10 Reasons Not To Move To Tucson (Phoenix: neighborhood, buying, school districts)

[pomegranate]

I lived in Tucson in the 70's as a child. My father still lives there, and my 1/2 brother grew up there. Schools pretty much are terrible. Don't forget there is RAMPANT property crime; burglar alarms are standard, and we were broken into several times and had large dogs that we loved but were also there for protection. Mafia has been a subtle presence there for quite a while, as I understand, due to the drugs coming in. Having said that, I fell deeply in love with the desert as a child, and if it weren't for the crime, I'd seriously consider moving back.

[bluebelt1234]

Originally Posted by odinloki1

I moved to Arizona as a for a teaching job because the economy in MI was killed by greedy cowardly companies whose profits weren't big enough. Before I list my reasons I will state that for a lot of people here this is ideal and thats great but its not for me and I just need to vent.

1. The housing costs: As a teacher housing in your district (unless its poor and crime ridden) is unaffordable, at least in other states if you work hard and put in time (do extracurriculars and such) you get paid for your time. Here if you put in 200 extra hours on a project you get maybe 500 bucks. I didn't go into teaching for the money but I did want to be able to get by and you can't unless you don't eat or don't have health insurance. I just left teaching for the healthcare field (and I was a good teacher and my kids had good test scores and I never missed a day in 2 years) and I don't regret leaving teaching here, but I know if I was somewhere where the culture and policy made me feel worthwhile I would have stayed.

2. The long drives: this goes to finding a decent apartment because I can't afford a house and there's no safe apartments (no major crimes) nearby, the public transportation doesn't go to my school because its on the edge of the urban sprawl.

3. The lack of community: everyone moves in and out so fast that you don't get to know your neighbors. I don't know any of my neighbors and the last time I tried introducing myself just to be friendly, I was given the cold shoulder and a look like I had 3 heads. I've been here 2 years and know none of my neighbors. Its hard living anywhere when everyone is so closed off you can't make friends.

4. The dry overpowering heat: You have to take a big bottle of water everywhere it seems especially because tap water has a weird taste. Skin cancer (yeah I know everyone loves the sunshine, but I like my skin better). You really can't go out and do anything outside from May-October because of the heat and oppressing sunshine. I like to hike and backpack but you can't for the majority of the year because you can't carry enough water. At least back in the midwest I could go outside for the majority of the year and all I need is a light coat here you can't go out because you can't carry enough stuff to survive.

5. Pollution: long commutes, no trees to eat up the smog LA, here we come!!

6. No trees. THere really aren't trees here, they're bushes. Trees are taller than houses and provide shade.

7. No grass, I understand why you don't have it, but there are days where I enjoyed laying outside and having a nap on a warm 75 degree day. Its kinda hard to lay on rocks and dirt. Especially when you have to worry about rocks and scorpions.

I can go on but obviously you get the idea, for me this is hell on earth. I wil say that I have known some good people and at least the public radio stations are good and the sushi restaurants are also good, but there's not much else that I can say is great. I will leave at first opportunity but unfortunately the economy is not allowing me to. For all of you that do love it here thats great and I'm glad you have a situation that you enjoy.

How did you go about leaving teaching? I really want to find a teaching job back in Indiana. If I don't find a job I want to look into another profession. I really want to leave Yuma. I also moved out here from the Midwest for a teaching job and desperately want to leave. My neighbors aren't friendly either. One of my neighbors was stalking me when I first moved here.I have found a nice church that I will miss when I leave. I can't wait for the opportunity to leave.

[bigtallredhead]

Originally Posted by LordBalfor

Secondly, keep in mind that not all illegal immigrants come from Mexico. There are a great many of them who come from much poorer countries further south who simply pass through Mexico on their way into the US. These largely destitute people make up many of the folks you find in border towns in northern Mexico, trying to scrape up enough money to pay someone to help them across the border and get them further north. I definitely found that you should NOT judge Mexico by looking at the border towns - no more than you should judge NYC by looking at it's darkest slums.

Ken

Also, about a third of illegal immigrants are visa over stayers. And there are many smuggled in from China as well, -a lot work in the back of chinese restaurants.

[odinloki1]

Originally Posted by bluebelt1234

How did you go about leaving teaching? I really want to find a teaching job back in Indiana. If I don't find a job I want to look into another profession. I really want to leave Yuma. I also moved out here from the Midwest for a teaching job and desperately want to leave. My neighbors aren't friendly either. One of my neighbors was stalking me when I first moved here.I have found a nice church that I will miss when I leave. I can't wait for the opportunity to leave.

About 2 months into my second year I decided its not worth it, I put in my resignation and left at the end of the school year. There's a penalty for leaving early, so I served the rest of my contract.

[twixcookie]

Originally Posted by Tim Rankin

I believe the original "purchase" of SoCa, AZ & NM was the Treaty of Guadelupe, where we "bought" those lands with a gun to the head of the Mexican who "sold" it to us. Literally.

twixcookie - As an individual, I can only change my own behavior. As an American, I can [mostly] only influence my govt's behavior. Pointing one's finger at another person, or nation, rarely solves any problem. If everyone thought this way it would no longer be "business as usual" as LordBalfor describes. This may sound naive, but it's the only way. It's what Christ, Buddha and so many other religious figures have been trying to tell us for so long.

