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Nothing prevents plastering this E. OK area full of trail cams and dozens of searchers to comb the area, to the point not allowing anything to pass through unnoticed, especially the claimed size of bigfoot. You could rent helicopters and drones to fly around to assist in spotting bigfoot as well.
You severely underestimate the magnitude of the SE OK wilderness area. In the 1970's, a couple of elephants escaped from a circus there (in Hugo OK, winter home to several circuses), and it took about 3 weeks to find them. That was with a massive, intense, focused hunt by many groups of searchers who knew exactly what type animal they were searching for. Helicopters were brought in early on. And consider this: the elephants remained in a part of the area that is relatively flat, less timbered, and more cultivated than most of the rest of SE OK.
I was born in that area and lived there until I was 19. The terrain in many places is as wild and dense as it was back then. The Upper Kiamichi River Wildnerness Area alone covers about 10000 acres, and it's just one small undeveloped part of that area. It adjoins the Ouachita National Forest, which extends into AR and covers about 1.8 million acres. Most of this region is hilly and mountainous and heavily timbered and/or covered by dense vegetation.
But was a person looking for bear hair? If a person is not looking specifically for something, they often are not going to find it. If a person was looking for evidence of bears, they would research what to look for, and go out and find it, with that, there is more than enough evidence to show that bears exist.
Out of the many decades, development, hunters, hikers, etc, if bigfoot existed, there would be solid proof by now. We are not talking about some rare, 1 inch big frog or something, this is suppose to be a rather large creature, pretty darn difficult to hide from such numerous possible encounters; there would be at least once, solid piece of evidence uncovered by now.
But as you see, all we get is "come out and see for yourself" "I will not show evidence because you will just laugh", blah blah blah. Yea, as if the possibility of uncovering a creature such as bigfoot would not attract every darn scientists and researcher in the world, but fact is they know bigfoot does not exist, so they will not waste their time. It is like stating pink unicorns exist, but you must come out and see for yourself, come on down to Miami, they are out there!
Bigfoot supporters will never conduct a full search, because by doing so, they will disprove what they have been supporting. Nothing prevents plastering this E. OK area full of trail cams and dozens of searchers to comb the area, to the point not allowing anything to pass through unnoticed, especially the claimed size of bigfoot. You could rent helicopters and drones to fly around to assist in spotting bigfoot as well.
Somewhere I read recently that someone from the West examined hides they'd been told by Tibetan traders were Yeti (Bigfoot) hides. (Found one by one in shops in remote Himalayan villages.) He said they were clearly bear skins, even a polar bear skin that had got traded down from the arctic regions.
You severely underestimate the magnitude of the SE OK wilderness area.
Actually, there's a lot more really wild country on the North American continent than many city dwellers realize. Which is why I still give a 5%-10% probability of there actually being something like a large undiscovered primate out there in the Northwest.
The eastern cougar, for example, is generally thought to be extinct ... but to this day, people in the southern Appalachians continue to report sightings of it (though more recent reports might be due to western cougars moving east).
Almost all the many visitors to the Great Smoky Mountains National Park stay within a short distance of the road through the park that goes through Newfound Gap; and there are quite a few hikers at certain times of the year on the Appalachian Trail. Other than that, there is probably a handful of people hiking on trails elsewhere in the park at any one point of time. Many of these areas are pretty inaccessible. A breeding population of eastern cougars in the southern Appalachians wouldn't be surprising to those who really know the area. Neither would the ivory-billed woodpecker, which is still sighted around Arkansas and Louisiana.
But bigfoot ... if it existed, what would it be, anyway? A hominid, presumably, since the other great apes are not bipedal. But there's no fossil evidence for anything like a giant hominid (or any related species) that lived a relatively solitary life, presumably first in Asia before it crossed the land bridge to the Americas. Gigantopithecus appears to have been most closely related to the orangutans, which is definitely not bipedal (though the size was right, and the Pongids are relatively solitary critters). The possibility of the environment supporting a large species like this and the personal experiences aside, bigfoot doesn't seem to make a lot of sense from an evolutionary perspective.
I understand what you are saying, boxus but my question still remains unanswered, that being, what could possibly account for the strange sightings and or happenings? I asked whether bear could be responsible but that doesn't seem likely so what else could it be? I short, I'm asking for some speculation here. Someone has suggest a surviving population of giant ground sloth. That would explain the smell that has been reported sometimes.
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I vividly remember the older (middle-age) relatives and their neighbors discussing these happenings, which included sightings of large "bear-like" creatures, calves gone missing, trampled brush around their fields, dogs getting all excited in the middle of the night, strange howls and other sounds, etc. They were all convinced some large, strange creature(s) lurked in the woods around their pastures.
These 'stories' are not being made up. So what could be the answer? Just speculate, throw some ideas around.
It was in that very area, in the mid-1960's, before Pat Mayse Lake was created, that many ranchers and rural residents reported strange sightings and happenings.
I was a teenager at the time, living about 15 miles north of there, in SE OK. My close friends had ranching relatives who lived near the Chicota area (where Pay Mayse is now). I would go with them to spend some weekends there with their cousins. I vividly remember the older (middle-age) relatives and their neighbors discussing these happenings, which included sightings of large "bear-like" creatures, calves gone missing, trampled brush around their fields, dogs getting all excited in the middle of the night, strange howls and other sounds, etc. They were all convinced some large, strange creature(s) lurked in the woods around their pastures.
It made a big impression on me, how seriously these folks discussed the events.
