U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > U.S. Forums > U.S. Territories
 [Register]
U.S. Territories Puerto Rico, Guam, U.S. Virgin Islands, etc.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 1.5 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Jump to a detailed profile or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Business Search - 14 Million verified businesses
Search for:  near: 
 
 
Old 06-08-2012, 09:19 PM
 
80 posts, read 188,894 times
Reputation: 70

Advertisements

The United States has the advantage and is not letting go of any of its colonies, territories, commonwealths, etc. The US Government will never allow Puerto Rico, Guam or the US Virgin Islands to truly gain independence in the long run. What other territory, colony or commonwealth has gained independence in recent times from the United States?
Quick reply to this message

 
Old 06-09-2012, 09:15 AM
 
Location: On a Long Island in NY
3,926 posts, read 3,942,931 times
Reputation: 2966
The thing is though that the vast majority of people in US territories are opposed to independence.

Guam and the USVI have movements to become territorial commonwealths like Puerto Rico and the Northern Mariana Islands currently are. Puerto Rico and Guam also have statehood movements that are extremely powerful and electorally successful (the New Progressive Party in Puerto Rico and the Republican Party in Guam).

The Philippines became independent in 1946. It's very debatable whether independence has been a positive thing for The Philippines and as recently as 2004 there were Philippine presidential candidates advocating a return to being a US territory.

Palau, Micronesia, and the Marshall Islands were never US territories per se. They were US administered UN trust territories. Like the Filipinos they were never US citizens in the first place. Filipinos and residents of the Pacific Trust Territories were "US protected persons". Some Filipinos did get US citizenship through military service but it died with them.
Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-11-2012, 09:53 AM
 
43 posts, read 63,082 times
Reputation: 17
Quote:
Originally Posted by La Boricua Rosa View Post
The United States has the advantage and is not letting go of any of its colonies, territories, commonwealths, etc. The US Government will never allow Puerto Rico, Guam or the US Virgin Islands to truly gain independence in the long run. What other territory, colony or commonwealth has gained independence in recent times from the United States?


Well the Federated States of Micronesia is perhaps the only example you can find as of late who gained some type of "independence" from the US in 1986, however, those territories still enjoy limited benefits from the US as part of the Compact Free Association. President Reagan at that time addressed the country when independence was granted, you can actually find the video on YouTube, and it is very interesting to say the least. The independence of Philippines are due part because of the presence of Japan in the area, one can make a case that once US defeated Japan in WW2 then some in the congress felt that Philippines was no longer a necessity; see the treaty of Manila. This type of practice has been done over and over with US whether is Iraq in 80s, Afghanistan, etc once US occupies a country and then no longer see as beneficial then in which US would part ways diplomatically or not. US Congress ultimately decides a future of those occupied territories regardless of the uproar. In the case for PR, no question that PR was more of a military colony then anything based certain factors. PR at one point was administered by the bureau of insular affairs, as some people may not know that it was the war department for the US. The obvious benefit for US it was the location of PR. Interesting side note, few miles away from Vieques there is some British Navy ships under the bottom of the ocean from ww2. From what I found out these were faulty ships that were unable to be fixed by the US. Less than a century before the British tried to invade PR for the same reason “Location ,Location, Location” once British began to occupy other Caribbean islands.
Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-11-2012, 11:29 AM
 
43 posts, read 63,082 times
Reputation: 17
Quote:
Originally Posted by tom77falcons View Post
You are incorrect about the population demographics of Hawaii. Whites there make up around 30% of the population at most, maybe even only a quarter. The vast majority is Asian mix. So Hawaii is not a majority white state by any means. I'm not a fan of PR statehood, but just wanted to correct your misconception of the population of Hawaii.

Based on 1950 Hawaii Census counted majority white, I am not saying that is the case now or ever was, however, I know Hawaii has a rich population of Asian descendants but one of the points I am trying to bring to the picture that usually the process of statehood must be taken with a grain of salt whether of course natives is major population who gets "counted" is what really matters. Few years ago if I am not mistaken someone from Hawaii sued the US government for violating the 1863 treaty for not counting those who still practice been call "natives to the kingdom". If I can just remember the name of the Hawaiian then it all makes sense the point I am trying to make.
Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-11-2012, 11:55 AM
 
