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Unread 06-21-2012, 06:12 PM
 
Location: South Beach and DT Raleigh
7,478 posts, read 8,234,739 times
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The only thing that would make me move to the suburbs is financial desperation.
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Unread 06-21-2012, 08:53 PM
 
5,013 posts, read 7,882,738 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Katiana View Post
Are you kidding me? There is an RTD stop 1/4 mile from my house, by the Mormon church. My daughter took the RTD home from middle school for three years! Here are the schedules of the buses serving Louisville.

Locals:
RTD

RTD


Express (stop at the Park N Ride you are referencing):
RTD
RTD
RTD
RTD
RTD
RTD

Sky Ride to DIA:
RTD

Check the maps, too. The buses go right down Main Street, along S. Boulder Rd, Via Appia, Pine and I believe a few other arterials.
Something that stood out for me about those bus timetables was that, with the exception of the Park-and-Ride, which usually exist specifically for commuting hours in many cities, the busses run pretty late at night. It's true that only one runs until after midnight, but it would still be entirely workable to take the bus for an evening out (as long as you weren't planning to hit the bars for last call). That's often not possible in small cities, where the transit systems typically shut down by 7:30PM or so. Another plus for Louisville, both as a place to live and as an example of a suburb which is not limited the way most or all 'burbs supposedly are according to stereotypes.
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Unread 06-21-2012, 09:14 PM
 
5,013 posts, read 7,882,738 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eddyline View Post
One deal killer for me moving from the city to a suburb would be if a trip to the city took two buses for each leg of the trip. Mass transit works for me IF its close and direct on both ends.
There are many suburbs in my metro area that have direct access into the central city by various modes of transit. It's true that I live in the Boston metro, which has one of the more extensive transit systems in the U.S., but I think you'd find something similar in the suburbs of most or all cities with good transit systems. Even in some cities not especially known for great transit there is direct access to downtown from some suburbs. I did a quick check of the Columbus bus system and found that there are direct routes from Westerville, a 'burb along the outer belt highway, into downtown. The main drawback there is that this takes a bit over an hour one way, which is a reality in a fairly expansive city that also has only bus transit, which will be slowed by street traffic. On the other hand, the info about the C'bus system shows a time of only 18 minutes for a direct bus from the affluent near suburb of Bexley into downtown. This is not the best transit system in the country, but it does show that direct transit routes into the city from some suburbs do exist even in metro areas where the transit systems are not among the best. Cities with better systems generally have numerous suburbs with direct transit routes into the city.

An interesting point about the quoted post is that there are often trips within the city which require transfers. It might seem ironic, but this often is the price you pay for extensive transit service. The more places a city's transit system serves, the more transit lines there will be, making it inevitable that many trips around various parts of the city will require transfers. When you can arrange to live and work along the same transit line, and that line also connects to some major shopping and entertainment venues, it's great, but it's simply untrue that you can take public transit all over a major city and travel almost anywhere without ever having to transfer.
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Unread 06-21-2012, 09:22 PM
 
5,013 posts, read 7,882,738 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by deliz View Post
Nothing would make me move back to the Suburbs. Lived in Tennessee for a bit but that would be definitely be classified as rural. Lived in suburb outside of Chicago and I didn't like it at all. I could still walk to a downtown area with some highrises so I thought it would feel somewhat familiar. NOPE... Back to the City for me. There is just such an intrinsic difference that if you love one you most likely won't enjoy the other. But that's what makes it all good. There is something for everyone. I don't really care if someone chooses to live in the sterile burbs...
I appreciated the to-each-his-own sentiment toward the end of this post . . . until the last sentence. To stick with your idea in the two preceding sentences, that these differences are okay because there's "something for everyone," maybe suburban living meets the preferences of many suburbanites well enough that the 'burbs are not sterile to them. Even by more general standards, not all suburbs are "sterile."
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Unread 06-21-2012, 09:31 PM
 
