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Old 09-27-2017, 04:10 AM
 
Location: Planet Woof
2,950 posts, read 3,188,994 times
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I can't name any links or cite specific examples, but I know of situations where there is no obvious psychological, physiological, genetic, or environmental roots in evidence for horrific behaviors in a child and I so still go back to one thing: possession.
As an armchair fan of paranormal investigations I am aware of many instances where ''demonic'' forces have been identified or unleashed in homes and upon innocent lives. I do not doubt that it is real and it is the reason that I no longer aspire to actually ''ghost hunt''.
I also believe that certain situations open up portals for demonic forces, ''evil'', to come through. Some are through deliberate means, others circumstanial.
Children ''born'' evil? I don't know. Children possessed? I am not closed to it being a possibilty. Especially where no other explanation for their behavior seems plausible.
Who can forget ''The Omen''? I understand that the Catholic Church is expanding their outreach for exorcisms due to the high volume of cases of possession. They oughta know...

Last edited by HappyDogToday; 09-27-2017 at 04:20 AM..
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Old 09-27-2017, 08:03 AM
 
Location: Gulf Coast
1,256 posts, read 464,405 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by leanah View Post
I, personally, hate such monsters. I've met them when i was a school girl. Saw a couple of them, the rotten apples of their family, trying to burn a stray dog alive. I am grateful that the cops came quickly and took those "humans" somewhere. Few weeks later their family moved out from the block.
Sometimes the rotten apples just haven't fallen far from the rotten tree. Either the parents refuse to acknowledge the depravity of their children, or they are just as bad. There's a very real thing called "provoking a child to wrath". Little monsters grow up ... and prisons are full.
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Old 09-27-2017, 02:10 PM
 
Location: State of Transition
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Originally Posted by sheena12 View Post
I know this is a controversial topic. To some, all children are innocent. Pure. Perfect and full of love.

And, to be fair, most are. Most children are not born to be bigots or brats. They learn this behavior.


However, in my 50 plus years I have met children who seemed nothing but bad.

I have children and step-children, nieces and nephews. I was a psychiatric pediatric nurse. I also facilitated international adoptions, worked as a summer camp nurse and college admissions counselor.

Let me say that I love children. Look at my career choices. However, I have seen some children who are just plain ....evil.

Yes. This is a shameless spin off from the presence of evil thread which continues to fascinate.

But I thought Evil Kids deserved their own thread.
I read about a kid whose dad was a hardened criminal. But the child had been raised separately from the dad, so that there wasn't an opportunity for "nurture" input from the dad, vs. "nature". Still, the kid grew up to be like his dad. The theory now is that personality traits or inclinations can be inherited. This is part of the theory of epi-genetics, in which trauma of various sorts can become encoded in the genome.

I also think that some kids bring inclinations into this life with them, from past life experience. Some kids display unusual interests and personality traits from a very early age, that don't come from anyone in their environment--no caregivers or siblings. I realize this can't be proven scientifically; it's just something I've observed.

Interesting topic, OP, in view of your background.
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Old 09-27-2017, 02:15 PM
 
Location: State of Transition
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Originally Posted by sheena12 View Post
OMG! I remember this!!!! Unfortunately, I saw some of it on YouTube. There are some things that you just can not un-see.

Those kids were evil to the core. Once again, their murderous behavior was what brought them world wide attention - but they had been involved in horrific and sadistic behavior well before the torture murders.

Once again, I wonder about possession...
My first thought wasn't possession, but what kind of parents did they have? I don't know what era this occurred in, but a lot of alcoholism and drug abuse came about, after the USSR collapsed, and people lost their jobs. And there had been alcoholism before then, as well.
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Old 09-27-2017, 02:26 PM
 
11,424 posts, read 19,433,663 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ruth4Truth View Post
I read about a kid whose dad was a hardened criminal. But the child had been raised separately from the dad, so that there wasn't an opportunity for "nurture" input from the dad, vs. "nature". Still, the kid grew up to be like his dad. The theory now is that personality traits or inclinations can be inherited. This is part of the theory of epi-genetics, in which trauma of various sorts can become encoded in the genome.

I also think that some kids bring inclinations into this life with them, from past life experience. Some kids display unusual interests and personality traits from a very early age, that don't come from anyone in their environment--no caregivers or siblings. I realize this can't be proven scientifically; it's just something I've observed.

Interesting topic, OP, in view of your background.
I can remember when people were talking nature vs. nurture with Richard Allen Davis, the killer of Polly Klaas and I believe Xiana Fairchild, his sister came out to say that he was one of six children and they all had the same rotten childhood....but only he was a killer....

