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Old 07-24-2017, 10:45 AM
 
Location: Minneapolis
2,332 posts, read 2,882,504 times
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One thing has always bothered me about the battle of the bastards episode. Before the battle Sansa never told Jon that the knights of the Vale were coming. You would think that would be an important piece of information. The first time I watched it I thought it was an oversight in the writing of the episode. After rewatching that episode earlier this month, there is a brief scene at the end of the battle after the knights arrive where they show Sansa noticing that Jon has survived the battle. I wonder if her real intention was for John and the Wildling army to lose the first part of the battle and then have the knights of the Vale come in and save the day after Jon was dead.

She may have thought that as a woman, some of the people of the north would never accept her as the head of House Stark as long as there was a male child of Ned Stark alive (even a bastard). If Jon was dead and she was in Winterfell it would allow her to be the unquestionable leader of the north.

She is unique in the story in that we don't know what her goals are. If she has gone young Cercei on us, she would be smart enough to hide it.

Last edited by Drewcifer; 07-24-2017 at 10:54 AM..
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Old 07-24-2017, 11:00 AM
 
412 posts, read 404,064 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by djmilf View Post
Arya is taking the King's Road to Winterfell, while Jon is sailing down the east coast of Westeros to Dragonstone. They aren't going to meet anytime soon.
Ah. Ok. I must have forgotten that.
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Old 07-24-2017, 11:04 AM
 
5,106 posts, read 6,062,113 times
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post 241 ^^^^

Continuing my Elizabeth Tudor comparison to Sansa: this could be why and not so machiavellian as to get Jon killed but

Elizabeth Tudor called her leige men together to ride 'in support of' her half sister Queen Mary Tudor (when Jane was put on the throne for 9 days) but somehow Elizabeth's forces didn't quite arrive until Mary had the groundswell of support to overwhelmingly take the throne after having claimed the crown. (meaning Mary Tudor)

Point being similar to what you describe as the battle of Bastards, Elizabeth became the master of waiting to see before committing herself. Drove her ministers crazy later on but it worked well for the country of England.

So another plus for my Sansa + Elizabeth I comparison
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Old 07-24-2017, 11:04 AM
 
Location: Ohio
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watched e1 last night. Interesting. I hated how Cersei dismissed Tommen.... geez lady, he was your son! " he betrayed us" bull honky.
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Old 07-24-2017, 11:37 AM
 
11,019 posts, read 6,570,281 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by djmilf View Post
I do find it strange that Jon Snow's friend at Castle Black, the new Lord Commander, didn't dispatch a raven to Winterfell with the news of Bran Stark's reappearance.
Hasn't it been said that not all the stories are taking place at the same time. Otherwise there would be weeks upon weeks where some of the characters are just traveling and not involved in the story. It could be that the Wall storyline is slightly ahead, or dragonstone slightly behind, which would effect the order in which Winterfell receives their ravens.
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Old 07-24-2017, 12:21 PM
 
Location: Parts Unknown, Northern California
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sundaydrive00 View Post
It could be that the Wall storyline is slightly ahead, or dragonstone slightly behind, which would effect the order in which Winterfell receives their ravens.
Yeah, or it could be that the writers screwed up and didn't think about how viewers would be seeing this.

If the wall storyline is lagging behind other events, then the show could have been edited differently and the Bran arrives at the wall scene shown after Jon has decided to travel to Dragonstone.

This was a goof, not an artistic decision.
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Old 07-24-2017, 12:38 PM
 
Location: Texas
42,203 posts, read 49,753,916 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ohky0815 View Post
watched e1 last night. Interesting. I hated how Cersei dismissed Tommen.... geez lady, he was your son! " he betrayed us" bull honky.
Thats called rationalization and minimizing.
So you don't have to face your grief.
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Old 07-24-2017, 01:08 PM
 
Location: Parts Unknown, Northern California
36,951 posts, read 17,431,639 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ohky0815 View Post
watched e1 last night. Interesting. I hated how Cersei dismissed Tommen.... geez lady, he was your son! " he betrayed us" bull honky.
The one redeeming quality Cersei possessed was that she did love her children. Now all three are dead, two at the hands of enemies Cersei made, and one a suicide in response to her slaughtering his wife and fellow religious travelers. She murdered her husband, and has lost the affections of her twin brother, and made a homicidal enemy of her other brother. And all of it is her own fault.

The choice is to embrace her own role in bringing about all the suffering and misery, or to go into denial. Her characterizing Tommen as a traitor is part of that denial....it wasn't her fault, it was Tommen's for falling for that scheming Margaery Tyrell and allowing the High Sparrow to influence him.
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Old 07-24-2017, 01:14 PM
 
Location: NJ/NY
9,598 posts, read 9,467,492 times
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In season one Ned Stark told Arya that one day she will marry a lord or a prince and rule by his side and she will have children, etc, etc. (In other words, she will be domesticated.)

She responded "Thats not me."



Does this show the scene with Nymeria in a different light?
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Old 07-24-2017, 01:24 PM
 
11,019 posts, read 6,570,281 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AnesthesiaMD View Post
In season one Ned Stark told Arya that one day she will marry a lord or a prince and rule by his side and she will have children, etc, etc. (In other words, she will be domesticated.)

She responded "Thats not me."



Does this show the scene with Nymeria in a different light?
Yes. That was said after the episode. Arya was at first sad that Nymeria left, but then realized that Nymeria has changed since their last meeting, and going back to being a pet at Winterfell isn't her.

I wouldn't be surprised if Arya also felt that going back to Winterfell is no longer who she is and ends up changing course again.
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