Black Dahlia/George Hodel- Possible Break in Case? (murder, serial killer, evidence)
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I am surprised there isn't a thread on here about this but there have been news reports in the past few days re. a "corpse sniffing dog" that has hit on a spot in the basement of Dr. George Hodel's house. Black Dahlia Case: Murder Crime Scene Found by Dog?
Steve Hodel, retired LAPD detective and George Hodel's son, has said plenty over the years about his belief that his father was the killer. He is now making the leap that this spot in the basement has to be connected to the Black Dahlia, which, like many of his conclusions, i have found erroneous.
Fact is, her body was found. whatever they hit on down there, it obviously wasn't her body, and her body was not in an advanced state of decomposition when it was found. i think it is MUCH more likely that George Hodel, who was believed to have performed abortions (he was a surgeon) might have buried some tissue in the basement and that's what they are hitting on. obviously there would have to be bone or tissue and short wasn't missing any organs. i think it would be safe to say that SOMETHING happened in the basement, but jumping to the conclusion that that means murder, or that that means the black dahlia, is something we are just gonna have to wait and find out about.
personally i find walter bayley to be the MUCH more likely suspect, as he lived on the same street and was suffering from a swelling of the brain that caused violent behavior. he was also a surgeon, had met short at her sister's wedding, and had the facilities to commit the crime. he was also obsessed with body parts- apparently he and his assistant used to watch autopsy films during dinner.
Last edited by nighthouse66; 02-07-2013 at 08:27 PM..
I read Steve Hodel's book and found it very interesting. I think the abortions were performed at the doctor's office - it seems Steve mentioned this somewhere in the book. I believe his sister had one after she was impregnated by her father, the doctor. Steve believes his dad killed several women, so it could be another victim. It's a fascinating story. I live in L.A. and used to drive by that house daily in my commute.
Traveled - 10 year cooling off period about of found victims
Preyed on the down and out but both genders.
well, considering that his daughter tamar (my roommate is named after her!) had accused him of molestation, leaving the country would have been a wise choice.
i have also been really interested in the cleveland torso/elliot ness/dahlia connection. hunted things up about it but there aren't any docus, just an old "unsolved mysteries' episode where they delve into it. i think there could definitely be something there. there are alot of coincidences there- didn't the killer mention in a letter to ness that he had continued his work in los angeles and it was that very time period when the dahlia was found?
they didn't give the dog her scent, they just took the dog into the basement and he "hit" on something. not a tracker dog, apparently he had gone up to barker ranch (manson hideout) and spahn as well as old battlefields looking for missing soldiers. that's the thing, the rub for me- that the dog sniffs corpses. her corpse was found, so why does steve hodel say "it could be solved"? i read his book and i didn't care for it. and so far he has no conclusive proof that his father killed anyone. he just has some vague notions.
the pics that he so often brings up as being of the dahlia clearly show a woman with a pronounced widow's peak, which elizabeth did not have. and i found that a hell of reach, to start investigating your own father just because you find a picture of a dark haired woman with her eyes closed from the 1940's. even short's family says those photos are not her, but steve hodel sort of took it and ran with it.
being that abortion was illegal in those days it isn't completely implausible to imagine that he would bring the tissue, as it were, home with him, so that he would know where it was at all times. he couldn't risk it being found in the trash and i am not sure if there were any sort of biomedical disposal services back in those days.
I read Steve Hodel's book and found it very interesting. I think the abortions were performed at the doctor's office - it seems Steve mentioned this somewhere in the book. I believe his sister had one after she was impregnated by her father, the doctor. Steve believes his dad killed several women, so it could be another victim. It's a fascinating story. I live in L.A. and used to drive by that house daily in my commute.
yeah, i live in los angeles now but i have never driven past. there was a ghost hunters episode recently where they were inside the house. its a frank lloyd wright house as well....
the pics that he so often brings up as being of the dahlia clearly show a woman with a pronounced widow's peak, which elizabeth did not have. and i found that a hell of reach, to start investigating your own father just because you find a picture of a dark haired woman with her eyes closed from the 1940's. even short's family says those photos are not her, but steve hodel sort of took it and ran with it.
