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Old 06-26-2018, 10:36 AM
 
Location: Crooklyn, New York
27,611 posts, read 24,793,924 times
Reputation: 11185

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The other thing that's aggravating about this show is that nothing seems to have consequences. Emily may be dead or....is she really dead because if she's a host who's really a part of Ford's game then she's not really dead because her consciousness has been replicated? Then, of course, Dolores says you're never really dead so long as someone remembers you so tons of people we previously thought were dead could still be alive. Ford is forcing Bernard to make these evil decisions--or is he really because he could just be part of Bernard's imagination. Maeve is dead, but is she really because Felix and the other guy will no doubt salvage her and fix her up in time for Season 3. Bernard shoots Dolores square in her head, but guess what, she transplanted her consciousness into a copy of Charlotte Hale, so she's still alive! Wrongfooted you again!!!

The "are they or are they not a host" thing is almost like a crutch the writers can lean on to blot out mistakes and change storylines on a whim. At this point, would anyone be surprised if Ford walks out of some backroom and we discover that everything we've seen so far is one large simulation, similar to the "Hang the DJ" episode of Black Mirror? I wouldn't. This show has opened itself to myriad ridiculous possibilities.

Given how much disbelief needs to be suspended to watch this show--hosts apparently have no capacity for digestion even though they drink like sailors, the hosts get tons of live ammo from seemingly nowhere, the Delos mercenaries employ dumber military strategy than 1940 France--the storyline needs to be so much more rewarding to keep the average viewer invested. Even the whole concept of "the Door" as this physical place hosts travel to in order to cross over into the Valley Beyond seems pointless considering that Dolores was able to upload Teddy's consciousness without physically carrying him there. If The Valley Beyond was simply about beaming the hosts' consciousness into an anonymous server, then why couldn't Ford do that from the very beginning?

Last edited by BajanYankee; 06-26-2018 at 10:59 AM..
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Old 06-26-2018, 10:50 AM
 
Location: Hiding from Antifa?
5,823 posts, read 3,766,928 times
Reputation: 4980
^^^ Best description of the chaos of Westworld I have seen to date.
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Old 06-26-2018, 11:55 AM
 
Location: Crooklyn, New York
27,611 posts, read 24,793,924 times
Reputation: 11185
Quote:
Originally Posted by astrohip View Post
This thread is so full of hate-watching and schadenfreude. I can't recall another TV thread where so many people dislike it so much, and yet return over and over to post about it. Or have dire predictions for the future (like Lost?).
I don't get posts like this. If someone has actually watched the show, and had a negative reaction to it, then they have every right to post here as much as someone who watched the show and had a positive reaction to it. I have no problem with someone posting 100% critical comments about a show so long as two criteria are met: (a) it's clear they watched the show and (b) the comments are well-thought out and substantive. I don't see the difference between someone who posts a well-thought out critical response and someone who posts a well-thought out positive response or someone who posts a not well-thought out critical response ("It sucks") and someone who posts a not well-thought out positive response ("Awesome!!!"). I see no reason to hold one group to a different standard.

Really, if you think about it, the negative comments on message boards have a lot more value than the positive ones. I was reading a transcript of an interview of Luke Cage's director and he said that a lot of the negative feedback on Reddit and other places online forced the writers to think more about the pacing and direction of the show. I'm not sure how much value exists in "It's so awesome!" posts you get from time to time.

At the end of the day, I think C-D is a large enough space to accommodate a wide range of opinions and I don't think we need a thought police going around trying to shame dissenters into silence.
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Old 06-26-2018, 12:39 PM
 
Location: Houston/Brenham
3,567 posts, read 4,195,255 times
Reputation: 6186
Quote:
Originally Posted by BajanYankee View Post
I don't get posts like this. If someone has actually watched the show, and had a negative reaction to it, then they have every right to post here as much as someone who watched the show and had a positive reaction to it. I have no problem with someone posting 100% critical comments about a show so long as two criteria are met: (a) it's clear they watched the show and (b) the comments are well-thought out and substantive. I don't see the difference between someone who posts a well-thought out critical response and someone who posts a well-thought out positive response or someone who posts a not well-thought out critical response ("It sucks") and someone who posts a not well-thought out positive response ("Awesome!!!"). I see no reason to hold one group to a different standard.

Really, if you think about it, the negative comments on message boards have a lot more value than the positive ones. I was reading a transcript of an interview of Luke Cage's director and he said that a lot of the negative feedback on Reddit and other places online forced the writers to think more about the pacing and direction of the show. I'm not sure how much value exists in "It's so awesome!" posts you get from time to time.

At the end of the day, I think C-D is a large enough space to accommodate a wide range of opinions and I don't think we need a thought police going around trying to shame dissenters into silence.
And I agree with all of this. I probably didn't make my point very well.