Your enemy is so often the shadow that you yourself cast.

IF your Christ, your Buddha, etc., tell you to be foolish, then do that. But it is an insult to those who have given their lives for this nation. If you want to give everything back to Mexico, why don't you go move down there? See how free you have it there.

[twixcookie]

Originally Posted by LordBalfor

Hmmm.

"We fought for it" - in historical, international terms that means "we went to war for it" - the time honored way one group of people profits at the expense of another. All nations have grown this way - and they always will. If your neighbors have something you want (land, gold, water, oil, etc) and you are stronger you just take it. Oh you always find a way to justify it, but the fact is, you are taking something that belongs to someone else simply because you can. Not criticizing the US (in particular) here, just a blunt reminder that EVERY country got it's land from SOMEONE ELSE who had it first - usually through violence. It's the way the world works - and always has.

In terms of American History it's called "Manifest Destiny" - the belief that all this land from sea to sea was fated to become the US of A. In truth mostly we just took what we wanted - though sometimes we did pay for it - paying someone else who'd stole it from the original inhabitants (who of course had pushed other people out earlier - the true orginal inhabitants had probably been shoved down to the tip of South America a few thousand years back).

"We fought for it"
In terms of countries it's called "going to war".
In terms of individuals it's called "mugging".

It's just the way the world works. One should always keep this in mind should one start feeling a bit "uppity and morally superior".

The US is a great country, but like every other great county in history, we pretty much stole all the land that makes it up.

Like it or not, that's the way the world works.

Ken

Stolen?? Most of the globe is conquered lands, that were conquered over and over.
Natives here warred among themselves.
If we didn't have Manifest Destiny, the very thing you promote, which is Mexicans coming here to better themselves, wouldn't even exist. There would not be the opportunity that is here.

[DaveV]

Originally Posted by twixcookie

Stolen?? Most of the globe is conquered lands, that were conquered over and over.
Natives here warred among themselves.
If we didn't have Manifest Destiny, the very thing you promote, which is Mexicans coming here to better themselves, wouldn't even exist. There would not be the opportunity that is here.

Bottom line is that "Mexicans" are natives of your area, and Caucasian/Europeans are the aliens..

[LordBalfor]

Originally Posted by twixcookie

Stolen?? Most of the globe is conquered lands, that were conquered over and over.
Natives here warred among themselves.
If we didn't have Manifest Destiny, the very thing you promote, which is Mexicans coming here to better themselves, wouldn't even exist. There would not be the opportunity that is here.

Most of the globe? All of it, I'd say. That's my whole point.
We're no worse than anyone else - but we're no better either in that regard. Everybody steals land - including us..

I'm not quite sure why you say I'm promoting Manifest Destiny. I'm simply explaining what it is - and how we used it as OUR excuse for stealing land from someone else. EVERYONE makes up some excuse, ourselves included - after all, no one wants to admit that we're all really just thugs and thieves.

But the fact is we are, every nation on earth is. Since we were stronger, we simply took what we wanted - just as the folks we took it from had done to someone else earlier. There are no innocent countries.

Ken

[AndyJ]

Originally Posted by DaveV

Bottom line is that "Mexicans" are natives of your area, and Caucasian/Europeans are the aliens..

Actually neither Mexicans nor Caucasians are "natives" of the American Southwest. The first people here were, you guessed it, Native Americans, the Anasazi, the Navajo, the Tohono O'odham, the Apache, and the numerous other tribes who have lived here for centuries (I guess if you really want to get technical about it, they aren't actually "natives" of this land either; they migrated here from northern latitudes at some point long ago that hasn't been determined precisely, across the Bering Land Bridge, into Canada, the northern U.S., and eventually down into the American Southwest). The Spaniards came with Coronado, Juan de Oñate, and others who I don't feel particularly inclined to look up right now. As the United States expanded westward, whites filtered into the area, and long story short, we have the melting pot of cultures in places like Arizona and New Mexico that you see today.

Also, someone mentioned the Treaty of Guadalupe as the "purchase" of NM, AZ, and SoCal, which is only partially correct. The Treaty of Guadalupe Hidalgo officially ended the Mexican-American War, and gave the U.S. government all of California, the northern 3/4 or so of AZ, about half of NM, as well as Utah, Nevada, and parts of Wyoming and Colorado. This treaty was signed with the insurance of property rights for Mexicans in the newly obtained area, although America's fulfilling of this stipulation is questionable.

The remainder of AZ and a small portion of southern NM were obtained through the Gadsden purchase of 1853 (residents of AZ and NM may recognize this name - there is a small town by the name of Gadsden, AZ near Yuma, and Gadsden High School in Anthony, NM). Northeastern NM had already been bought as part of the Lousiana Purchase, and I believe the rest was obtained through the Compromise of 1850, essentially from the Rio Grande to Texas, although I could be wrong about this.

There is a lot of history with our part of the country that not everyone is familiar with - however, it is still important regardless of how much of it is covered in history text books, as it explains a lot about why certain things are the way they are in the Southwest.

[Bummer]

Interesting and informative post, AndyJ

However, no matter which theory is considered or proven to be correct . . . there are NO NATIVES!

Everyone, including the so-called Native Americans and/or the so-called Native Mexicans, are anything but true natives!