10 Reasons Not To Move To Tucson (Phoenix, Vail: places to live, zip code, commute to)

[sierraAZ]

Originally Posted by LordBalfor

but before I got my BS in Computing

LOL! Ken, you got one of those lovely BS degrees. I saw this on somebody's profile - education: BS (that explains it all ). Hilarious-sounding degree! Go get an MS!

[sickofIL]

Hey, at least he doesn't have an MBA. Most people with a BS are hard working good people. However, I have only met or worked with one person that had a MBA that was worth anything. Somehow this country has gotten to the idea that you need a degree to do anything, or a computer. They sent people to the moon with slide rules and electro-mechanical relays! And I wonder how many of those people didn't even have a degree.The local Junior College has a certificate course for Janitorial. What would you teach? How to mix soap? or how to use a mop?

Although i knew an auto mechanic that had a masters in history that found that he could make much more money as an auto mechanic than a history teacher.

[odinloki1]

Originally Posted by sickofIL

Hey, at least he doesn't have an MBA. Most people with a BS are hard working good people. However, I have only met or worked with one person that had a MBA that was worth anything. Somehow this country has gotten to the idea that you need a degree to do anything, or a computer. They sent people to the moon with slide rules and electro-mechanical relays! And I wonder how many of those people didn't even have a degree.The local Junior College has a certificate course for Janitorial. What would you teach? How to mix soap? or how to use a mop?

Although i knew an auto mechanic that had a masters in history that found that he could make much more money as an auto mechanic than a history teacher.

You need a degree to get people to pay you to do something. A degree shows your ability to learn and show some self-discipline and that you take your education and a job seriously.

Unfortunately a lot of jobs don't pay a liveable wage. Otherwise people who like to just work their 40 hours and live a modest means would have no problem, then the people who truly want to be a manager or leader can do so and its not a money motivating factor. The sad thing is that if it wasn't for the parasites in Wall Street and Washington, most jobs could pay a decent wage.

[Mi_Mom]

Originally Posted by odinloki1

You need a degree to get people to pay you to do something. A degree shows your ability to learn and show some self-discipline and that you take your education and a job seriously.

Unfortunately a lot of jobs don't pay a liveable wage. Otherwise people who like to just work their 40 hours and live a modest means would have no problem, then the people who truly want to be a manager or leader can do so and its not a money motivating factor. The sad thing is that if it wasn't for the parasites in Wall Street and Washington, most jobs could pay a decent wage.

Man...I'm destined for nothingness then.

I think Bill Gates, Steve Allen, Michael Dell, David Geffen, Steve Jobs, Ralph Lauren should go back. And while he's at it, Sir Richard Branson should go back to high school. Walt Disney too. Hersey and Ford as well. Frank Lloyd Wright would never be taken seriously is he had never gone to High School. Oh. Wait.

If a person has drive and is willing to work hard and pave a path for themselves, I truly believe anything is possible.

And often, if you get your foot in a door somewhere, work your way up with ambition, you will go places. A degree isn't a guarantee of work.

Just my 2 cents.

[odinloki1]

Originally Posted by Mi_Mom

Man...I'm destined for nothingness then.

I think Bill Gates, Steve Allen, Michael Dell, David Geffen, Steve Jobs, Ralph Lauren should go back. And while he's at it, Sir Richard Branson should go back to high school. Walt Disney too. Hersey and Ford as well. Frank Lloyd Wright would never be taken seriously is he had never gone to High School. Oh. Wait.

If a person has drive and is willing to work hard and pave a path for themselves, I truly believe anything is possible.

And often, if you get your foot in a door somewhere, work your way up with ambition, you will go places. A degree isn't a guarantee of work.

Just my 2 cents.

I wonder how many dropouts didn't amount to anything for every Frank Lloyd Wright or Bill Gates. I'm sure since you can come up with a few examples I must be wrong. I'm sure all those other dropouts weren't driven at all.

Just because you come up with some exceptions to a rule doesn't mean anything. Most of those that you mentioned either were extremely lucky, or so extraordinarilly gifted that they would be successful.

A degree isn't a guarantee of work, but it sure makes work a lot more likely.

[TulipO]

There are a lot of people in working class industries who do hold a higher education. The restaurant business is full of them. It's no longer a dead-end career choice and there is a lot of money to be made. Furthermore, it is flexible as far as schedule goes so many of the people in the restaurant business (the majority in fact of the places I have worked at least) are in college and paying for it with their waiting job. Then there are career servers-educated people who make a terrific living as servers and bartenders.
As far as the Pima thing goes-the U of A is very cheap for instate residents. It's a land-grant college, and that's why I took my M.F.A there. After graduation I had plans to try for a teaching position-but the pay was ****, and the opportunities limited. Arts programs in public schools are the bastard children. They are the first to lose funding and the last to hire new faculty. Also even after passing my teacher certification the best I could do was land a substitute position on the special ed level. I don't have any training with special ed students! The theaters in Tucson are almost all not for profit, and the only one that is not does not hire local. Everyone must be a union member (and my membership is still pending) or they try to only hire U of A interns and pay about $8.00/hour. I got a temporary job with the City of Tucson directing their holiday season theater performance, and then lost it, because they cut the program before I even had a chance to submit a proposal. So I went back to serving, and the pay was way better than what I would have pulled down teaching. But its still not enough. Think about it on this website, it lists average rents in Tucson at $606. Where I live now the average is $686. Gas prices are the same there as they are here. Food costs are higher in Tucson than they are where I am now.
Whatever, my point is that Tucson didn't work out for me, and its not working for a lot of other people. In fact there are so many people here in my new city who are from Tucson, that we've decided there needs to be a section of the city re-named "Little Tucson." There was a question on the table, and I responded to it. If you disagree with me fine. I don't know what your experience there has been, or what you do for a living, but whatever it is, it doesn't invalidate my experiences.

