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Old 04-09-2019, 07:47 PM
 
Location: Ohio
19,159 posts, read 13,907,109 times
Reputation: 15330

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oklazona Bound View Post
So was Roswell real or just a hoax created by the Soviet Union and Stalin? Or?
The Daily Mail article is a hoax by an attention-seeking "journalist" with no credibility.

Quote:
Originally Posted by fisheye View Post
To me it's hard to say exactly what happened. It could have been a real crash site, a classified crash site of a top secret weather balloon or spy plane, Russian disinformation, or simply US disinformation to hide the real truth behind their classified projects?
Physics.

The weather balloon and the crash-test dummy are government lies.

That's easily proven using physics.

Only an object moving parallel to Earth, which precludes the possibility of a weather balloon or crash-test dummy, and moving faster than 200 MPH, which again precludes the possibility of a weather balloon or crash-test dummy, could have made those furrows.

Quote:
Originally Posted by RocketDawg View Post
I think the article is a bunch of malarkey. I'm not sure how she could link the 1947 Roswell incident (if there was one) with Area 51, since Area 51 didn't come into existence until 1955 or so.
Good point.

Quote:
Originally Posted by RocketDawg View Post
Regarding the Russian flyovers ...
What flyovers?

The Russians never over-flew US air-space.

Sputnik wasn't launched until 1957, and satellite fly-overs were the only fly-overs they ever did.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dd714 View Post
It was suppressed because it was a nuclear test related crash ...
No, it wasn't.

The US had no nuclear weapons deployed until 1949, two years after Roswell.

The US only had four nuclear weapons: a Little Boy used on Hiroshima, a Fat Man that was tested in the Trinity test, a Fat Man used on Nagasaki, and a Fat Man that was assembled and ready to be used on Tokyo, if Japan had not surrendered when they did.

After the war, the last Fat Man was disassembled. In an emergency, the US had enough Plutonium, components and parts to assemble nine more Fat Man bombs over a period of 30-90 days, but no deployed warheads.

That makes it impossible for Roswell to be related to anything nuclear.
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Old 04-09-2019, 08:27 PM
 
Location: Madison, Alabama
3,079 posts, read 1,427,548 times
Reputation: 2305
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mircea View Post
The Daily Mail article is a hoax by an attention-seeking "journalist" with no credibility.

Only an object moving parallel to Earth, which precludes the possibility of a weather balloon or crash-test dummy, and moving faster than 200 MPH, which again precludes the possibility of a weather balloon or crash-test dummy, could have made those furrows.


What flyovers?

The Russians never over-flew US air-space.
What furrows? I've never seen any pictures of furrows. I've heard furrows mentioned, but no proof. If you have any, please post ... maybe I just missed them.

Regarding Russian flyovers ... read this: https://nypost.com/2019/04/03/russia...-over-area-51/

I can't vouch for the Russian plane being there, but supposedly it was, and it was recently. Supposedly the treaty also allowed us to fly over their secret areas.
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Old 04-09-2019, 08:33 PM
 
Location: Madison, Alabama
3,079 posts, read 1,427,548 times
Reputation: 2305
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zero 7 View Post
So let's get this straight. The commander of the only nuclear base in the world notifies the newspapers that they recovered a crashed flying disc when in actuality it's a high altitude balloon? Ha! That takes more faith to believe than the Martians landing. He had no business being in command of anything if that's the case.
Did you know Marcel before he dies said the higher ups in government made him change his story.Why would he lie on his deathbed?

https://www.nicap.org/roswell5.htm


I've read about this stuff for a long time since my own sightings in 1973-1976. Wanna know why they haven't 'officially' announced? It's something most people don't wanna know. What I can gather so far...it's all about the soul. That's what I am guessing for now. I also know they have shown many abductees one climate disaster after another back in the 70's and 80's that are now taking place. Plus, there are hundreds of sightings of UFOs every month being reported. How do you dismiss all this so easily?
Read my post that you quoted again ... I never said Project Mogul was what really happened at Roswell. I was just clarifying what Project Mogul, which is what the AF says is what "crashed", was and that it was not a nuclear program. I have no idea if the Roswell incident was a real flying saucer or what it was. Common sense makes seriously doubt that whatever crashed or landed was aliens from outer space though.

