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Old 10-21-2010, 06:28 PM
 
Location: Downtown Detroit
1,497 posts, read 3,479,551 times
Reputation: 930

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The city versus suburbs debate has been brought up before, but this is truly mind-blowing:

Sprawl, Schmall... Give Me More Development (http://www.oakgov.com/exec/brooks/sprawl.html - broken link)

To give everyone some background, Oakland County is the suburban county north of Detroit. It began expanding extensively after several expressways were built into what was Metro Detroit's rural farmland. Over the last several decades, the leadership of Oakland County (L. Brooks Patterson) has actively poached corporate businesses from Detroit's central business district while the state heavily subsidized suburban developments. Up until today, Oakland County's leadership has displayed an arrogant superiority complex in discussions involving virtually all regional issues affecting the tri-county metropolis. OC's executive, Brooks Patterson, outwardly embraces more sprawl-development even though Metro Detroit has a declining population and there are literally TENS OF THOUSANDS of vacant and abandoned structures causing blight in the region, many of which are located right in his county. Housing prices continue to plummet in Metro Detroit. Brooks Patterson also opposes any effort to build mass transit into Oakland County that connects it with Detroit, even though it is being funded by private investors and the federal transit authority, i.e. not OC money. The sentiment of Oakland County is this: Detroit's woes are our bounty. That is, the more businesses and residents OC can suck out of Detroit, the bigger OC's tax base becomes, even though the entire region is circling the drain. As evidence, I point to two Oakland County cities, Pontiac, which can no longer support a police department, and Troy (one of the wealthiest cities in Metro Detroit) which cannot afford its public library.

If you read Patterson's press release, he goes as far as to describe anything but living in the suburbs as Anti-American, and describes those who promote living in the city as trying to purge themselves of the sin of abandonment. No. I'm not joking. It's crap like this that destroys so many regions, including my own. I hope this alarms people in other metros to avoid electing anyone like L. Brooks Patterson. Community leaders like him destroy cities and metros. Like jackals, they feed on other cities and counties when they are struggling and down. If this type of stuff doesn't stop, it will suck the entire region into it's self-destructive vortex.
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Old 10-21-2010, 10:28 PM
 
Location: Portland, Oregon
1,737 posts, read 948,559 times
Reputation: 2818
Quote:
Originally Posted by ForStarters View Post
The city versus suburbs debate has been brought up before, but this is truly mind-blowing:

Sprawl, Schmall... Give Me More Development (http://www.oakgov.com/exec/brooks/sprawl.html - broken link)

To give everyone some background, Oakland County is the suburban county north of Detroit. It began expanding extensively after several expressways were built into what was Metro Detroit's rural farmland. Over the last several decades, the leadership of Oakland County (L. Brooks Patterson) has actively poached corporate businesses from Detroit's central business district while the state heavily subsidized suburban developments. Up until today, Oakland County's leadership has displayed an arrogant superiority complex in discussions involving virtually all regional issues affecting the tri-county metropolis. OC's executive, Brooks Patterson, outwardly embraces more sprawl-development even though Metro Detroit has a declining population and there are literally TENS OF THOUSANDS of vacant and abandoned structures causing blight in the region, many of which are located right in his county. Housing prices continue to plummet in Metro Detroit. Brooks Patterson also opposes any effort to build mass transit into Oakland County that connects it with Detroit, even though it is being funded by private investors and the federal transit authority, i.e. not OC money. The sentiment of Oakland County is this: Detroit's woes are our bounty. That is, the more businesses and residents OC can suck out of Detroit, the bigger OC's tax base becomes, even though the entire region is circling the drain. As evidence, I point to two Oakland County cities, Pontiac, which can no longer support a police department, and Troy (one of the wealthiest cities in Metro Detroit) which cannot afford its public library.

If you read Patterson's press release, he goes as far as to describe anything but living in the suburbs as Anti-American, and describes those who promote living in the city as trying to purge themselves of the sin of abandonment. No. I'm not joking. It's crap like this that destroys so many regions, including my own. I hope this alarms people in other metros to avoid electing anyone like L. Brooks Patterson. Community leaders like him destroy cities and metros. Like jackals, they feed on other cities and counties when they are struggling and down. If this type of stuff doesn't stop, it will suck the entire region into it's self-destructive vortex.
But how do you really feel about this?
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Old 10-22-2010, 12:25 AM
 
Location: Downtown Detroit
1,497 posts, read 3,479,551 times
Reputation: 930
Quote:
Originally Posted by NeutralZone View Post
But how do you really feel about this?
Haha. Angrier than the forum rules allow me to express. My city has so many great things going for it, and so many great people pulling for it, yet I have to watch one man and his cohorts attempt to suck it dry.

I have to assume that the article I posted above was Oakland County's response to several companies moving back to the central city, as well as the last of four pro sports teams returning to Detroit from the suburbs. Downtown and midtown Detroit are the only growing parts of my region. Many of the new residents here are from out-of-state, such as artists from California and NYC, but a great deal are young Metro Detroiters who do not share the previous generation's thoughts on race and classism and find satisfaction in urban living. Instead of being supportive of the city's progress and encouraging young people to stay here instead of moving to Chicago or other cities, Oakland County rails against it because it wants to remain the captain of a sinking ship.

