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The notion that any child who's been molested is traumatized by it is very common, but not supported by any clinical evidence. But aside from that, you are correct: the run of the mill pedo is non-violent and is basically an overgrown child himself (or, very rarely, herself.) A child's mind in an adult body. If you mistreat a pedophile, therefore, in a sense you are mistreating a child.
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wha? not supported by clinical evidence? completely gobsmacked by that statement. i beg to differ, from those whom i have known and discussed this with, from the friends i have had who were sexually abused and became addicted to drugs to ease the pain. many people count molestation, whether prosecuted and known about or not, as the point where their lives went off the rails, if they even remembered it- a very close friend of mine was sexually molested by his father and didn't remember for years, and had a nervous breakdown when he remembered. but yeah, there is no clinical evidence. perhaps you should step outside your clinic and stop handling figures and making apologies for predators. sorry, overgrown CHILDREN.
i find your thoughts on the subject creepy in the extreme. you seem to care more about molesters, and more keen to make excuses for their behavior, than helping the victims. i am not even going to dialogue with you on this subject anymore. you can't convince me and i can't convince you. and the more you talk about it the more creepy this thread becomes. perhaps you should network with NAMBLA, as you will find many who believe as you do, more than you will find on this forum.
wha? not supported by clinical evidence? completely gobsmacked by that statement. i beg to differ, from those whom i have known and discussed this with, from the friends i have had who were sexually abused and became addicted to drugs to ease the pain. many people count molestation, whether prosecuted and known about or not, as the point where their lives went off the rails, if they even remembered it
Yes, it is not supported by clinical evidence. Your anecdotal cases suffer from the same drawbacks as all anecdotal evidence; that is, it is skewed by reporting bias. Those people who may have experienced abuse or molestation and were not traumatized by it are not counted by you, because they have little cause to bring the subject up.
P.S. The cracks about NAMBLA are both immature and boring.
i don't think that alcoholism can be compared to pedophilia. first of all, being an alcoholic is not a crime. and one must infer from the term "pedophile" that he has acted out on those urges, or else someone would not earn the term. you can't go after people's thoughts, one can only judge on action. therefore, being a pedophile infers criminal action.
Actually, due to mandated reporting, anyone who even mentions they might have that proclivity, whether or not they've acted on it, can be reported.
I really believe there needs to be a place someone who has not acted out, should be able to get help, without, being tossed in jail, it would be not only good for them but would protect potential victims
Those were goldengrain's words, not mine. Some pedophiles, like some non-pedophiles, are compulsive sex addicts; most people in both categories are not.
Sorry, I don't know what this sentence means, can you recast it?
No, the overwhelming majority of sex offenders (>90%) do not return within 5 years. It's not easy to find stats on "pedophiles" because pedophilia is a clinical and not a legal term, and it therefore must be diagnosed, rather than inferred from a person's offense history.
If you have no statistics, you don't know.
As I posted earlier, the return rate after incarceration is 5yrs. All crimes would include sex offenders.
So, then statistically its safe to say incarceration is not a deterent.
Your post:
"If you are talking about one who is pathological or compulsive, the answer is: just like an alcoholic learns to mentally turn the need on and off, i.e. usually with great difficulty. But it's absurd to claim no alcoholic remains sober".
My response:
"If you want to compare sexual, substance addiction with pedophilia, the chances of relapse are high".
Your response: Sorry, I don't know what this sentence means, can you recast it?
Assuming the possibility pedophiles can control their urges, the comparison was the same as overcoming alcohol, substance, or sex addictions.
The chances of recovery without relapse for addictions are slim. So again, your stand that a sex offender (specifically pedophile) don't reoffend is on shakey ground.
"The notion that any child who's been molested is traumatized by it is very common, but not supported by any clinical evidence. But aside from that, you are correct: the run of the mill pedo is non-violent and is basically an overgrown child himself (or, very rarely, herself.)
A child's mind in an adult body. If you mistreat a pedophile, therefore, in a sense you are mistreating a child.
According to who? Post clinical evidence supporting those statements.
I said I had no stats on pedophiles. Both of us have seen the same statistics on sex offenders.
Quote:
As I posted earlier, the return rate after incarceration is 5yrs. All crimes would include sex offenders.
You mean, the return rate after five years is something like 5%, is what you posted. You need to proofread before you post, sometimes your posts seem to be missing several words that change the meaning of what you're trying to say.
Quote:
So, then statistically its safe to say incarceration is not a deterent.
Because 5% reoffend in 5 years? That's an odd leap of logic.
Quote:
Assuming the possibility pedophiles can control their urges, the comparison was the same as overcoming alcohol, substance, or sex addictions.
The chances of recovery without relapse for addictions are slim. So again, your stand that a sex offender (specifically pedophile) don't reoffend is on shakey ground.
Let me clarify again.
Most sex offenders and even pedos are NOT compulsive.
Those who ARE compulsive ARE comparable to alcoholics/addicts. Even some of them avoid relapse, though not all.
The majority who are NOT compulsive can be deterred the way other categories of non-compulsive behavior can be deterred.
Everyone who has ever gotten a DUI is not an alcoholic and should not be locked up for life on the grounds that they might get drunk again and kill someone. We don't even do that to those we KNOW are alcoholics; we get them into treatment (and possibly levy some reasonable punishment). But when the topic is private parts rather than booze, all the ordinary rules of common sense go out the window.
According to who? Post clinical evidence supporting those statements.
I will find a few articles for you, but in the meantime google "Rind study" for the first statement.
The second statement is a figure of speech based on analogy, not a scientific proposition, although few people who've studied clinical pedophiles would fail to notice their general passivity and stunted-in-childhood disposition.
The purpose of the thread was to alert posters with an interest in the program topic, and possible discussion pertaining to the topic.
The discussion has become circular and off topic.
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