Location: On a Long Island in NY
3,926 posts, read 3,942,931 times
Reputation: 2966
Quote:
Originally Posted by antillanosiempre View Post
Well the Federated States of Micronesia is perhaps the only example you can find as of late who gained some type of "independence" from the US in 1986, however, those territories still enjoy limited benefits from the US as part of the Compact Free Association. President Reagan at that time addressed the country when independence was granted, you can actually find the video on YouTube, and it is very interesting to say the least. The independence of Philippines are due part because of the presence of Japan in the area, one can make a case that once US defeated Japan in WW2 then some in the congress felt that Philippines was no longer a necessity; see the treaty of Manila. This type of practice has been done over and over with US whether is Iraq in 80s, Afghanistan, etc once US occupies a country and then no longer see as beneficial then in which US would part ways diplomatically or not. US Congress ultimately decides a future of those occupied territories regardless of the uproar. In the case for PR, no question that PR was more of a military colony then anything based certain factors. PR at one point was administered by the bureau of insular affairs, as some people may not know that it was the war department for the US. The obvious benefit for US it was the location of PR. Interesting side note, few miles away from Vieques there is some British Navy ships under the bottom of the ocean from ww2. From what I found out these were faulty ships that were unable to be fixed by the US. Less than a century before the British tried to invade PR for the same reason “Location ,Location, Location” once British began to occupy other Caribbean islands.
Read this again:
Quote:
Palau, Micronesia, and the Marshall Islands were never US territories per se. They were US administered UN trust territories. Like the Filipinos they were never US citizens in the first place. Filipinos and residents of the Pacific Trust Territories were "US protected persons". Some Filipinos did get US citizenship through military service but it died with them.
A very, very different situation from Puerto Rico. Puerto Ricans will never give up birthright US citizenship which rules out independence and free association. Only those who presently have US citizenship would keep it under free association, not their unborn children and grandchildren.

Besides the PPD formally renounced sovereignty yesterday at their annual convention saying that it would violate the "shared citizenship and national sovereignty between the US and Puerto Rico" and that "Commonwealth takes place and can only be developed within the framework of our permanent union with the United States of America"

Last edited by WIHS2006; 06-11-2012 at 12:03 PM..
Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-14-2012, 07:10 PM
 
1,446 posts, read 2,512,846 times
Reputation: 887
What about the Panama Canal Zone? That was a US territory from 1903 until 1977.
Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-14-2012, 08:19 PM
 
Location: On a Long Island in NY
3,926 posts, read 3,942,931 times
Reputation: 2966
Quote:
Originally Posted by lentzr View Post
What about the Panama Canal Zone? That was a US territory from 1903 until 1977.
The Panama Canal Zone did not have any permanent Panamanian population. There were American citizens who worked for the Panama Canal Company and they numbered several thousand at a given time, these were people from the mainland working a job overseas. Panamian employees of the Company were never offered US citizenship.
Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-20-2012, 08:24 AM
 
594 posts, read 459,085 times
Reputation: 439
Quote:
Originally Posted by La Boricua Rosa View Post
The United States has the advantage and is not letting go of any of its colonies, territories, commonwealths, etc. The US Government will never allow Puerto Rico, Guam or the US Virgin Islands to truly gain independence in the long run. What other territory, colony or commonwealth has gained independence in recent times from the United States?
Polls show Puerto Ricans don't want independence. So it's sort of a moot point.

Puerto Ricans seem to be pretty comfortable with the current setup, though I wish they would vote for statehood (not sure why, I have no dog in this fight, so to speak).
Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-20-2012, 08:28 AM
 
594 posts, read 459,085 times
Reputation: 439
Quote:
Originally Posted by WIHS2006 View Post
The thing is though that the vast majority of people in US territories are opposed to independence.
Some people, for political reasons, like to bang the independence drum to make the U.S. look bad, but the reality is current relationships are far from "Imperial." It's beneficial for a lot of people to be in the U.S. system. Not having a foreign policy can be a thorn in the side of nationalists, and I get that a lot of territorial people dislike having military bases and tourists around, but those aren't "evil" things. Towns everywhere hate tourists, regardless of country. And big factories or military bases inconvenience people everywhere.

Personally, if I were a citizen in the territories, I'd want statehood just so I could finally have a say in all aspects of governance.

EDIT: And after looking at the Puerto Rican plebiscite options, it seems really confusing for a vote. Too many options. Instead of giving a plethora of options, why not just have a vote on one thing, say: "Should Puerto Rico become a state of the United States?" If it's voted down, then there you have it.
Quick reply to this message
 
Old 06-20-2012, 08:47 AM
 
68 posts, read 51,244 times
Reputation: 55
Quote:
Originally Posted by WIHS2006 View Post
Read this again:
A very, very different situation from Puerto Rico. Puerto Ricans will never give up birthright US citizenship which rules out independence and free association. Only those who presently have US citizenship would keep it under free association, not their unborn children and grandchildren.
[SIZE=3]The US and the rest of the world recognize foreign births, meaning that if you have not renounced your US citizenship- your (unborn) children are US citizens anywhere in the world they are born.[/SIZE]
Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


 
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:
Over $84,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > U.S. Forums > U.S. Territories
Similar Threads

All times are GMT -6.

© 2005-2014, Advameg, Inc.

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25 - Top