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Old 11-05-2018, 06:47 PM
 
Location: Macao
15,720 posts, read 34,833,840 times
Reputation: 9262

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Quote:
Originally Posted by unPescador View Post
If you don't take as a slur then here's something to think about. While it may not be used in a hateful way in everyday conversation (with you) it is at times used as such. And even if it were used a fond and/or friendly manner does that make it ok. In the times during and after slavery many referred to persons of color as darkies and several other "quaint" forms of speech. Was that ok, would that be ok today. So when someone refers to you as a gringo they are stating that you are not one of them, you are white and you don't belong. Sound familiar? Is it going to change, no.
I've lived outside of the U.S. for almost 25 years. Every culture and society has a name of 'foreigner'. The U.S. does too, the word 'foreigner'.

The equivalent of what you are asking is for people to stop using their word for 'foreigner'. Doesn't the word 'Mexican' also equate to 'not being one of us in the U.S.' Should Americans stop using the word 'Mexican' or 'Puerto Rican'.

For me, if I'm living in Japan, and people refer to me as a gaijin, I understand they are talking about a non-Japanese person. If you ban one word, another word is going to replace it anyway.

Just because a person is white, we can't expect all people around the world to ignore that, and pretend that we're not, so as not to offend us. It's just not going to happen.
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Old 11-05-2018, 10:43 PM
 
348 posts, read 567,863 times
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TigerBeer, last sentence I wrote... Is it gong to change, no.
The most common use of gringo is not “ foreigner “ there’s a little more to it. Is it the equivilant of the N word, no. Does it mean mi amigo, no. Is it going to change, no.
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Old 11-05-2018, 10:55 PM
 
Location: Macao
15,720 posts, read 34,833,840 times
Reputation: 9262
Quote:
Originally Posted by unPescador View Post
TigerBeer, last sentence I wrote... Is it gong to change, no.
The most common use of gringo is not “ foreigner “ there’s a little more to it. Is it the equivilant of the N word, no. Does it mean mi amigo, no. Is it going to change, no.
Like anything, it's how you interpret it. Some people add adjectives to 'forienger' as well, particularly in the Trump area. 'F'n Foreigners'...that doesn't mean we should ban people from using the word 'foreigner.'

Anyway, my time in South America, I'd be referred to as 'gringo', just like in Japan, I was referred to as 'gaijin' and everywhere else as something or another. Everywhere I've lived, fellow white people get all jacked up at recognizing themselves as being white. It's really not a big deal.

So what, people see other people as being white. If I'm in a black area of the United States and someone calls me 'the white guy' or 'that white guy'...do I take them to task? No, it's just their way to identify me.

I think white Americans struggle with being seen as white...perhaps because they've been educated to not say another person is black or whatever else. No labels, right? We're all equal. But the reality is that people still think it, and in non-American cultures which haven't been ingrained with this concept of 'pretending to ignore a person's skin color', it's a very foreign concept to pretend to not see and state the obvious.

In other words, if a gringo goes abroad, there is a significant chance someone may notice he's not ethnically or culturally the same as everyone around him.
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Old 11-06-2018, 08:08 AM
 
348 posts, read 567,863 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tiger Beer View Post
In other words, if a gringo goes abroad, there is a significant chance someone may notice he's not ethnically or culturally the same as everyone around him.
No one is going to stop using Gringo. The question here is if it's derogatory. That's established, yes it can be.

An example of your above quote if applied here in the states would be if every foreigner of color, those who are not ethnically or culturally the same as those euro derived... are called Wog(s) or kaffirs, British terms once used throughout the world. Accepted terms in their time but not in todays world.

As far as being treated well in PR, I wouldn't expect you to experience anything less, gringo or not. Although part of the great Puerto Rican diaspora myself and likely referred to as gringo from time to time my only negative encounter in public was being called Blanco by a stranger who was trying to provoke a response.
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Old 11-06-2018, 09:14 AM
 
Location: Pereira, Colombia
716 posts, read 1,812,504 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by unPescador View Post

As far as being treated well in PR, I wouldn't expect you to experience anything less, gringo or not. Although part of the great Puerto Rican diaspora myself and likely referred to as gringo from time to time my only negative encounter in public was being called Blanco by a stranger who was trying to provoke a response.
In a two year span, I had one time where a guy was close to blackout drunk, in my face trying to fight me because I was in HIS bar, sitting down having some drinks with one of HIS women. Get my drift? Apparently all us American guys come to PR thinking we´re the big s___ but in realty, we´re nothing, and we´re a bunch of jerks. He was really, really hoping to fight me over it also. I didn´t bite though, and his friends pulled him away and gave him a bottle of water (he really needed it at that point!). His intentions were foiled, because keeping cool got me the girl that day

There seems to be a general stereotype across Latin America that says that gringos can´t speak Spanish, and some people can´t seem to process it when we do, and do it well to boot. In a low-English place like Colombia, it might mean that people respond to my words with charades, or overly simplistic answers. In PR it usually just meant that some people responded in English no matter what, even after the request for all Spanish conversations. I thought it was nice that people would want to be so accommodating, but it caused me to hit a ceiling real fast with the language. I got to Colombia speaking really well but with low listening skills!

