Went to "Nightmare" at GUTS church tonight!!! Wow!!! (Tulsa: home, casino)

[Goodpasture]

Originally Posted by Annemieke Roell

......... a visit to the local jail .............

So you would tour a jail? Kinda like a zoo? see the guys and gals in orange suits sitting there playing cards? some lesson...........

Besides, too many warrants out there for my comfort..............

[Annemieke Roell]

Originally Posted by Goodpasture

So you would tour a jail? Kinda like a zoo? see the guys and gals in orange suits sitting there playing cards? some lesson...........

Besides, too many warrants out there for my comfort..............

I taught my kids right from wrong because those kind of decisions should be made based on their own merit .... NOT out of fear of going to hell.

[Goodpasture]

Originally Posted by Annemieke Roell

......... NOT out of fear of going to hell.

or jail?

[Jammie]

Originally Posted by Annemieke Roell

Ok .. so what about people who are not Christians?

Personally, I find a visit to the local jail much more effective. And that way they learn what the consequences are of ILLEGAL behaviour and dumb decisions rather than sinful ones. Because that "sinful" only effects a portion of the population.

A visit to a jail might be good to teach them what could happen to them immediately for their bad behavior. But it's also good to teach them what could happen in the long term for their sinful habits.

Personally, I'm not into the "fire and brimstone" sermons, but awareness of what eternal life could be like for unatoned sins and unrepentant sinners is important, too.

And what am I doing? We're kinda discussing religion in the state forum and I'm adding to it.

[Goodpasture]

I can preach if you want.........



But it is difficult to discuss Oklahoma in any meaningful fashion unless you consider the tremendous influence and undercurrent of Christianity. What many people do not realize (and Sally Kern is an example) is that just because I say I am a Christian and you say you are one as well, does not mean we see eye to eye on lots of topics. Oklahoma Christians support divergent views.....from insisting we protect each other from evil by voting against casinos, to those who believe it is an individuals responsibility to do what they should, without regulatory oversight.

As a state, Oklahoma needs to be discussed with the evangelical Christian majority well in mind......not discussing it would be a disservice.

[Raelyn28]

Hi Annemieke, I didn't find the "nightmare" presentation as fire and brimstone at all. I found it as bad choices produce bad consequences. Sin is simply anything contrary to God's best for us and the bible says that we have ALL sinned and fall short of the glory of God, wether we are Christians or not. That is why we need Jesus because He forgives us of those sins. I forgot to mention that at the end of the presentation they do talk about forgiveness. It isn't fire and brimstone at all. It is about grace and forgiveness but it is again a choice that we make. We can either accept what Christ did for our sins or reject it.

I am beginning to think that I kind of get myself into these discussions that turn into debates.

I was just trying to be positive about something for a change and I happen to find many great choices for worshipping and serving God in Tulsa. At least I am off the subject of driving.

[Annemieke Roell]

Originally Posted by Jammie

A visit to a jail might be good to teach them what could happen to them immediately for their bad behavior. But it's also good to teach them what could happen in the long term for their sinful habits.

Personally, I'm not into the "fire and brimstone" sermons, but awareness of what eternal life could be like for unatoned sins and unrepentant sinners is important, too.

And what am I doing? We're kinda discussing religion in the state forum and I'm adding to it.

That only works for people who believe in hell.

What does it matter which forum it is in? This is a free flow of conversation.

[Annemieke Roell]

Originally Posted by Goodpasture

or jail?

You know EXACTLY what I mean so stop acting as if you don't

[Annemieke Roell]

Originally Posted by Raelyn28

Hi Annemieke, I didn't find the "nightmare" presentation as fire and brimstone at all. I found it as bad choices produce bad consequences. Sin is simply anything contrary to God's best for us and the bible says that we have ALL sinned and fall short of the glory of God, wether we are Christians or not. That is why we need Jesus because He forgives us of those sins. I forgot to mention that at the end of the presentation they do talk about forgiveness. It isn't fire and brimstone at all. It is about grace and forgiveness but it is again a choice that we make. We can either accept what Christ did for our sins or reject it.

I am beginning to think that I kind of get myself into these discussions that turn into debates.

I was just trying to be positive about something for a change and I happen to find many great choices for worshipping and serving God in Tulsa. At least I am off the subject of driving.

As I said before, that only works for those who believe in that stuff.

BTW ... what is wrong with debates? They sure are a lot more interesting than superficial chitchat.

[tookey]

Originally Posted by Annemieke Roell

As I said before, that only works for those who believe in that stuff.

BTW ... what is wrong with debates? They sure are a lot more interesting than superficial chitchat.

I agree, I like a good old fashioned debate.