I'll say that nobody in his right mind would mistake the balloon material (like you see in your link) with parts of a crashed flying saucer. Either the material in the picture is not what was found on the ranch, or somebody was joking or very sadly mistaken about it being a crashed spacecraft.
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Old 04-09-2019, 08:36 PM
 
Location: Madison, Alabama
3,079 posts, read 1,427,548 times
Reputation: 2305
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zero 7 View Post
Can I ask your opinion about Philip J Corso's motive then? A Lt. Colonel in the army who wrote - The Day after Roswell. He made this up for money right?
My opinion is that Corso isn't (or wasn't) very credible. Just because he was an O-5 doesn't necessarily make him truthful. He either made it up for money or for his moments of fame.
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Old 04-10-2019, 06:07 AM
 
11,926 posts, read 18,095,452 times
Reputation: 18251
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mircea View Post
The Daily Mail article is a hoax by an attention-seeking "journalist" with no credibility.



Physics.

The weather balloon and the crash-test dummy are government lies.

That's easily proven using physics.

Only an object moving parallel to Earth, which precludes the possibility of a weather balloon or crash-test dummy, and moving faster than 200 MPH, which again precludes the possibility of a weather balloon or crash-test dummy, could have made those furrows.



Good point.



What flyovers?

The Russians never over-flew US air-space.

Sputnik wasn't launched until 1957, and satellite fly-overs were the only fly-overs they ever did.



No, it wasn't.

The US had no nuclear weapons deployed until 1949, two years after Roswell.

The US only had four nuclear weapons: a Little Boy used on Hiroshima, a Fat Man that was tested in the Trinity test, a Fat Man used on Nagasaki, and a Fat Man that was assembled and ready to be used on Tokyo, if Japan had not surrendered when they did.

After the war, the last Fat Man was disassembled. In an emergency, the US had enough Plutonium, components and parts to assemble nine more Fat Man bombs over a period of 30-90 days, but no deployed warheads.

That makes it impossible for Roswell to be related to anything nuclear.

I second that - what in the world are you talking about "furrows"? Is that something you read in some blog of the numerous "eyewitness accounts"? I already told you, there are hundreds reportedly claim to be eyewitnesses to the crash site, in reality there were only a half a dozen or so. Come on guys...you are just posting nonsense now. Furrows....



In regards to nuclear...No one said nuclear weapon. This was already discussed, try to keep up - it was nuclear device RELATED. Focus on that term. It was part of Project Mogul - the military were testing microphones flown at high altitude to detect soviet atomic weapon testing.
This is not subject to a question on if it existed or not, this project was declassified in the 70s.
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Old 04-10-2019, 07:02 AM
 
11,926 posts, read 18,095,452 times
Reputation: 18251
Quote:
Originally Posted by RocketDawg View Post
Read my post that you quoted again ... I never said Project Mogul was what really happened at Roswell. I was just clarifying what Project Mogul, which is what the AF says is what "crashed", was and that it was not a nuclear program. I have no idea if the Roswell incident was a real flying saucer or what it was. Common sense makes seriously doubt that whatever crashed or landed was aliens from outer space though.

I'll say that nobody in his right mind would mistake the balloon material (like you see in your link) with parts of a crashed flying saucer. Either the material in the picture is not what was found on the ranch, or somebody was joking or very sadly mistaken about it being a crashed spacecraft.
My understanding (as there is so much confusion around the subject, they don't even know whey the farmer originally found the crash) was there was a balloon, that was used to suspend the test device into the atmosphere. The USAF however said it was a conventional weather balloon which was obviously a lie. The crash sight was nothing more than what looked like tin foil, tape, rubber, wood debris, and the balloon.

I don't see any evidence that there was even a disc shapped crash. Where did they get the idea for flying disc? The farmer reported this fact, apparantly excited about the news going around just starting at the time about UFOs. From there it just grew...
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Old 04-10-2019, 08:46 AM
Status: "Scram gravy ain't wavy" (set 11 hours ago)
 
Location: Greenville, SC
4,426 posts, read 3,553,367 times
Reputation: 8128
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dd714 View Post
In regards to nuclear...No one said nuclear weapon. This was already discussed, try to keep up - it was nuclear device RELATED. Focus on that term. It was part of Project Mogul - the military were testing microphones flown at high altitude to detect soviet atomic weapon testing.
Stalin had a classified R&D project to develop nuclear weapons in WW2. There was all kinds of espionage going on following the war on both sides (most of us were convinced there was a Soviet spy behind every bush -- and in some cases, we were right), and the U.S. exploded its first peacetime thermonuclear device July, 1946. The Doomsday Clock was created January, 1947. The Roswell Incident happened in July, 1947.

