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Old 11-07-2017, 02:08 PM
 
1,820 posts, read 1,152,135 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bernie20 View Post
Why would loyalists launch terror attacks for the 3 counties of Ulster that became part of the Irish Republic when those 3 counties were majority Catholic and it would have added more Catholics to the population? The exclusion of those 3 counties was done deliberately so that the 6 counties would be majority Protestant.

With partition they wanted to exclude as many Catholics as possible.

The reason why the IRA started their campaign was due to the treatment of Catholics. The IRA got a big boost in recruitment after Bloody Sunday.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bloody_Sunday_(1972)
Thought it was simple enough but I'll try again.

Yes, you are right Protestants were outnumbered in the 3 counties..Cavan,Monaghan and Donegal. As were also the Catholics in the 6 counties.The Protestants in the 6 counties never launched attacks into the 3 counties. However, Catholics living in the 6 counties (and across the border) launched attack after attack in the 6 counties. That is the difference.

'' With partition they wanted to exclude as many Catholics as possible ''. But I think you are missing the point. If they had attacked into the 3 counties and murdered and maimed the people there they would have been doing exactly as the IRA were doing in the 6 counties. The Protestants are in the majority in the 6 counties and left it at that. They did not attack Garda stations in the Republic unlike the IRA who have attacked police stations in BU over and over again.

What treatment of the Catholics do you refer to?
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Old 11-07-2017, 05:12 PM
 
7,873 posts, read 10,224,164 times
Reputation: 5605
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ulsterman View Post
Thought it was simple enough but I'll try again.

Yes, you are right Protestants were outnumbered in the 3 counties..Cavan,Monaghan and Donegal. As were also the Catholics in the 6 counties.The Protestants in the 6 counties never launched attacks into the 3 counties. However, Catholics living in the 6 counties (and across the border) launched attack after attack in the 6 counties. That is the difference.

'' With partition they wanted to exclude as many Catholics as possible ''. But I think you are missing the point. If they had attacked into the 3 counties and murdered and maimed the people there they would have been doing exactly as the IRA were doing in the 6 counties. The Protestants are in the majority in the 6 counties and left it at that. They did not attack Garda stations in the Republic unlike the IRA who have attacked police stations in BU over and over again.

What treatment of the Catholics do you refer to?
i thought only three counties in northern ireland had a protestant majority

antrim
down
armagh

?

perhaps you mean back in the day ?
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Old 11-08-2017, 11:30 AM
 
1,820 posts, read 1,152,135 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by irish_bob View Post
i thought only three counties in northern ireland had a protestant majority

antrim
down
armagh

?

perhaps you mean back in the day ?
Think it was four actually at that time. But even with six counties it was a Protestant majority overall.
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Old 11-08-2017, 11:34 AM
 
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To sum up and put it simply. Ulster lost three counties and accepted it. Ireland lost six counties but didn't accept it.
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Old 11-10-2017, 03:06 AM
 
2,673 posts, read 5,428,571 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ulsterman View Post
To sum up and put it simply. Ulster lost three counties and accepted it. Ireland lost six counties but didn't accept it.
Ireland lost 6 counties. Ulster is an ancient Irish province and was there before Ulster Scots came in the 1600s. The 6 counties was orchestrated to ensure that there was a Protestant majority.

I acknowledge that the Unionists now have a vote in the future of NI. My family have deeper roots in Ulster than a lot of Protestants going back to the Uí Néill. Not sure why you can't acknowledge that the Protestants are relatively recent in the history of Ulster. Irish and Scots have a shared history through Dál Riata should we Irish have a claim to Western Scotland?

I also want to say that Brexit is making a real screw up of the GDA. It is a complete c o c k up.
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Old 11-10-2017, 04:34 AM
 
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Ireland does happen to have a veto if discussions on the border don't get resolved.

Coveney said that the EU had made clear that Ireland's problems are the EU's problems and he did not foresee a situation where Ireland would need to use its veto to defend its position.

"Talking about individual countries using vetoes or blocking things , I don't think is helpful at this stage," he said.


https://www.usnews.com/news/world/ar...n-brexit-talks
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Old 11-10-2017, 11:59 AM
 
1,820 posts, read 1,152,135 times
Reputation: 801
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bernie20 View Post
Ireland lost 6 counties. Ulster is an ancient Irish province and was there before Ulster Scots came in the 1600s. The 6 counties was orchestrated to ensure that there was a Protestant majority.