Location: Western Massachusetts
22,774 posts, read 9,856,107 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ogre View Post
There are many suburbs in my metro area that have direct access into the central city by various modes of transit. It's true that I live in the Boston metro, which has one of the more extensive transit systems in the U.S., but I think you'd find something similar in the suburbs of most or all cities with good transit systems. Even in some cities not especially known for great transit there is direct access to downtown from some suburbs. I did a quick check of the Columbus bus system and found that there are direct routes from Westerville, a 'burb along the outer belt highway, into downtown. The main drawback there is that this takes a bit over an hour one way, which is a reality in a fairly expansive city that also has only bus transit, which will be slowed by street traffic. On the other hand, the info about the C'bus system shows a time of only 18 minutes for a direct bus from the affluent near suburb of Bexley into downtown. This is not the best transit system in the country, but it does show that direct transit routes into the city from some suburbs do exist even in metro areas where the transit systems are not among the best. Cities with better systems generally have numerous suburbs with direct transit routes into the city.
I think many if not most burbs have some form public transit to downtown. But is this transit service within walking distance for most residents? Often not, at best it might be a very long walk for many. Of course those that care about transit can choose to live near where there's transit routes and if there was sensible planning the areas by transit stops would be denser. Of course this doesn't help say, teenagers, whose families picked other places.

Most destinations in suburbia are sprawled out. Individual office parks, scattered strip malls can be hard for transit to serve. Though if they are along one throughfare, a bus (or maybe light rail) could serve them well.

Didn't you say you live in suburbia without a car? You don't get frustrated? I assume you don't live in the "urban suburbs" of Boston we discussed earlier. I can imagine not using your car for many things in some Boston suburbs, but it would be difficult for some things.

I also wonder if Louisville has better bus service than it would otherwise because it's nearby Boulder, which I'd imagine is a transit-friendly destination (centralized, colleges tend to have more transit riders).
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Unread 06-21-2012, 09:58 PM
 
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Nei, you're correct that I don't live in the "urban suburbs" we've discussed in that other thread. Where I live is actually an old '50's/'60's postwar subdivision. No, I don't get frustrated. Or, more to the point, if I do sometimes feel limited, it's because I can't step out the door into my own car to drive to the mountains, the lakes, or the beach. That would be the same issue in the city.

In my area, scattered along a main street at one edge of this section of town, there are a couple of grocery stores, several banks, at least a couple of haircut places I know of, a drugstore, at least a couple of laundromats that I know of (have wash/dry at home so I don't need it, but it's there for those who do), a coffee shop, a music store, and a number of eateries ranging from, at the low-brow end, a sub/pizza shop and a kind of neighborhood institution breakfast place that has been around for something like 50 years to, at the middle level, a non-chain Mexican restaurant and a couple of non-chain Chinese places and a non-chain American dining restaurant with a separate bar. And there are a number of other little shops I know are there but which I've never been inclined to patronize so I haven't really noticed what they are. All of these are within walking distance from most of this section of town. The area also has two centrally located schools--a middle and an elementary school--which could be reached on foot from most of the neighborhood.

I can also walk to bus stops for a local transit line serving this section of the metro area, which I can use to get to a major mall area, as well as to my town's downtown, which has a commuter rail station, a nice library, a community arts and performing center (various attractions, including some mid-level well known singers from the past, occasionally current musicians usually having connections to the area), and a number of the more eclectic kinds of shops and small restaurants of the sort people find attractive in city neighborhoods. Of course there are not nearly as many of these as there are in the city, but this area is still far from being the sickeningly bland kind of place that suburbs seem to be all too often universally stereotyped as being on these boards. I meet everyday needs quite comfortably. As I said above, the main thing I miss about a car is the chance to get out to more rural or wilderness kinds of places nowhere near any kind of transit, and that would be the same if I lived car-free in the city.
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Unread 06-21-2012, 10:03 PM
Status: "Maple tree is leafing out!" (set 9 days ago)
 
Location: Foot of the Rockies
65,530 posts, read 51,866,729 times
Reputation: 17943
Quote:
Originally Posted by nei View Post
I think many if not most burbs have some form public transit to downtown. But is this transit service within walking distance for most residents? Often not, at best it might be a very long walk for many. Of course those that care about transit can choose to live near where there's transit routes and if there was sensible planning the areas by transit stops would be denser. Of course this doesn't help say, teenagers, whose families picked other places.

