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Old 10-05-2011, 10:52 AM
 
Location: The western periphery of Terra Australis
24,693 posts, read 18,052,262 times
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Default Capital punishment for more than just murder or treason

I've heard some people even call for the death penalty for crimes such as child molestation, kidnapping, armed robbery or even just regular rape. Back in the Middle Ages and in many countries like China or Iran the list of capital crimes is indeed very long, from killing a Panda to being a homosexual, for instance.

I think it's for good reason that in the US, now the last remaining western democracy to have capital punishment, capital punishment is only really for first degree murder and treason. I've heard of a push to include the rape of minors as a capital crime in some states, and although I'm just as shocked as any others and I believe some pedophiles could potentially be murderers, the DP should strictly be for murder, if it has to be used (I'm against it in principle myself).

There seems to be no rational argument to execute rapists etc other than just appeals to the emotion. Yet such vengeful thinking is common and I find myself feeling it sometimes. I wouldn't go to the extent of advocating it, though.
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Old 10-05-2011, 10:54 AM
 
Location: southern california
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the problem is not an excessive of punishment, the problem is a lack thereof.
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Old 10-05-2011, 10:58 AM
 
Location: The western periphery of Terra Australis
24,693 posts, read 18,052,262 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Huckleberry3911948 View Post
the problem is not an excessive of punishment, the problem is a lack thereof.
So you'd like to go back to England in the 1700s? Where children were hanged for stealing? Where crime was rampant...

Punishment alone has never been good deterrant of crime. It's a whole of society thing that concerns us all. We can't just shove em off to prison or send them to the man in the sky to take care of them. We are part of the problem and the solution.
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Old 10-06-2011, 11:05 AM
 
4,766 posts, read 4,166,799 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Trimac20 View Post
I've heard some people even call for the death penalty for crimes such as child molestation, kidnapping, armed robbery or even just regular rape. Back in the Middle Ages and in many countries like China or Iran the list of capital crimes is indeed very long, from killing a Panda to being a homosexual, for instance.

I think it's for good reason that in the US, now the last remaining western democracy to have capital punishment, capital punishment is only really for first degree murder and treason. I've heard of a push to include the rape of minors as a capital crime in some states, and although I'm just as shocked as any others and I believe some pedophiles could potentially be murderers, the DP should strictly be for murder, if it has to be used (I'm against it in principle myself).

There seems to be no rational argument to execute rapists etc other than just appeals to the emotion. Yet such vengeful thinking is common and I find myself feeling it sometimes. I wouldn't go to the extent of advocating it, though.
"Just regular rape" is considered by the FBI to be second only to murder in the devastation it creates in the lives of the victims. They may never feel safe again. 86% of rape victims develop addictions inm order to keep from feeling the feelings that come with being raped. Victims' marriages break up, their jobs are lost; a few go into the hospital and don't come out for years. Some see their relatives go to prison for goiong after the person who did it to them. A few die.

Here's a rational argument to support capital punishment for these guys: Let's prevent all that from happening. Here's another: Rapists don't change. They do it because they like to do it, and there's no changing that, even with ten years of therapy. They will NEVER be safe in human society.

Here's a rational argument against it: It costs ten times as much to execute a guy as it does to keep himin prison until he is a little old sex offender. Here's another: What if you have the wrong guy? Here's a third: The victim can be so guilt-stricken that he or she caused the death of another person that it may keep them from reporting in the first place. Fear of vigilante justice by their relatives keeps people from reporting now, and that's without capital punishment. Here's another argument: a guy on Death Row looks like a big weepy victim to the public, even if he's guilty as Hannibal the Cannibal, and he gets love letters and marriage proposals and fan clubs and picketers. Gag me with a habeas corpus!
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Old 10-06-2011, 11:24 AM
 
1,570 posts, read 863,918 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Trimac20 View Post
I've heard some people even call for the death penalty for crimes such as child molestation, kidnapping, armed robbery or even just regular rape. Back in the Middle Ages and in many countries like China or Iran the list of capital crimes is indeed very long, from killing a Panda to being a homosexual, for instance.

I think it's for good reason that in the US, now the last remaining western democracy to have capital punishment, capital punishment is only really for first degree murder and treason. I've heard of a push to include the rape of minors as a capital crime in some states, and although I'm just as shocked as any others and I believe some pedophiles could potentially be murderers, the DP should strictly be for murder, if it has to be used (I'm against it in principle myself).

There seems to be no rational argument to execute rapists etc other than just appeals to the emotion. Yet such vengeful thinking is common and I find myself feeling it sometimes. I wouldn't go to the extent of advocating it, though.
And what about the death penalty for murder or treason doesn't appeal to emotion? What is the rational argument that applies there that would not apply to executing pedophiles?
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Old 10-07-2011, 12:05 AM
 
Location: The western periphery of Terra Australis
24,693 posts, read 18,052,262 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rimmerama View Post
And what about the death penalty for murder or treason doesn't appeal to emotion? What is the rational argument that applies there that would not apply to executing pedophiles?
Well if you want to get technical you can go back to 'an eye for an eye', and treason may potential result in the loss of millions of lives. Even if someone IS convicted of treason I would hope the government would grant him clemency, although I can understand why the DP might be used in such a case. As I said, however, I'm anti-DP in principle and believe the arguments for the abolition of capital punishment altogether are more convincing. This thread was in response to the belief that many people have that all these scummy people should be killed.
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Old 10-07-2011, 04:59 AM
 
14,429 posts, read 8,502,578 times
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I do not agree with execution for any reason.
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Old 10-07-2011, 08:32 AM
 
Location: Orlando, Florida
43,862 posts, read 26,720,094 times
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I see no reason whatsoever to spend over $30,000 a year on one person who chooses to kill another person in cold blood.

They chose not to value another person's life and have thereby forfeited their own.

I am for the death penalty, but only in murder cases.
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Old 10-07-2011, 09:33 AM
 
14,429 posts, read 8,502,578 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GloryB View Post
I see no reason whatsoever to spend over $30,000 a year on one person who chooses to kill another person in cold blood.

They chose not to value another person's life and have thereby forfeited their own.

I am for the death penalty, but only in murder cases.
My oft repeated refrain, "The government and society should hold itself to the same and/or higher standards than those it prosecutes, judges and punishes."
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Old 10-07-2011, 12:24 PM
 
Location: the Outer Limits
4,059 posts, read 2,852,589 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Trimac20 View Post
I've heard some people even call for the death penalty for crimes such as child molestation, kidnapping, armed robbery or even just regular rape. Back in the Middle Ages and in many countries like China or Iran the list of capital crimes is indeed very long, from killing a Panda to being a homosexual, for instance.

I think it's for good reason that in the US, now the last remaining western democracy to have capital punishment, capital punishment is only really for first degree murder and treason. I've heard of a push to include the rape of minors as a capital crime in some states, and although I'm just as shocked as any others and I believe some pedophiles could potentially be murderers, the DP should strictly be for murder, if it has to be used (I'm against it in principle myself).

There seems to be no rational argument to execute rapists etc other than just appeals to the emotion. Yet such vengeful thinking is common and I find myself feeling it sometimes. I wouldn't go to the extent of advocating it, though.
I haven't read all of the posts but this is a hot button with me but I have mixed emotions. Emotionally, I want any crime of abuse, murder, torture, rape, to a minor under age 16, to carry a possible death sentence, if proven. But, then I think about the people in prison and on death row who have been exonerated (??) and I fall away from that position.....reluctantly.
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