Tucson in bottom 10 for business (schools, college, tax)

[actinic]

Attention job hunters!

'It’s an embarrassment to be ranked behind Detroit in any metric regarding economic development. What’s worse is that Tucson and Detroit are the only two cities that made repeat appearances among MarketWatch’s bottom 10 worst business cities.'

'Tucson also fared 10th worst among cities using 2006 Census data measuring the concentration of companies, their satellite operations, annual payroll and employment.'

'Other metrics in which Tucson showed poorly were having the seventh worst job loss rate among cities since the recession began.'

Opinion : What puts Tucson in the bottom 10 - Inside Tucson Business - newspaper, business news, opinion, classifieds

[azhiker]

Top ten in miserable weather: Grand Rapids makes the cut!

Don't you live there, actinic?

Weather Averages for Grand Rapids, MI

You couldn't pay me to live there.

[sierraAZ]

Originally Posted by azhiker

Top ten in miserable weather: Grand Rapids makes the cut!

Don't you live there, actinic?

Weather Averages for Grand Rapids, MI

You couldn't pay me to live there.

That would explain his undying interest in our forum.

[ZonyPony]

Originally Posted by azhiker

Top ten in miserable weather: Grand Rapids makes the cut!

Don't you live there, actinic?

Weather Averages for Grand Rapids, MI

You couldn't pay me to live there.

Originally Posted by sierraAZ

That would explain his undying interest in our forum.

Now, now, guys...

Actinic just happens to be a person who doesn't appreciate "fanboys" and "fangirls". He has one of these personalities which feels the need to give us the whole picture. Remember... he's indicated that we should not always be positive about something... because it can be quite offensive to... others.

I guess I can understand that. Perhaps we are fanatics, and are too much into Tucson... into Arizona... and we fail to see the "ugliness" as others see it.

For instance... just the other day, I hit a pothole. Also, I was backed up in traffic for a while... and... you guys know I'm always ga-ga over our weather... plus, I'm sure I gloss over Tucson's economy and politics quite a bit...




Shame on me.

[Spot]

Originally Posted by ZonyPony

Now, now, guys...

Actinic just happens to be a person who doesn't appreciate "fanboys" and "fangirls". He has one of these personalities which feels the need to give us the whole picture. Remember... he's indicated that we should not always be positive about something... because it can be quite offensive to... others.

I guess I can understand that. Perhaps we are fanatics, and are too much into Tucson... into Arizona... and we fail to see the "ugliness" as others see it.

For instance... just the other day, I hit a pothole. Also, I was backed up in traffic for a while... and... you guys know I'm always ga-ga over our weather... plus, I'm sure I gloss over Tucson's economy and politics quite a bit...




Shame on me.

How pathetic. Actinic posts a legitimate article on the state of the Tucson economy and you respond with this...

[Marcy1210]

Wonder what'll happen to Denver businesses if Hizzoner Hick runs for guv now that Ritter's announced he's not going for a 2nd term? John Hickenlooper promoted business heavily in Denver because he was a business owner long before he became mayor. The next mayor may not be so business minded, and Denver's rank may fall.

Just because Tucson is in the bottom 10 for business, doesn't mean that Tucsonans can't still be proud of their city and cheer it on. I don't see people rallying around Denver that way, and I've lived in Colorado for 35 years. Tucsonans may grouse and groan about a lot of urban problems, but many cities share those problems, and they share poor city management like Tucson, but Tucson residents still have a strong pride in their city and work hard to try and make it better despite the powers that be.

ZP's post was not pathetic, it is the post of a man truly respectful and caring about his city and tired of people who continually write negative posts about a place he loves. Maybe if more people had such a positive feeling about Tucson, it wouldn't have as many of the problems people grouse about.

As for those critics: Push 'em back, push 'em back, waaaaaaay back! (Preferably to the North, like, oh, say Grand Rapids, MI?)

[Spot]

Originally Posted by Marcy1210

Wonder what'll happen to Denver businesses if Hizzoner Hick runs for guv now that Ritter's announced he's not going for a 2nd term? John Hickenlooper promoted business heavily in Denver because he was a business owner long before he became mayor. The next mayor may not be so business minded, and Denver's rank may fall.

You mean the mayor with the 80% approval rating that's now running for Governor? You think his becoming governor will hurt CO? Really? Are you paying attention? The politicians from both parties who are planning to run to replace the mayor are phenomenally qualified. We enjoy an abundance of political leadership/talent here in Denver. It's refreshing after living in Tucson, where they are currently trying to recall council members for incompetence.

It's about the fundamentals Marcy. It's about investment, education, infrastructure, tax policy, etc... Tucson is doing nothing to address the core economic problems of the City. Tucson continues to shed jobs, talent, entrepreneurs, college grads, etc... The front page story in the Star is that McDonald's is hiring 500 people. That's a good thing? Really? The best economic news the Star can report is that McDonalds is hiring?