[Mi_Mom]

Originally Posted by odinloki1

I wonder how many dropouts didn't amount to anything for every Frank Lloyd Wright or Bill Gates. I'm sure since you can come up with a few examples I must be wrong. I'm sure all those other dropouts weren't driven at all.

Just because you come up with some exceptions to a rule doesn't mean anything. Most of those that you mentioned either were extremely lucky, or so extraordinarilly gifted that they would be successful.

A degree isn't a guarantee of work, but it sure makes work a lot more likely.

I'm not the one who said you needed a degree to get someone to pay you to do something. There are plenty of people working in our world now without degrees. And I'm pretty sure some of them are climbing the corporate ladder.

Given the state of many economies around the country (at state and even more local levels) I'd think quite a few people are struggling to find jobs/ make ends meet etc ....degree or not.

[awsun1980]

Well said, Mi_Mom. A degree isn't a guarantee for success. Why spend thousands of dollars & be in debt for no sound guarantee? I'd rather be happy in my line of work & not just go to work for some big company simply because I have a fancy degree. And just because you went to college doesn't mean you're more 'self-disciplined' than the rest of us. Our economy has gone to crap, anyway, who can afford to even go to school???

Originally Posted by Mi_Mom

I'm not the one who said you needed a degree to get someone to pay you to do something. There are plenty of people working in our world now without degrees. And I'm pretty sure some of them are climbing the corporate ladder.

Given the state of many economies around the country (at state and even more local levels) I'd think quite a few people are struggling to find jobs/ make ends meet etc ....degree or not.

[xwideopenskyx]

Originally Posted by TulipO

There are a lot of people in working class industries who do hold a higher education. The restaurant business is full of them. It's no longer a dead-end career choice and there is a lot of money to be made. Furthermore, it is flexible as far as schedule goes so many of the people in the restaurant business (the majority in fact of the places I have worked at least) are in college and paying for it with their waiting job. Then there are career servers-educated people who make a terrific living as servers and bartenders.
As far as the Pima thing goes-the U of A is very cheap for instate residents. It's a land-grant college, and that's why I took my M.F.A there. After graduation I had plans to try for a teaching position-but the pay was ****, and the opportunities limited. Arts programs in public schools are the bastard children. They are the first to lose funding and the last to hire new faculty. Also even after passing my teacher certification the best I could do was land a substitute position on the special ed level. I don't have any training with special ed students! The theaters in Tucson are almost all not for profit, and the only one that is not does not hire local. Everyone must be a union member (and my membership is still pending) or they try to only hire U of A interns and pay about $8.00/hour. I got a temporary job with the City of Tucson directing their holiday season theater performance, and then lost it, because they cut the program before I even had a chance to submit a proposal. So I went back to serving, and the pay was way better than what I would have pulled down teaching. But its still not enough. Think about it on this website, it lists average rents in Tucson at $606. Where I live now the average is $686. Gas prices are the same there as they are here. Food costs are higher in Tucson than they are where I am now.
Whatever, my point is that Tucson didn't work out for me, and its not working for a lot of other people. In fact there are so many people here in my new city who are from Tucson, that we've decided there needs to be a section of the city re-named "Little Tucson." There was a question on the table, and I responded to it. If you disagree with me fine. I don't know what your experience there has been, or what you do for a living, but whatever it is, it doesn't invalidate my experiences.

Sounds to me as if you're blaming Tucson for things that are the direct result of your own choices. There are plenty of well paying jobs in Tucson, you just have to have the right skill set, experience or education in fields that are in demand. I moved to Tucson from Ohio for the better opportunities that exist here and found the best job of my life. If there is no money to be made in Tucson, explain how can families afford to live in 200k + homes?

[mdtoaz]

Originally Posted by moving-to-AZ

Well said, Mi_Mom. A degree isn't a guarantee for success. Why spend thousands of dollars & be in debt for no sound guarantee? I'd rather be happy in my line of work & not just go to work for some big company simply because I have a fancy degree. And just because you went to college doesn't mean you're more 'self-disciplined' than the rest of us. Our economy has gone to crap, anyway, who can afford to even go to school???

It's depressing!! I recently got my bachelor's in social work - yeah, I know... going for the big money.

The really depressing part? You need a master's degree to even get a job. And any job will hopefully pay roughly $35K. Yeah, my school loans already outweigh that. Okay, I'm gonna go cry now.