So, I'm not sure. I think it's a combination of both...
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Old 09-27-2017, 03:43 PM
 
Location: The New England part of Ohio
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ruth4Truth View Post
My first thought wasn't possession, but what kind of parents did they have? I don't know what era this occurred in, but a lot of alcoholism and drug abuse came about, after the USSR collapsed, and people lost their jobs. And there had been alcoholism before then, as well.
Sure there are social issues involved. I've traveled to Ukraine many times in my work, and for pleasure.

I admit to not knowing much about their family lives (I'll look it up later) but I can say this - the entire country has really had a lot of hard times. And drinking, not surprisingly is a problem in Ukraine, as it is in many former USSR countries.

However Ruth, you must admit that stuff - with all of the problems in the former USSR countries -thankfully, an extremely rare occurrence.

MANY PEOPLE have bad parents and difficult financial situations - but they don't become torture murderers!


I gave the example of Ricky Kasso, a kid from a rather affluent suburb of NYC. I grew up not from there. By every account, his parents were good people.

Sadly, his father took his own life about ten years ago. Living with the fact that his son, tortured and killed another teenager, was apparently too much for him.

So it happens EVERYWHERE.
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Old 09-27-2017, 04:02 PM
 
Location: State of Transition
72,657 posts, read 64,111,757 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sheena12 View Post
Sure there are social issues involved. I've traveled to Ukraine many times in my work, and for pleasure.

I admit to not knowing much about their family lives (I'll look it up later) but I can say this - the entire country has really had a lot of hard times. And drinking, not surprisingly is a problem in Ukraine, as it is in many former USSR countries.

However Ruth, you must admit that stuff - with all of the problems in the former USSR countries -thankfully, an extremely rare occurrence.

MANY PEOPLE have bad parents and difficult financial situations - but they don't become torture murderers!


I gave the example of Ricky Kasso, a kid from a rather affluent suburb of NYC. I grew up not from there. By every account, his parents were good people.

Sadly, his father took his own life about ten years ago. Living with the fact that his son, tortured and killed another teenager, was apparently too much for him.

So it happens EVERYWHERE.
I'm not sure what "stuff" you're referring to; parents hooked on substance abuse, or sadistic kids, like the ones from Dniepropetrovsk?

What I meant to say was that after the economy collapsed, there was massive unemployment, completely unprecedented, and on a scale in some areas, that Westerners can't imagine. Society devolved from there, tragically, in more than a few cases. As for the kids, I was in a city where the main industry was nuclear submarine building, and shipbuilding. It was a military-industrial complex-based small city. The whole thing shut down. People who could get out, who had relatives in other parts of Russia, left. Those who couldn't get out, or who were Indigenous to the region, stayed.

But what could those who'd lost their jobs do, how could they live? How could they feed their kids? There were hordes of kids roaming the city, not in school, but grade-school kids just roaming around, fending for themselves. Like we used to read about in Brazil; gangs of children with no parents in the picture. I didn't ask anyone I knew there, where the parents were. Had some parents moved away, and abandoned their kids? Were parents too incapacitated from substance abuse to care? The couple I and my little group were with, when we encountered a group of these kids, were clearly embarrassed, so I didn't ask. But there was that sort of thing going on, and Ukraine got hit especially hard. That's why you read about adoptions from there, of kids with severe psychological problems, that strain the coping capacity of their adoptive parents.

But I guess you know about that; it sounds like that's probably a part of your job...?
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Old 09-27-2017, 05:45 PM
 
Location: colorado springs, CO
3,996 posts, read 1,774,084 times
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I think it's 100% neurological ... A form of brain damage.

Maybe there could be abnormal cellular changes that are inheritable. Or oxygen deprivation at birth or at some point during prenatal development, or even an inflammatory reaction to a viral or environmental agent?

I tend to discount a lot of nurture theory though, in general, not just for this topic. I was always fascinated by the lives led by children orphaned during the Holocaust. They had seen unspeakable evil, yet went on to (in the words of one of my former patients); "build a life".
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Old 09-27-2017, 06:02 PM
 
11,424 posts, read 19,433,663 times
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Originally Posted by Tallysmom View Post
I can remember when people were talking nature vs. nurture with Richard Allen Davis, the killer of Polly Klaas and I believe Xiana Fairchild, his sister came out to say that he was one of six children and they all had the same rotten childhood....but only he was a killer....

So, I'm not sure. I think it's a combination of both...
By the way, I was incorrect. Davis killed Polly Klaas, Curtis Dean Anderson killed Xiana Fairchild. And was caught after his next victim managed to flee his clutches.

Anderson died in prison...and two years later police concluded he also kidnapped and killed Amber Schwartz Garcia...

And they are looking for more victims.
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Old 09-27-2017, 07:13 PM
 
Location: Gulf Coast
1,256 posts, read 464,405 times
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I wonder what they were like as children ... and they're just the tip of the iceberg.

Kim Jong Un
Bernie Madoff
George Soros
Adolf Hitler
Hirohito
Pol Pot
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