk; ignore all behavioral deceptions; buy the idea that the state must prove how she died; poopoo the duct tape. In fact, when you write --- "We know Casey was the last to be seen with her."--- I'm surprised you accept that as a Fact because Maybe George was last to be seen with Caylee.

"Lynch mob," "Stop allowing other people to think for you." "base your opinions simply on snippets from the news or some talking head."

Your superiority is duly noted.
 
Old 08-04-2011, 04:16 PM
 
Location: Tampa (by way of Omaha)
13,930 posts, read 19,151,835 times
Reputation: 9160
Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzarama View Post
You reject the testimony alleging shockingly high chloroform levels and signs of decomposition in the trunk
And when you, as the prosecution, immediately follow him up with a witness who gives conflicting testimony, you know you're in trouble.
 
Old 08-04-2011, 09:41 PM
 
9,912 posts, read 9,304,041 times
Reputation: 8053
Quote:
Originally Posted by Three Wolves In Snow View Post
By a show of hands, (and be honest), how many of you watched every last minute of that trial, including jury selection? How many of you watched the hours and hours and hours and hours and hours and never missed a single moment, not even a minute, not even 30 seconds to go use the restroom, how many of you watched every. single. moment. of that trial?

I have.
Me ... Me ...Me .... waving my hand ... I have been with this case since the 911 call when it was just local news ... my son lives in Florida and we fly down often. During the winter months we have been known to do the snow bird number in the Sunshine State.

I followed the case through the Florida/Orlando/StPete newspapers and the Orlando TV stations. All the back and forth between Judge Strickland when he asked the Florida Supreme Court to remove Jose Baez and Jose Baez retaliated and asked that Judge Strickland be removed. When the court was petitioned to declare Casey Anthony indigent. The check fraud trial.

Then when jury selection took place, I watched every minute of that ... some of the people called couldn't speak English very good. I also recall Jennifer Ford (no name was given then but a nursing student) and her desire to be on the jury was evident. If her answer to the defense or prosecution didn't please them ... she giggled and tried another answer. The reason that one sticks with me was the giggles. People called took care of their mothers, mother-in-laws, some would lose their homes/apts/jobs if they served. I saw the crazy lady go nuts and Judge Perry sent her to cool off in jail.

One thing , I have never watched Nancy Grace nor Geraldo or any of the talking heads. I don't do TV even though we have four with everything DirecTV has to offer. I do watch HBO, Cinemax, Starz movies, HGTV, History Channels. I didn't even know who Nancy Grace was until I looked her up on the internet and what did I find ... some woman killed herself after talking to Grace. My goodness I don't need to watch that kind of show.

When the trial started I used my computer for the CNN live stream ... no talking heads ... no commercials ... only the trial on that live stream. I was up and at it every morning and when the court would take a recess I would take care of my bathroom needs or get more coffee. When they broke for lunch my physical therapist would arrive and work me out. Saturdays I was there too. When Judge Perry would dismiss court and the jury would leave many days the lawyers and Judge would remain to iron out legal problems ... I watched that too.

My husband kept telling me you are going to be watching that trial until Christmas. I assure you if I had been on that jury we would still be deliberating or the jury would be hung. I would have been there attempting to get in for the trial but I had total knee replacement surgery prior to the jury selection. I worked my surgery around the selection and trial. I was fortunate on my doctor visit it was the day Casey Anthony pulled her trying to throw up number and court was dismissed early. But I could have recorded it if she hadn't pulled that little number.

Do you live in Florida ... how can you compare a dead pig in the trunk of a vehicle in Nebraska to a dead child or even a dead pig in a trunk of a vehicle in Florida. Common sense, common sense there is no comparison in temperatures! How could any juror or person even listen to Werner Spitz compared to Dr. Jan Garavaglia. He needed to be put out to pasture long ago even his son didn't agree with him. The son is a pathologist too. The grief lady was chewing gum on the stand, real classy. She appeared to have had a few drinks before she got there or some good dope.

Our justice system failed Caylee Marie Anthony and a child killer walks free today.
 
Old 08-04-2011, 09:56 PM
 
9,912 posts, read 9,304,041 times
Reputation: 8053
Quote:
Originally Posted by I_Love_LI_but View Post
Some of us believe there WAS enough evidence to convict in this case, "emotions" fully omitted. It boils down to a fundamental difference of opinion. Of course you will side with the poster(s) who most closely mirror your own opinion and I will side with the ones who most closely mirror mine.
Common sense which the Pinellas 12 didn't have ... there was plenty of evidence but the jury had other things on their mind ... gotta get outta here ... if we find her guilty it means we have to stay for the 'Sentencing Phase' ... another juror was leaving for Europe on July 7 no refund on trip ... hurry up hurry up ... what we having for lunch .... put your glad rags on today we need to look good ... let's hit the road Jack!
 