Most destinations in suburbia are sprawled out. Individual office parks, scattered strip malls can be hard for transit to serve. Though if they are along one throughfare, a bus (or maybe light rail) could serve them well.

Didn't you say you live in suburbia without a car? You don't get frustrated? I assume you don't live in the "urban suburbs" of Boston we discussed earlier. I can imagine not using your car for many things in some Boston suburbs, but it would be difficult for some things.

I also wonder if Louisville has better bus service than it would otherwise because it's nearby Boulder, which I'd imagine is a transit-friendly destination (centralized, colleges tend to have more transit riders).
This is why I'm so done with this stuff. I posted schedules, I referred people to the maps, I stated I lived within 1/4 mile of a bus stop and was called a liar by two people who have apparently not been called out for same except by me, and have not responded since. Today was not the first time, either, that I posted schedules, maps, told of my daughter taking the bus home from middle school.

Louisville has good bus service b/c we are part of the RTD, but. . . . oh, I give up!
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Unread 06-21-2012, 10:14 PM
 
1,183 posts, read 415,979 times
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I still hold that every person, at any given moment, has a range of conditions in which they are comfortable living. My range is fairly broad, but does not include rural areas or the inner city. Why? I like being near things (work, entertainment, retail), but not packed in like sardines. Could I expand or shift my range? Sure, a little, but I, like most people, am unlikely to suddenly and drastically change. Do I use some sweeping generalizations? Probably, but, also like most people, I don't have time to go into excruciating detail about every subject, so I use mental shortcuts.
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Unread 06-21-2012, 10:19 PM
 
1,272 posts, read 461,390 times
Reputation: 1576
I understand the complexity of an extensive transit system. The tread is about what would enable
me, a city person, to move to the suburbs. My requirement would be to able to commute back to the urban downtown wiyh only ONE bus ride. YMMV


Quote:
Originally Posted by ogre View Post
There are many suburbs in my metro area that have direct access into the central city by various modes of transit. It's true that I live in the Boston metro, which has one of the more extensive transit systems in the U.S., but I think you'd find something similar in the suburbs of most or all cities with good transit systems. Even in some cities not especially known for great transit there is direct access to downtown from some suburbs. I did a quick check of the Columbus bus system and found that there are direct routes from Westerville, a 'burb along the outer belt highway, into downtown. The main drawback there is that this takes a bit over an hour one way, which is a reality in a fairly expansive city that also has only bus transit, which will be slowed by street traffic. On the other hand, the info about the C'bus system shows a time of only 18 minutes for a direct bus from the affluent near suburb of Bexley into downtown. This is not the best transit system in the country, but it does show that direct transit routes into the city from some suburbs do exist even in metro areas where the transit systems are not among the best. Cities with better systems generally have numerous suburbs with direct transit routes into the city.

An interesting point about the quoted post is that there are often trips within the city which require transfers. It might seem ironic, but this often is the price you pay for extensive transit service. The more places a city's transit system serves, the more transit lines there will be, making it inevitable that many trips around various parts of the city will require transfers. When you can arrange to live and work along the same transit line, and that line also connects to some major shopping and entertainment venues, it's great, but it's simply untrue that you can take public transit all over a major city and travel almost anywhere without ever having to transfer.
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Unread 06-21-2012, 10:46 PM
 
5,013 posts, read 7,882,738 times
Reputation: 3298
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eddyline View Post
I understand the complexity of an extensive transit system. The tread is about what would enable
me, a city person, to move to the suburbs. My requirement would be to able to commute back to the urban downtown wiyh only ONE bus ride. YMMV
There are suburbs where this is possible. Assuming you'd also include commuter rail or light rail as acceptable modes of transportation, there are numerous such suburban neighborhoods in metros with extensive transit systems.
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