Roswell and Project Mogul have to be understood within this historical context: I suspect we knew via espionage even in WW2 that the Soviets were working on the bomb, and that they escalated their efforts after we bombed Hiroshima and Nagasaki. We didn't want the Soviets to have the advantage of knowing that we had spies, knew as a result that they were working on their bomb, and that we might be capable of detecting their "secret" bomb tests from the U.S. Kids were ducking under their desks at school, and "I Led Three Lives", a series about a U.S. communist/Soviet spy/U.S. counterspy, was popular on TV. We were living in a constant state of pants-wetting paranoia.

https://www.theatomproject.org/en/ab...ting-timeline/
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Old 04-10-2019, 10:31 AM
 
9,259 posts, read 2,323,036 times
Reputation: 6360
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dd714 View Post
Think about this - do you think our government employees are organized and efficient enough to keep a secret or maintain a cover story? Even today nothing is secret, everything leaks. If it has gaps, the press makes stuff up. Have we learned nothing?
That's what caused all this UFO confusion in the first place - this was an atomic testing device, the military wanted to keep it a secret and did it in the most confusing, contradictory, and disorganized way possible. That's the government for you. The public knew they were lying so....why not? It must be one of them flying discs from outer space, sounds exciting and sexy, not some boring test instrument.

I love a good story too, I'm glad you guys believe in it like I said, but it's an American Fable with almost all the stereotypical traits on how mythical stories grow and expand over the years. Hey and for the rest, alien life visiting earth - I want to believe. But it was not that day.
Do you remember awhile back when they were talking about declassifying the remainder of the JFK files (trump was trying to take credit for this, but actually they had to be declassified by law at that point), and how the CIA and FBI were trying to challenge the release of certain parts?


There was obviously something the CIA and FBI did not want the public to see in those parts....think about how many years its been since the JFK shooting...and how many people have come and gone from these 2 agencies in that time...and STILL, this has never leaked out over that many years!
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Old 04-10-2019, 11:14 AM
 
11,926 posts, read 18,095,452 times
Reputation: 18251
Quote:
Originally Posted by rstevens62 View Post
Do you remember awhile back when they were talking about declassifying the remainder of the JFK files (trump was trying to take credit for this, but actually they had to be declassified by law at that point), and how the CIA and FBI were trying to challenge the release of certain parts?


There was obviously something the CIA and FBI did not want the public to see in those parts....think about how many years its been since the JFK shooting...and how many people have come and gone from these 2 agencies in that time...and STILL, this has never leaked out over that many years!

Well that proves my point - the government is paranoid and wants to keep everything secret, which just causes more conspiracy theories. There was no leaks in the JFK classified documents because there was nothing worth leaking. What happened when we reviewed these previously declassified documents? - no huge revelations, no proof of conspiracy, and JFK's brain is not being held in some secret government laboratory, nothing of note.
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Old 04-10-2019, 11:15 AM
 
11,926 posts, read 18,095,452 times
Reputation: 18251
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vasily View Post
Stalin had a classified R&D project to develop nuclear weapons in WW2. There was all kinds of espionage going on following the war on both sides (most of us were convinced there was a Soviet spy behind every bush -- and in some cases, we were right), and the U.S. exploded its first peacetime thermonuclear device July, 1946. The Doomsday Clock was created January, 1947. The Roswell Incident happened in July, 1947.

Roswell and Project Mogul have to be understood within this historical context: I suspect we knew via espionage even in WW2 that the Soviets were working on the bomb, and that they escalated their efforts after we bombed Hiroshima and Nagasaki. We didn't want the Soviets to have the advantage of knowing that we had spies, knew as a result that they were working on their bomb, and that we might be capable of detecting their "secret" bomb tests from the U.S. Kids were ducking under their desks at school, and "I Led Three Lives", a series about a U.S. communist/Soviet spy/U.S. counterspy, was popular on TV. We were living in a constant state of pants-wetting paranoia.

https://www.theatomproject.org/en/ab...ting-timeline/
Off topic, but absolutely correct.
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