I acknowledge that the Unionists now have a vote in the future of NI. My family have deeper roots in Ulster than a lot of Protestants going back to the Uí Néill. Not sure why you can't acknowledge that the Protestants are relatively recent in the history of Ulster. Irish and Scots have a shared history through Dál Riata should we Irish have a claim to Western Scotland?

I also want to say that Brexit is making a real screw up of the GDA. It is a complete c o c k up.
Aye, Ulster is an ancient province which has varied over the centuries. At one time it covered an area equal to the present day counties of Antrim and Down. At other times it expanded to cover an area of 12 present day counties.

Protestants are comparatively recent, most arriving in the early 1600s, but some before that. However, they trace their time in Ulster away before the Reformation to the time of the Cruthin. Yes, the Scotti (as the Romans called them) were in Ireland and many moved to Scotland and gave it their name.

The Plantation is seen by many as a homecoming.


Tha Hamecomin

A wee while bak, wae tuk a luk at whit some yins caa "Tha Plantation". As wae pointed oot, it wus mair a hamecomin nor oanythin else. Tha Toon Rhymer explains that here.

Return O Tha Exiles

In boats an ships they landed,
Oan an unforgien shore:
Tae till tha lan an break in grun
Lake ther faithers in days o yore.

These fowk wernae planters
Whin aff tha boats they filed
They were comin hame frae Scotland
Whur yinst they'd bin exiled.

But this tim these Dalriadic fowk
Wud naw bae driven oot again,
They were here tae stay in ther faithers lan
Regardless o famine, persecution ir pain.
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Old 11-11-2017, 12:17 AM
 
2,673 posts, read 5,428,571 times
Reputation: 2607
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ulsterman View Post
Aye, Ulster is an ancient province which has varied over the centuries. At one time it covered an area equal to the present day counties of Antrim and Down. At other times it expanded to cover an area of 12 present day counties.

Protestants are comparatively recent, most arriving in the early 1600s, but some before that. However, they trace their time in Ulster away before the Reformation to the time of the Cruthin. Yes, the Scotti (as the Romans called them) were in Ireland and many moved to Scotland and gave it their name.

The Plantation is seen by many as a homecoming.


Tha Hamecomin

A wee while bak, wae tuk a luk at whit some yins caa "Tha Plantation". As wae pointed oot, it wus mair a hamecomin nor oanythin else. Tha Toon Rhymer explains that here.

Return O Tha Exiles

In boats an ships they landed,
Oan an unforgien shore:
Tae till tha lan an break in grun
Lake ther faithers in days o yore.

These fowk wernae planters
Whin aff tha boats they filed
They were comin hame frae Scotland
Whur yinst they'd bin exiled.

But this tim these Dalriadic fowk
Wud naw bae driven oot again,
They were here tae stay in ther faithers lan
Regardless o famine, persecution ir pain.
Through ydna testing all the people that share the same snp with my brother are all Irish and Scots. It's madness that two closely related people have all this conflict.
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Old 11-11-2017, 01:59 AM
 
5,606 posts, read 3,479,220 times
Reputation: 7413
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bernie20 View Post
Ireland does happen to have a veto if discussions on the border don't get resolved.

Coveney said that the EU had made clear that Ireland's problems are the EU's problems and he did not foresee a situation where Ireland would need to use its veto to defend its position.

"Talking about individual countries using vetoes or blocking things , I don't think is helpful at this stage," he said.


https://www.usnews.com/news/world/ar...n-brexit-talks

Ireland will do exactly what Angela Merkel tells it to do - the country lost its last vestige of international influence when it agreed to pay all the losses of foreign bondholders in the financial crash in order to get a bailout.
Leo Varadkar thinks going on a gay pride march with Justin Trudeau makes him a respected statesman but in reality he's Germany's lapdog.
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Old 11-11-2017, 06:12 AM
 
2,673 posts, read 5,428,571 times
Reputation: 2607
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roscoe Conkling View Post
Ireland will do exactly what Angela Merkel tells it to do - the country lost its last vestige of international influence when it agreed to pay all the losses of foreign bondholders in the financial crash in order to get a bailout.
Leo Varadkar thinks going on a gay pride march with Justin Trudeau makes him a respected statesman but in reality he's Germany's lapdog.
Yes I agree that was just not the right thing to do by the Irish people. I think most people will agree that politicians, no matter where they are from, don't always have the best interests of their population at heart.
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