Old 08-04-2011, 10:40 PM
 
Location: Ohio
15,164 posts, read 13,429,410 times
Reputation: 20595
Quote:
Originally Posted by CarolinaWoman View Post
Common sense which the Pinellas 12 didn't have ... there was plenty of evidence but the jury had other things on their mind ... gotta get outta here ... if we find her guilty it means we have to stay for the 'Sentencing Phase' ... another juror was leaving for Europe on July 7 no refund on trip ... hurry up hurry up ... what we having for lunch .... put your glad rags on today we need to look good ... let's hit the road Jack!
As long as we force people to do jury duty against their will.....especially if it is going to cost them money out of their own pockets......this is what you are going to get.

Perhaps if we allowed people to elect to serve jury duty.....maybe similar to marking the box to be an organ donor or enrolling in the service......we would end up with jurists who can make decisions based on law instead of based on what is best for their own well being and the well being of their family.

Realistically, how many people do you think would sacrifice thousands of dollars to do "the right thing", as with Juror # 7?

You can wave the flag and spout altruisms all you want...... it isn't going to change the fact that most people cannot afford to skip a paycheck or two for the "greater good". The bank holding your mortgage, the electric company, etc. are not going to waive this months payment because you were "doing your duty" as an American.
 
Old 08-04-2011, 10:51 PM
 
Location: Out West
22,729 posts, read 16,826,114 times
Reputation: 26292
Quote:
Originally Posted by CarolinaWoman View Post
Me ... Me ...Me .... waving my hand ... I have been with this case since the 911 call when it was just local news ... my son lives in Florida and we fly down often. During the winter months we have been known to do the snow bird number in the Sunshine State.

I followed the case through the Florida/Orlando/StPete newspapers and the Orlando TV stations. All the back and forth between Judge Strickland when he asked the Florida Supreme Court to remove Jose Baez and Jose Baez retaliated and asked that Judge Strickland be removed. When the court was petitioned to declare Casey Anthony indigent. The check fraud trial.

Then when jury selection took place, I watched every minute of that ... some of the people called couldn't speak English very good. I also recall Jennifer Ford (no name was given then but a nursing student) and her desire to be on the jury was evident. If her answer to the defense or prosecution didn't please them ... she giggled and tried another answer. The reason that one sticks with me was the giggles. People called took care of their mothers, mother-in-laws, some would lose their homes/apts/jobs if they served. I saw the crazy lady go nuts and Judge Perry sent her to cool off in jail.

One thing , I have never watched Nancy Grace nor Geraldo or any of the talking heads. I don't do TV even though we have four with everything DirecTV has to offer. I do watch HBO, Cinemax, Starz movies, HGTV, History Channels. I didn't even know who Nancy Grace was until I looked her up on the internet and what did I find ... some woman killed herself after talking to Grace. My goodness I don't need to watch that kind of show.

When the trial started I used my computer for the CNN live stream ... no talking heads ... no commercials ... only the trial on that live stream. I was up and at it every morning and when the court would take a recess I would take care of my bathroom needs or get more coffee. When they broke for lunch my physical therapist would arrive and work me out. Saturdays I was there too. When Judge Perry would dismiss court and the jury would leave many days the lawyers and Judge would remain to iron out legal problems ... I watched that too.

My husband kept telling me you are going to be watching that trial until Christmas. I assure you if I had been on that jury we would still be deliberating or the jury would be hung. I would have been there attempting to get in for the trial but I had total knee replacement surgery prior to the jury selection. I worked my surgery around the selection and trial. I was fortunate on my doctor visit it was the day Casey Anthony pulled her trying to throw up number and court was dismissed early. But I could have recorded it if she hadn't pulled that little number.

Do you live in Florida ... how can you compare a dead pig in the trunk of a vehicle in Nebraska to a dead child or even a dead pig in a trunk of a vehicle in Florida. Common sense, common sense there is no comparison in temperatures! How could any juror or person even listen to Werner Spitz compared to Dr. Jan Garavaglia. He needed to be put out to pasture long ago even his son didn't agree with him. The son is a pathologist too. The grief lady was chewing gum on the stand, real classy. She appeared to have had a few drinks before she got there or some good dope.

Our justice system failed Caylee Marie Anthony and a child killer walks free today.
Actually yes, I did live in Florida up until the middle of May this year. So I know what a hot, dead animal smells like. I also know what hot, old trash smells like. Both are repugnant. Not sure where you got the Nebraska reference..I've never lived in Nebraska.

That aside, I'm glad that you watched the whole thing. One thing I've noticed with you; however, is that you never shout out random, emotionally fueled, drive by posts.

You and I came to a different conclusion BUT your posts always seem to be thought out and not just, "the jury is stoooopid!!!!!!!!!!" and "everyone in Florida is stooooopid", with exception to the most recent post you made.

What the lady appeared to be like is not factual. It's an opinion. And Dr. G stated that it could not be determined how the child died...what she added to that was her opinion as the tape was not found on the child's mouth.
 