There is absolutely no comparison between Tucson and Denver. Denver is investing $900 million in downtown renovations on top of another $7.8 billion on light rail, on top of all the private investment in the city. Tucson can't get Rio Nuevo off the ground after 10 years. There is simply no comparison.

Originally Posted by Marcy1210

Just because Tucson is in the bottom 10 for business, doesn't mean that Tucsonans can't still be proud of their city and cheer it on.

True. People often celebrate failure. Just look at the Republican Party.

Originally Posted by Marcy1210

I don't see people rallying around Denver that way, and I've lived in Colorado for 35 years.

Seriously?

The people in Denver are some of the happiest I have ever met. Overall they are healthy, educated, affluent and effective. The people here love their city, as evidenced by the fact that the voters continuously support investment and development. When was the last time Tucson passed a $7+ Billion program to improve their city? Cheerleading without results isn't all that meaningful...

Originally Posted by Marcy1210

Tucsonans may grouse and groan about a lot of urban problems, but many cities share those problems, and they share poor city management like Tucson, but Tucson residents still have a strong pride in their city and work hard to try and make it better despite the powers that be.

Work hard? On what? What's improved over the last 40 years? Seriously? Please tell me a few things that have improved in Tucson since 1970.

Not the roads. Not the schools. Not the economy. Not the downtown. So what exactly have they been working hard on? I'm a native. My family has been in AZ for a long time. I grew up there and I can tell you without equivocation that there isn't a single thing about Tucson 2010 that's better than Tucson 1970, 1980, 1990, or 2000 and it continues to decline...

Originally Posted by Marcy1210

ZP's post was not pathetic, it is the post of a man truly respectful and caring about his city and tired of people who continually write negative posts about a place he loves. Maybe if more people had such a positive feeling about Tucson, it wouldn't have as many of the problems people grouse about.

I disagree. ZP spends a lot of time on this forum attacking actinic and anyone else who disagrees with his views. It gets old. I realize that his purpose is to quell debate, but seriously, this is an internet forum and debate/information sharing/discussion is the entire purpose. The guy started a whole other thread (Tucson Fanboys & Fangirls) that does little more than attack actinic for posting this article on the Tucson economy. God forbid that actinic points out the obvious! How is that even remotely productive?

Look, there is nothing wrong with loving where you live. I think people should seek out communities that they enjoy being in. But pretending that everything is okay when it's not is a disservice to your city and yourself. Denver isn't perfect. Tucson isn't perfect. But here we acknowledge our shortcomings and work to correct them. And that's exactly why Denver is leading the US in the economic recovery, healthy living, housing values and many other measures, while Tucson is falling further behind. So please don't compare the two. They are not comparable.

[actinic]

Originally Posted by Spot

How pathetic. Actinic posts a legitimate article on the state of the Tucson economy and you respond with this...

Hey Spot it's quite alright, the personal attacks illustrate their failure to refute and expose them for who they are. The readers see this.

[Grannysroost]

Originally Posted by Spot

How pathetic. Actinic posts a legitimate article on the state of the Tucson economy and you respond with this...

I am wondering if Actinic posted that article due to being 'below Detroit' since he is in Michigan? Now if Tucson would have fared a little better, he probably would not have posted it...I do think we need the good and bad points, but he is a bitter person trolling AZ looking for a reaction from the fanboys and fangirls in my opinion, just to bait and get them stirred up

I do think a lot of people in Michigan feel the same way about Michigan. I have lived in a lot of cold-weather states and don't go to their state boards to put down the weather or the economy. There are good and bad points to living anywhere, and I would love to see something posted about what he/she enjoyed in Arizona to prove not being a troll just looking for attention, I think quite a few fanboys and girls would then lighten up quite a bit, in other words some helpful info and areas, places to eat, places to go, etc.

[Grannysroost]

Originally Posted by Grannysroost

I am wondering if Actinic posted that article due to being 'below Detroit' since he is in Michigan? Now if Tucson would have fared a little better, he probably would not have posted it...I do think we need the good and bad points, but he is a bitter person trolling AZ looking for a reaction from the fanboys and fangirls in my opinion, just to bait and get them stirred up

I do think a lot of people in Michigan feel the same way about Michigan. I have lived in a lot of cold-weather states and don't go to their state boards to put down the weather or the economy. There are good and bad points to living anywhere, and I would love to see something posted about what he/she enjoyed in Arizona to prove not being a troll just looking for attention, I think quite a few fanboys and girls would then lighten up quite a bit, in other words some helpful info and areas, places to eat, places to go, etc.

Oh and here is a bit of the article which he did not bring up..only the headline...

"The trouble is the report by MarketWatch, a division of Dow Jones & Co. which also publishes the Wall Street Journal, is being cited for causes that have little or nothing to do with the methodology that came up with the rankings.

The rankings didn’t even consider small businesses, entrepreneurship or trying to do business with local governments."

How they come up with the statistics is important to get the overall message, right?