To me the whole situation is personally distressing, and having to live in a place where one part of the region actively seeks to ruin the other is awful. I am not anti-suburban. I find the suburbs lacking the things I want in life, but I would never label anyone who desires suburban life Anti-American. For an elected official in my region to call me Anti-American because I enjoy living in the city, where I can walk to my job and virtually every amenity I desire, is totally shameful and destructive. What Patterson is doing is steering the ship right into a shallow bay. It is his last ditch effort to vindicate his "spawl" ideology that isn't working, while thousands of young educated people leave Metro Detroit by the year for greener pastures. Obviously, this will eventually prove fatal for the region if it isn't reversed soon. The old automotive wealth that supports Oakland County and the region is mainly comprised of baby boomers whose money will fade away over the next 10-20 years, and then the region will literally, collapse.

I love this place, both the city and suburbs, but if things don't change fast, I'm going to leave too. Unfortunately, I'll be taking my money and family with me. So many of my friends and relatives have given up on the region, in fact, the number one question for college students around here is "where are you going to move once you graduate?" based on the assumption that anyone with the ability to leave, will. It's sooo sad. Detroit is great, but the powers that be continue to crush all progress and would rather drive Metro Detroit into the ground than admit their mistakes. If you read Dante's Inferno, you will find that there's a punishment for this sin.
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Old 10-22-2010, 05:49 AM
 
Location: Cincinnati
3,336 posts, read 6,919,124 times
Reputation: 2084
this sucks. so many of our cities have vast blighted and empty areas just so brand new areas can open up on the outskirts. here in Cincinnati, even though the metro is growing, there are areas just outside the first ring suburbs that are beginning to look completely abandoned while there are areas outside the farthest exurbs that are booming. it is such an inefficient and harmful method of development, but it is what we have embraced as a nation, perhaps accidently. it can be really depressing at times.
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Old 10-22-2010, 07:36 PM
 
Location: Youngstown, Oh.
5,500 posts, read 9,448,889 times
Reputation: 5606
In the Youngstown area, we don't have this sort of intentional draining of resources from the central city. The closest we have is a mayor of an exurban town who rallies against the countywide sales tax to support mass-transit.

The communities around here are insular. They are happy as long as their little piece of the world is OK, even if an adjacent community is having serious problems. Then, when those problems show up in their communities, they are very surprised, as if there was supposed to be some invisible barrier to keep the problems out.
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Old 10-23-2010, 09:00 PM
 
546 posts, read 1,172,502 times
Reputation: 467
Wow that I find to be very disturbing. I have always thought that it is horrifying why municipalities try to compete with each other and not cooperate for the greater good for everyone. When someone does that to still actively promote sprawl it is even more disturbing.
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Old 10-24-2010, 06:40 AM
 
8,680 posts, read 17,216,708 times
Reputation: 4685
Because COMPETITION is FREE ENTERPRISE, darnit, even if they're governments giving away taxpayer money to draw corporate interest! They use the same self-deception to decry high taxes and government spending while never turning down a government-funded project--especially a freeway or other sprawl-feeding government program.
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Old 10-27-2010, 06:00 AM
 
1,783 posts, read 3,874,161 times
Reputation: 1387
This whole pitting local governments against each other does nothing but drain the life out of the region.
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Old 10-27-2010, 07:12 AM
 
Location: St. Louis, MO
758 posts, read 1,632,895 times
Reputation: 945
Why can't we all just get along?

I don't know the situation well enough, and I think it is very wrong to call city dwellers (or suburbanites, as I'm sure has also been done) Anti-American. But when one side attacks, some times it is very difficult not to get your back up and attack right back.

I do agree with one bit of the article, though. Suburbs can (and do) produce new jobs. As people move farther out from the city, there is a need for new...everything. Schools, groceries, shopping, restaurants. The need for this produces new jobs; some are temporary (the construction side), some are more permanent (the managers, the maintenance, the staff).

On the flip side, suburbs can take jobs from the city if all they do is move businesses from the city to the burbs. I don't believe that happens frequently for the essentials and entertainment, but I imagine it can happen for other business and I'm sure that the suburbian schools lure city teachers away with better salaries or whatever.
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Old 10-27-2010, 08:28 AM
 
Location: Downtown Detroit
1,497 posts, read 3,479,551 times
Reputation: 930
Quote:
Originally Posted by hodgemo2 View Post
Why can't we all just get along?

I don't know the situation well enough, and I think it is very wrong to call city dwellers (or suburbanites, as I'm sure has also been done) Anti-American. But when one side attacks, some times it is very difficult not to get your back up and attack right back.

I do agree with one bit of the article, though. Suburbs can (and do) produce new jobs. As people move farther out from the city, there is a need for new...everything. Schools, groceries, shopping, restaurants. The need for this produces new jobs; some are temporary (the construction side), some are more permanent (the managers, the maintenance, the staff).

On the flip side, suburbs can take jobs from the city if all they do is move businesses from the city to the burbs. I don't believe that happens frequently for the essentials and entertainment, but I imagine it can happen for other business and I'm sure that the suburbian schools lure city teachers away with better salaries or whatever.
I agree.

What really bothers me about Oakland County's leadership is that the sprawl they are encouraging is no longer beneficial to anyone except a handful of developers. OC continues to support expansion into its few remaining rural areas at the demise of its older suburbs. It is mind-blowing that the county seat, Pontiac, MI, (a small urban suburb) is literally rotting away with abandoned buildings and residential blight, but county leadership looks out the window and comes to the conclusion that the solution is more subdivisions and strip malls 40 miles from Detroit's central business district. It's total insanity. And, if you own a house in the region, your home value gets dinged every time new-stock housing gets dumped on the market without new population growth to demand it. Thankfully, I rent.
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