Old 08-04-2011, 11:03 PM
 
9,912 posts, read 9,304,041 times
Reputation: 8053
Quote:
Originally Posted by Annie53 View Post
As long as we force people to do jury duty against their will.....especially if it is going to cost them money out of their own pockets......this is what you are going to get.

Perhaps if we allowed people to elect to serve jury duty.....maybe similar to marking the box to be an organ donor or enrolling in the service......we would end up with jurists who can make decisions based on law instead of based on what is best for their own well being and the well being of their family.

Realistically, how many people do you think would sacrifice thousands of dollars to do "the right thing", as with Juror # 7?

You can wave the flag and spout altruisms all you want...... it isn't going to change the fact that most people cannot afford to skip a paycheck or two for the "greater good". The bank holding your mortgage, the electric company, etc. are not going to waive this months payment because you were "doing your duty" as an American.
Our state use to choose jurors according to the voter registration roles. They stopped that and now pick from a computer generated list by drivers license.

I realize what you are saying. I have been on civil and criminal juries. In addition I served on a Federal jury. About 15 years ago I served one year of Grand Jury duty.

I have been on a jury where a guy needed to get back to work and would accept anything to just get out of there. An older lady that never worked was missing her soaps and just wanted out of there too. She needed to have her husband's supper ready when he got home from work.

But ... I still do not think this Pinellas 12 did a very good job.
 
Old 08-04-2011, 11:20 PM
 
9,912 posts, read 9,304,041 times
Reputation: 8053
Quote:
Originally Posted by Three Wolves In Snow View Post
Actually yes, I did live in Florida up until the middle of May this year. So I know what a hot, dead animal smells like. I also know what hot, old trash smells like. Both are repugnant. Not sure where you got the Nebraska reference..I've never lived in Nebraska.

That aside, I'm glad that you watched the whole thing. One thing I've noticed with you; however, is that you never shout out random, emotionally fueled, drive by posts.

You and I came to a different conclusion BUT your posts always seem to be thought out and not just, "the jury is stoooopid!!!!!!!!!!" and "everyone in Florida is stooooopid", with exception to the most recent post you made.

What the lady appeared to be like is not factual. It's an opinion. And Dr. G stated that it could not be determined how the child died...what she added to that was her opinion as the tape was not found on the child's mouth.
I thought you watched the trial??? The 'bug man' ... Timothy Huntington from the University of Nebraska that testified for Baez ... you know blow flies ... maggots ... Huntington compared putting a dead pig in the trunk of a car in Nebraska comparing it to a dead baby in the trunk of a car in Florida!! You remember surely ... gag city ... he said you can get DNA from maggots if they just ate a body!!! Are you sure you watched the entire trial. That testimony made me gag but I hung in there.

Also ... Dr. G said and this is a direct quote "There is no child that should have duct tape on its face when it dies. There is no reason to put duct tape on the face after they die. Based on our experience, we've seen this in cases of homicide." I can refer you to the date and tape number if you like.

No everyone in Florida is not stupid. LOL I was just disappointed in the verdict and would have preferred a hung jury to the not guilty ... but a hung jury would have meant another trial and more expense to the taxpayers.
 
Old 08-04-2011, 11:23 PM
 
Location: Home!
8,710 posts, read 10,402,786 times
Reputation: 8511
Because, like you said, sometimes people get away with crimes. I don't care WHO you are or how good you are at concealing your emotions, you know. Yes, it wasn't proven enough to that jury and so be it. That's the system. Let the people be emotional. There should be emotion surrounding a tragic death of an innocent person. There will always be those who disagree. If she had been convicted, you would be writing in a thread about the travesty of that. It's people. It's a public forum. We are all different, with different minds. Let it be hard. It should be. Laws have been changed, some for the better, some for the worse, by public outcries and disagreements to situations. Big difference is we didn't have public forums or social media, worldwide, to air these outcries. We do now. It will never be different. I suggest if someone is tired of pushing their point, either move on or continue to educate. I suggest it be done on a level of relative respect to those who may not have your education, your opinions, your ability to remain emotionless, or your logic. Face it, you can not change everyone's thought processes. You can provide what you feel or know and they can take it or leave it.

You know the difficulty is that Bosco has never said whether he "thinks" she did it or not. And I am talking just his thoughts, not based on the trial solely. I am not talking about whether she should have been convicted or not. So, I think this makes it harder for people to listen to his "RATIONAL thoughts". That's fine, no one has to say what they personally think, but it just comes off as this cold, hard person who thinks that this whole debacle is ok. I understand his point, legally. I understand there wasn't enough evidence. I do not agree with the verdict. I don't have to, but I do have to accept that she walked with zero consequences. I do believe CA either did it or was involved in it. Shame either way.


This is not a third world country where people have to do crazy things to prove their "rapes". The justice system can be tweaked when needed, if needed. We have great minds to do that and the good sense to know it.
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