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Old 01-24-2011, 12:23 PM
 
Location: On the "Left Coast", somewhere in "the Land of Fruits & Nuts"
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jtur88 View Post
If you want to pursue an interest in astrology, it would be a good idea to get some scientific founding into it. You might want to read
Michel Gauquelin The Scientific Basis of Astrology. Stein and Day Publishers. New York, 1969. Paperback version: Natl Book Network, 1970 ISBN 0-8128-1350-2.

Gauquelin is often criticized as exaggerating the evidence for astrology, but it is an interesting read, and not scientifically difficult.

His most convincing evidence is that even very simple marine organisms are able to keep track of astronomical movements and events, and would not be able to survive if they could not. He concludes then that life on earth depended on the astrological prediction of events, and humans may have this vestigial remnant.
Michel Gauquelin - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Thanks for mentioning Gauquelin's research. I also like the studies that psychologist Carl Jung did, examining the natal charts of hundreds of longtime married couples, to see if there were any astrological indications for marital "success". And he noticed that the best indicator was when the Sun of one partner was located in the same sign as the Moon of the other partner.

Speaking of which, my own interest in astrology is more of an appreciation for it as a sort of "symbolic language", akin to Jung's ideas about universal "archetypes". And Brit. psychotherapist Liz Greene not only uses astrology and Jungian therapy to work with her clients, but she also has written many insightful books on so-called "Jungian astrology".

BTW, what is it about astrology, that the very mention of it always seems to prompt a bunch of "demonizing" by either the religious or the "scientific" Fundamentalist types? Folks who obviously don't know squat about it to begin with, and yet they always seem so threatened by it?! Methinks that maybe like some "Family Values" Republicans, they protest too much!
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Old 01-24-2011, 03:21 PM
 
Location: Under the Redwoods
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Mateo asks, "....what is it about astrology, that the very mention of it always seems to prompt a bunch of "demonizing" by either the religious or the "scientific" Fundamentalist types? Folks who obviously don't know squat about it to begin with, and yet they always seem so threatened by it?!..."

That's a good question. I have begun writing hubpages and they have a forum there. Some @zz there continues with his 'you are all idiots' attitude even after providing him with the information he challenged 'us' to provide.
One of his questions was 'what scientists and what books?' (that show study and support of astrology) - when given names and titles he called it fiction.
Oh well....

Anytime one talks about 'the occult' - which is where astrology falls even though it is no longer a hidden knowledge, people freak out in some way. There are those who say it goes against God....however, there is A LOT of astrological talk in the bible that is using and pointing to the stars and planets in a accepting way. One can even match the processions of the equinox to the stories in the bible.
As for scientists being jerks - I don't believe it. A true scientist is not spending time on these kinds of forums, let alone in an astrology discussion, unless they do find something to it and want to discuss it on an exploratory level.
I also work with tarot which brings this same sort of criticism and those that make declarations that astrology or tarot is bogus have not spent any time working and studying in this area of life and humanity.
Some just feel the need to be always right know it alls. And if that is what makes their world go around, have at it. It does not change what I KNOW from personal experience.

My father was a scientist and a psychic. And from what he taught me about the foundation of scientific study...astrology IS science.
Science is about observation and cause and effect. From what is observed, a conclusion is made.
Through observation, astrologers have found that when Saturn returns to the position of a native (current position of Saturn being at the same location at a person's -native- birth AKA 'Saturn Return')
that the native finds themselves faced with heavy times and big changes and challenges.
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Old 01-24-2011, 04:48 PM
 
Location: On the "Left Coast", somewhere in "the Land of Fruits & Nuts"
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I hear 'ya re: the personal observation part, and that's pretty much the way I've approached astrology over the years, starting with first accidentally noticing odd stuff like the fact that all the birthdays of friends tend to fall in certain "clusters" around specific parts of the year. Or that things begun during a "Mercury Retrograde" really do turn out kinda unexpectedly "wonky" (a lot like Moon Void of Course)!