I think it´s safe to say that a gringo doesn´t need to speak a word of Spanish in San Juan or Rincón...if the person they´re speaking to doesn´t know enough English, they will run and find someone who does. In more remote places, I´d say I used Spanish a lot more.
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Old Today, 11:55 AM
 
472 posts, read 820,110 times
Reputation: 444
THE BOTTOM LINE IS:

Living in Puerto Rico is not like living in California, Florida or Idaho. Once that is clear, the rest is a learning experience.

On the surface, Puerto Rico has all the commodities that states have in terms of shopping centers, Wal marts, fast food establishments, Highways, entertainment venues, corrupt politics, crime, very nice people and a good share of nasty ones.

Movies are ALL subtitled, like English flicks are in Sweden, Norway, Holland and most other places many Rican’s think are 100% Bilingual.

Overall, Puerto Rican’s generally function like any country in the world. Similar to the rest of the world, Puerto Rican’s have their own idiosyncrasy, a thing that makes many stateside Puerto Rican’s blow their top.

Rican’s are very proud, specially when presented with patriotic songs, (not god bless America) , food, flag and participation in international competitions where Puerto Rico represents just Puerto Rico. Even in sports competitions, where we duel against the United States, the majority of Puerto Rican’s prefer Puerto Rico, very few the United States.

Nonetheless, we are also a very practical people. We don’t like to rock the boat. If we do, we make sure the water is shallow, where we don’t drown and specially where there are no sharks. We have never learned to swim with sharks like all other fish in the ocean have. This is a mindset that has developed for more than 500 years of colonialism. We are accostumed to it, and when some one points it out , we don’t know what they’re talking about. Maybe that’s why we can’t make up our minds whether to be gringos or remain Puerto Rican. We’ve also noticed how bad Hawiians native Americans have fared.

Spanish IS the main language, with a low percentage understanding English. These English speakers are mostly found near the tourist areas, big cities, not different from the rest of the world. You might run into some returned Nuyorican willing to speak English 10 miles out of San Juan, but these are rare.

puerto Ricans, if not all, prefer to socialize in Spanish. Although some conversations may begin in English, in case gringos are present, however once the Cuba libres take effect every one reverts to Spanish not caring who is present or who doesn’t understand.

However you will never hear Rican’s angrily screaming at gringos, SPEAK SPANISH ! Like gringos scream , SPEAK ENGLISH ! to hispanic immigrants or Rican’s in the United States.

Overall Puerto Rico is a FOREIGN COUNTRY to many gringos. That’s what makes it exotic and different from the ghettos in the United States where POOR folks are basically uneducated, angry and rude. Different from Hawaii, gringos eventually return to the states, and very few second generation Rican’s return to the island to live permanently. Most only return to eat a cod fish fritter in piñones or a Salsa festival, then quickly return to their hotel near the beach.

Last edited by clip314; Today at 12:04 PM..
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Old Today, 12:12 PM
 
472 posts, read 820,110 times
Reputation: 444
Quote:
Originally Posted by unPescador View Post
No one is going to stop using Gringo. The question here is if it's derogatory. That's established, yes it can be.

An example of your above quote if applied here in the states would be if every foreigner of color, those who are not ethnically or culturally the same as those euro derived... are called Wog(s) or kaffirs, British terms once used throughout the world. Accepted terms in their time but not in todays world.

As far as being treated well in PR, I wouldn't expect you to experience anything less, gringo or not. Although part of the great Puerto Rican diaspora myself and likely referred to as gringo from time to time my only negative encounter in public was being called Blanco by a stranger who was trying to provoke a response.

Pescador, Where have you been living since 2016?

Roughly 50% Of Americans, post 2016, are definately not upset about being called WHITE. The nation is divided 50-50, or is it you don’t read the news.
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Old Today, 12:33 PM
 
Location: Pereira, Colombia
716 posts, read 1,812,504 times
Reputation: 677
Quote:
Originally Posted by clip314 View Post
very few second generation Rican’s return to the island to live permanently. Most only return to eat a cod fish fritter in piñones or a Salsa festival, then quickly return to their hotel near the beach.
I saw this video and thought of you:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gzkAQ_TkXPQ

Just due to spending more time here, I see this type of thing in Colombia as well. In the Bogotá airport, it´s common to see families of monolingual kids and their bilingual parents, wearing the soccer jersey even though it´s not game day, sometimes wearing hats or draped in the flag. Most people don´t seem to mind, but you can tell that some think they look ridiculous/just as foreign as some European or North American backpacker.
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