They were some of the most down-to-earth people you could ever meet. Their big concern was for their cattle, which was their livelihood. No one at that time, in that area at least, had ever heard the term "bigfoot" or "sasquatch". They just called them the "creatures". The Paris (TX) newspaper ran several articles on it, with pictures and interviews of persons who had seen or experienced these strange happenings.
For those unfamiliar with the area, there are tens of thousands of acres of fields, timberland, and bottomland there, as well as hundreds of miles of rivers, creeks, and tributaries. Some of these waterways drain into the Sulphur River. The Sulphur River is the main river in the Fouke AR area, which was made famous in the 1972 movie "Boggy Creek Monster". Events in that movie reportedly happened during the mid 1960s, around the same time as the events in the Chicota (Pat Mayse) area.
Thanks for your post. I forgot to mention that at Pat Mayes lake there is 5000 acres that was old military practice area. You can walk in by foot but there is said to be ordinance around that is still live. That keeps a lot of people out of there. Also i was told to not let my dog go up the hill behind the restroom building at Pat Mayes west. Some say that if your dog goes out that way he won't come back.
You severely underestimate the magnitude of the SE OK wilderness area. In the 1970's, a couple of elephants escaped from a circus there (in Hugo OK, winter home to several circuses), and it took about 3 weeks to find them. That was with a massive, intense, focused hunt by many groups of searchers who knew exactly what type animal they were searching for. Helicopters were brought in early on. And consider this: the elephants remained in a part of the area that is relatively flat, less timbered, and more cultivated than most of the rest of SE OK.
I was born in that area and lived there until I was 19. The terrain in many places is as wild and dense as it was back then. The Upper Kiamichi River Wildnerness Area alone covers about 10000 acres, and it's just one small undeveloped part of that area. It adjoins the Ouachita National Forest, which extends into AR and covers about 1.8 million acres. Most of this region is hilly and mountainous and heavily timbered and/or covered by dense vegetation.
I have been in the timber east of Broken Bow Resivoir and i have seen the old logging roads where a tree is down across the lane and a year later it is still there. Thus meaning no one sure drove back in there. When you go driving back in there a guy better have a GPS on you or you will have a very hard time coming back out. People that have not seen all this forest area cannot comprehend the vast area. Plenty of room for old hairy.
There is a fair grounds sight in Idabel and it was common for kids to go hang around a horse barn because a big hairy creature hung out in that area. There are quite a few tight lipped people in McCurtain cty. I was told back about 2005 by a county official that there a people in McCurtain Cty that have never been outside the county in their lives
Actually, there's a lot more really wild country on the North American continent than many city dwellers realize. Which is why I still give a 5%-10% probability of there actually being something like a large undiscovered primate out there in the Northwest.
The eastern cougar, for example, is generally thought to be extinct ... but to this day, people in the southern Appalachians continue to report sightings of it (though more recent reports might be due to western cougars moving east).
Almost all the many visitors to the Great Smoky Mountains National Park stay within a short distance of the road through the park that goes through Newfound Gap; and there are quite a few hikers at certain times of the year on the Appalachian Trail. Other than that, there is probably a handful of people hiking on trails elsewhere in the park at any one point of time. Many of these areas are pretty inaccessible. A breeding population of eastern cougars in the southern Appalachians wouldn't be surprising to those who really know the area. Neither would the ivory-billed woodpecker, which is still sighted around Arkansas and Louisiana.
But bigfoot ... if it existed, what would it be, anyway? A hominid, presumably, since the other great apes are not bipedal. But there's no fossil evidence for anything like a giant hominid (or any related species) that lived a relatively solitary life, presumably first in Asia before it crossed the land bridge to the Americas. Gigantopithecus appears to have been most closely related to the orangutans, which is definitely not bipedal (though the size was right, and the Pongids are relatively solitary critters). The possibility of the environment supporting a large species like this and the personal experiences aside, bigfoot doesn't seem to make a lot of sense from an evolutionary perspective.
IRRC There are quite a few more sightings in the area we are discussing rather than NW.
But bigfoot ... if it existed, what would it be, anyway? A hominid, presumably, since the other great apes are not bipedal. But there's no fossil evidence for anything like a giant hominid (or any related species) that lived a relatively solitary life, presumably first in Asia before it crossed the land bridge to the Americas. Gigantopithecus appears to have been most closely related to the orangutans, which is definitely not bipedal (though the size was right, and the Pongids are relatively solitary critters). The possibility of the environment supporting a large species like this and the personal experiences aside, bigfoot doesn't seem to make a lot of sense from an evolutionary perspective.
If a North American wood ape species exists, the prevailing presumption seems to be it's omnivorous. And reported sightings/accounts almost always occur in heavily wooded water-rich areas, which could provide ample food and cover for a limited population:
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In Texas and Oklahoma, roughly ninety percent of the credible reports occur in areas that see at least thirty-five inches of rain per year, or in the eastern third of the state(s). Since the vast majority of Texas and Oklahoma reports are aligned with rainfall patterns, it is possible to dispute allegations of fabrication or mistaken identity. It is not rational to assume or propose that people living in areas with more than thirty-five inches of annual rainfall are more likely to submit a hoaxed report or misidentify what they saw than people living in areas with less than thirty-five inches of annual rainfall. While a few reports have originated in areas with lower amounts of rainfall, they appear to be sporadic and isolated,
Last edited by biscuitmom; 11-07-2014 at 02:51 PM..
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