A professional photo identification expert from NYCPD had a look at the photos that Hodel offers, and compared them to Elizabeth Short's photos. She came to the conclusion that the photos did not show the same woman. most of the other evidence in Hodel's book is shaky at best. George Hodel may have had some other skeletons in his closet (pun not intended), but he almost certainly didn't kill Elizabeth Short. At the time he was recovering from a major heart attack suffered in September of 1946(Hence his return from China). He spent the rest of September and October 1946 in a hospital bed. and yet two months later committed that brutal crime? I don't think Hodel is a good suspect, and I don't believe that the LAPD thought so either.
I read Steve Hodel's book and found it very interesting. I think the abortions were performed at the doctor's office - it seems Steve mentioned this somewhere in the book. I believe his sister had one after she was impregnated by her father, the doctor. Steve believes his dad killed several women, so it could be another victim. It's a fascinating story. I live in L.A. and used to drive by that house daily in my commute.
Finally, a reason Hodel might have hated his father so much that he's now written what, three books "proving" that he was not only the killer of Betty Short but also the Zodiac and who knows who else?
I read Black Dahlia Avenger but do not remember the name Walter Bayley. Was he is one of Hodel's books, or one of the other innumerable books on poor Betty Short?
well, considering that his daughter tamar (my roommate is named after her!) had accused him of molestation, leaving the country would have been a wise choice.
i have also been really interested in the cleveland torso/elliot ness/dahlia connection. hunted things up about it but there aren't any docus, just an old "unsolved mysteries' episode where they delve into it. i think there could definitely be something there. there are alot of coincidences there- didn't the killer mention in a letter to ness that he had continued his work in los angeles and it was that very time period when the dahlia was found?
they didn't give the dog her scent, they just took the dog into the basement and he "hit" on something. not a tracker dog, apparently he had gone up to barker ranch (manson hideout) and spahn as well as old battlefields looking for missing soldiers. that's the thing, the rub for me- that the dog sniffs corpses. her corpse was found, so why does steve hodel say "it could be solved"? i read his book and i didn't care for it. and so far he has no conclusive proof that his father killed anyone. he just has some vague notions.
the pics that he so often brings up as being of the dahlia clearly show a woman with a pronounced widow's peak, which elizabeth did not have. and i found that a hell of reach, to start investigating your own father just because you find a picture of a dark haired woman with her eyes closed from the 1940's. even short's family says those photos are not her, but steve hodel sort of took it and ran with it.
being that abortion was illegal in those days it isn't completely implausible to imagine that he would bring the tissue, as it were, home with him, so that he would know where it was at all times. he couldn't risk it being found in the trash and i am not sure if there were any sort of biomedical disposal services back in those days.
How was it for those types of molestation cases back then? Were they taken seriously?
I have no idea so its why I am asking.
That torso connection I just found out about when I saw this news story a couple days ago.
Its one of those serial killings I never even knew about. I don't know about the letter? Do you have the links? I just assumed myself that the time period fits the profile of a serial killer's "cooling off" period.
I didn't read the book.
Do you have links to any of the pics? I know people airbrushed and plucked those out so I just want to look at the difference.
Bring back tissue? Was that in the book or are you referring to the scent the dog picked up?
I read Hodel's book a few years and found it disturbing and fascinating read. The events, as depicted, are certainly plausible but I'll always remain skeptical. Ms. Short's brutal murder is too long cold to be solved officially unless miracle evidence is produced.
How was it for those types of molestation cases back then? Were they taken seriously?
I have no idea so its why I am asking.
That torso connection I just found out about when I saw this news story a couple days ago.
Its one of those serial killings I never even knew about. I don't know about the letter? Do you have the links? I just assumed myself that the time period fits the profile of a serial killer's "cooling off" period.
I didn't read the book.
Do you have links to any of the pics? I know people airbrushed and plucked those out so I just want to look at the difference.
Bring back tissue? Was that in the book or are you referring to the scent the dog picked up?
this is the only one i could find without a deep internet search- the one on the left is one of the photos hodel claims is short...Image Detail for - On the left, a mystery woman presented in “Black Dahlia Avenger ...
if i remember he was convicted, i believe she became pregnant with her father's child. i heard about the letter on an episode of unsolved mysteries. do a search and the one i saw was on youtube- so i know its still there. there really should be an in depth docu about the connection.
this is the youtube video where the guy talks in depth about his theory regarding walter bayley for those who asked.....its pretty fascinating. watch all three parts.
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