I feel like there are people in this thread, who are simply posting the same negative points over & over & over. It's like they want to win the "this show sucks and I can prove it thru pure volume of posts" award. Posting what you don't like is part and parcel of a TV thread. I do it all the time, my latest being Yellowstone. But I made my point, and that was it. But had I made the same point ten times, it becomes overbearing to everyone else reading that thread.

Having said all this, there's no reason for me to harp on. It just distracts from the discussion. I appreciate your feedback.
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Old 06-26-2018, 12:55 PM
 
Location: Crooklyn, New York
27,611 posts, read 24,793,924 times
Reputation: 11185
Quote:
Originally Posted by astrohip View Post
And I agree with all of this. I probably didn't make my point very well.

I feel like there are people in this thread, who are simply posting the same negative points over & over & over. It's like they want to win the "this show sucks and I can prove it thru pure volume of posts" award. Posting what you don't like is part and parcel of a TV thread. I do it all the time, my latest being Yellowstone. But I made my point, and that was it. But had I made the same point ten times, it becomes overbearing to everyone else reading that thread.

Having said all this, there's no reason for me to harp on. It just distracts from the discussion. I appreciate your feedback.
No problem. I just get tired of people in different forums who are always like "Why are you guys saying bad things about the show? If you don't like it, then stop posting." If someone is just dropping by to call the show garbage, then I can understand the complaint, but some people get angry if people criticize a show no matter how thoughtful the critique is.
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Old 06-26-2018, 01:36 PM
 
Location: Maine
15,078 posts, read 19,718,275 times
Reputation: 17188
Quote:
Originally Posted by BajanYankee View Post
I just get tired of people in different forums who are always like "Why are you guys saying bad things about the show? If you don't like it, then stop posting."
The Internet was invented for futile complaining. That's why we're all here.
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Old 06-26-2018, 03:53 PM
 
193 posts, read 76,594 times
Reputation: 555
Quote:
Originally Posted by BajanYankee View Post
They are basically playing a game of cat and mouse with Redditors at this point. The writers are more concerned about wrongfooting superfans than they are telling a good story. Or maybe they think the two are one in the same.

Westworld reminds me of the Dee-Jay who simply refuses to play any popular music and spends hours looking for the most obscure songs to demonstrate his eclectic musical taste. It doesn't matter whether his selections ruin the flow and energy of the party--all that matters is the smug sense of satisfaction he feels when someone says "Wow, I've never heard this before. You really dug deep in the crates for that one!" Obviously, there's nothing wrong with working in new music, but when the focus becomes almost purely about showing off your knowledge rather than creating a mood, you've gone off track. Westworld is similar in that the writers seem to be pre-occupied with "easter eggs" and "major reveals" rather than plot development.
EXACTLY. Very well said and insightful.

Its a beautifully realized/shot/art directed yet very gimmicky show. And I agree that it tries to create some kind of esoteric code language for the people who are really into it. Me? I don't have the energy to find all the hidden clues if I am too busy noting that the story itself is an ambitious mess.
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Old 06-26-2018, 04:23 PM
 
7,649 posts, read 5,404,882 times
Reputation: 14357
Default 'Westworld' stars Ed Harris, Jeffrey Wright break down that puzzling finale

https://www.usatoday.com/story/life/...ils/727266002/

Quote:
Harris, an acclaimed film and stage actor in his first regular TV role, applauds viewers who immerse themselves in the complexity of "Westworld," but advises others to simply go along for the ride.

“If you enjoy watching it, get what you can from it and talk about it with your friends,” he says. “My mother watches and doesn’t have any clue what’s going on, but she enjoys seeing her son, so there you go.”
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Old 06-27-2018, 04:59 AM
 
5,762 posts, read 2,958,186 times
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I agree with most of the frustrations of the show stated here.
The show has become way too ADD and unfocused.

I originally was intrigued with the show’s examining the nature of consciousness, and there has been a part in the script that tries to examine the nature of “freedom and choice” and the parallel in the hosts conditioning with human conditioning via our DNA programming and our conditioned personalities and sensory perceptions.

Are we humans actually just programmed “hosts” to the gods?
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Old 06-27-2018, 08:22 AM
 
2,491 posts, read 1,252,566 times
Reputation: 2912
Yeah, I was torn over this season. One hand I loved some of the storylines and seeing the other "worlds". I also liked knowing more of the backstories. However, William's character got lost in the end which was disappointing. And I'm all for being clever but damn it shouldn't be such a chore to follow a good storyline. They could have made it more linear and still have some good surprises!


It's interesting that they are paying attention to the Reddit comments and adjusting accordingly. Hopefully next season will be less confusing!


I'm still confused...was William a host or not?
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