And so on I've continued to learn, only incorporating those parts of astrology that I've personally observed and seem to have some validity (even if I don't necessarily understand the "why"). To me that's just basic "empiricism", i.e. trusting your senses and observation, without any preconceived bias, one way or the other.

I tend to put the "scientific" Fundamentalists and "born-again Atheists" in much the same category as the "religious" kind (Judaeo-Christian, or otherwise). Probably owing to Pluto's recent journey thru "dogmatic" Sagittarius (among other things), they all seem to be desperately seeking some sort of "absolute rules", to govern theirs (and everyone else's) lives. But even worse than that, and you see it especially in politics now, is they need to frame it in almost "apocalyptic" terms, like it's all part of some colossal battle between the forces of Good and Evil, God and Satan, Science and Religion, Liberals & Conservatives, "Socialists" & the "Free Market", whatever.

Never quite got into Tarot. Partly because I don't know enough about it, and also because I just relate more to the systematic nature and inherent "structure" of astrology (that and maybe because I also have a Sun and stellium in 3rd house Cancer and a Grand Trine in Earth). And although Astrology and Tarot are both very much intuitive "arts", Tarot probably seems too much more "subjective" for me to depend on personally, even though I've met some pretty remarkable Tarot readers. And like the related arts such as the I Ching, Runes and other methods of "divination", I believe they all help serve what Jung believed is essential for a healthy and well-rounded life, and that is communicating with the wisdom of our unconscious, via symbolism.

Last edited by mateo45; 01-24-2011 at 05:36 PM..
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Old 01-26-2011, 05:10 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OwlKaMyst View Post
'
Which brings me to another interesting thing I have learned in astrology- Sun Moon mid-points.
Not to get ahead of what we are discussing currently, but there is a 'place' in our charts that indicate a magnetic draw towards others. This draw is not always a good thing, but exists.
Beings that my Sun and Moon are both in Capricorn, it is easy to figure the in-between spot- Capricorn...and it's opposite, Cancer.
Those relationships, the frying pan one, the fire one, the one who was killed and the one I am with now....might you guess what Sun sign they are?
Now I was not aware of this mid-point, learned about it when I dove into my studies after the death of my soul mate.
I found it to be true in my own experiences so I started in on my friend's charts and I would say that about 1/3 of them has been in relationships with their own mid-point signs being their partners sun sign, then another 1/3 had partners with their moon or rising, Venus for the man and mars for the woman, in those mid-point signs.
Very interesting thread! I am wondering you would write more about this mid-point giving information about relationships. Are you saying that we are drawn to other people of the same Sun sign?
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Old 01-27-2011, 05:34 PM
 
Location: in your dreams
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OwlKaMyst View Post

Which brings me to another interesting thing I have learned in astrology- Sun Moon mid-points.
Not to get ahead of what we are discussing currently, but there is a 'place' in our charts that indicate a magnetic draw towards others. This draw is not always a good thing, but exists.
Beings that my Sun and Moon are both in Capricorn, it is easy to figure the in-between spot- Capricorn...and it's opposite, Cancer.
Those relationships, the frying pan one, the fire one, the one who was killed and the one I am with now....might you guess what Sun sign they are?
Now I was not aware of this mid-point, learned about it when I dove into my studies after the death of my soul mate.
I found it to be true in my own experiences so I started in on my friend's charts and I would say that about 1/3 of them has been in relationships with their own mid-point signs being their partners sun sign, then another 1/3 had partners with their moon or rising, Venus for the man and mars for the woman, in those mid-point signs.
^^Someone else quoted this part also, and I must say I'm intrigued as well as a little confused as to figuring out the mid-point...
or what exactly that means...
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Old 01-30-2011, 01:11 PM
 
Location: Under the Redwoods
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Artmomma View Post
Very interesting thread! I am wondering you would write more about this mid-point giving information about relationships. Are you saying that we are drawn to other people of the same Sun sign?
I have been writing like crazy, have about a dozen articles I am working on- various topics, not all astrological in nature, but the one that needs just a final editing review is 'how to find the sun moon midpoint'. When done I shall share the link....you can read it 'there' but bring your questions and comments here for further discussion. Since there is an interest, I'll get to publishing that tonight once back home.
Also- I am still working on the physical features part of this discussion, but resources are thin.....still looking.

Using myself as a midpoint example is confusing. Both my Sun and Moon is in Capricorn so it puts my midpoint in Capricorn.
Like attracts like, as well as opposites attract. So two people with the same Sun sign will relate and connect with eachother on a internal/ego level.

The midpoint is simply an attraction of one person to another based on where the midpoint is found.

A quick easy example-
Mary has a Leo Sun and a Libra Moon. The sign order goes Leo, Virgo, Libra.
So the halfway mark between Mary's Sun and Moon is found somewhere in Virgo. Virgo's opposite is Pisces. Both near and far midpoints count.
Thus Mary is drawn to and probably finds herself with many friends and acquaintances who have their Sun in Virgo or Pisces.
But the Sun is not the only placement for the midpoint attraction.
Anyone having strong Virgo or Pisces placements would also be part of the draw.

Speaking of Sun signs specifically, Mary as we know is a Leo and her husband is a Sagittarius, both are fire signs, so are compatible in that respect. But what Mary's husband has going to increase this draw and compatibility is his Leo rising.
Often the natal will find many friends who's Sun sign is the same as their rising. Mary's husband finds that Mary's inner being very balancing and comfortable. And in return, she can easily relate and understand her husband's personality for he outwardly expresses the same energy that she encounters when faced with her Ego.
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Old 01-30-2011, 02:20 PM
 
Location: Under the Redwoods
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Since we are on the trail of relationships and touched on midpoints- and I'm stuck here til I get home, I can expand upon relationships and astrology.

We have all seen it...questions asking 'how does sign X get along with sign Y?'
Well- that question is fine, but it is only a tiny part of the bigger picture.
While two Sun signs may be compatible, this does not mean that these two are a match made in heaven. Other planetary placements can inhibit the Sun compatibility, slightly or to an extreme.
Rising signs, the Moon, and Venus play a big part, as do the other planets and aspects and houses.
Signs, planets and aspects....oh mi!
Aspects are important for they show if the energy is 'favorable' or 'unfavorable'.

When using astrology for relationships, there are two different methods.
Synastry and Composite charts. Synastry is comparing the two natal charts and composite takes the two charts and makes a new chart using midpoints. (mid point of person's A sun and person's B sun)
Synastry shows the compatibility of the two individuals and Composite shows the dynamics of the relationship.
Two people can be quite compatible, but the relationship dynamics could be hard on a couple.
Things don't always work out between compatible people.
As goes the opposite of that. A weak compatibility may be boosted by a great relationship dynamic.
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Old 02-03-2011, 07:29 AM
 
Location: Illinois
8,536 posts, read 6,360,196 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OwlKaMyst View Post
Hi Nan,
Did you see what I wrote about the Sun, Ascendant and Moon above as goes thier energetic nature?
You have -
(perfect, you just listed your personal planets)
Ascendant: Sagittarius
Sun sign: Scorpio
Moon sign: Aries
Mars sign: Capricorn
Mercury sign: Sagittarius
Venus sign: Scorpio

Reflect upon the nature of the planets in the signs they are in. How do you see the planets working each signs energy? Let me know how you relate the combinations in yourself and I'll pop back in with some thoughts I am holding on to.


What thoughts are you holding on to?
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Old 02-05-2011, 04:56 PM
 
Location: Under the Redwoods
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Oh goodness! Um......I forgot?
I have been so busy that I have not been able to get back here as soon as I had planned on.
If I go back and reread everything, those thoughts will resurface.
However, the storm still keeps me running around, but will try and get the time.
The article on midpoints I have pending was done, but I forgot that I needed some graphics to go with.
That has kept me from getting it up.
Things should settle down here soon....I hope....lol.
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Old 02-15-2011, 03:46 PM
 
Location: Under the Redwoods
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Just to let you know Nan, I have not forgotten about you. I have been so crazy busy, but I have a feeling that things will be slow at work and can make some posts.
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