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Old 01-03-2013, 09:53 AM
 
Location: Crooklyn, New York
28,272 posts, read 26,279,915 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HandsUpThumbsDown View Post
I guess it's all what you're used to. If you spent most of your life walking and using transit (there are a fair number of older folks in this city who just never learned to drive), it doesn't really add up that when you move into a 55/62+ apartment that you would all of the sudden no longer care about that mobility.
Well, Florida is full of seniors who grew up in New York. And I'm sure many of them voluntarily live there and don't care about that type of mobility anymore.
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Old 01-03-2013, 10:12 AM
 
Location: North Baltimore ----> Seattle
6,473 posts, read 11,112,325 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BajanYankee View Post
Well, Florida is full of seniors who grew up in New York. And I'm sure many of them voluntarily live there and don't care about that type of mobility anymore.
Maybe so, but plenty "retire in place" (Katiana's phrase) and just stay in NY. Anyway, my real-world example of the several-hundred resident senior apartments in my neighborhood is being ignored. A few blocks away there's another senior apartment building and those codgers are at the bus stop every morning, too.

They maybe aren't looking for the tapas places (I don't think we have more than one or two in the whole city) but to visit relatives, friends, go to the post office, bother grandchildren, go to the bank, etc.

As I said, I'm sure it's just a continuation of what you're used to. I don't think that's unreasonable.
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Old 01-03-2013, 10:18 AM
 
7,611 posts, read 9,465,582 times
Reputation: 8981
Quote:
Originally Posted by HandsUpThumbsDown View Post
Maybe so, but plenty "retire in place" (Katiana's phrase) and just stay in NY. Anyway, my real-world example of the several-hundred resident senior apartments in my neighborhood is being ignored. A few blocks away there's another senior apartment building and those codgers are at the bus stop every morning, too.

They maybe aren't looking for the tapas places (I don't think we have more than one or two in the whole city) but to visit relatives, friends, go to the post office, bother grandchildren, go to the bank, etc.

As I said, I'm sure it's just a continuation of what you're used to. I don't think that's unreasonable.
And now the word "codger" has reared its ugly head; we're only minutes away from the dreaded "geezer" usage..
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Old 01-03-2013, 10:19 AM
 
Location: North Baltimore ----> Seattle
6,473 posts, read 11,112,325 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MassVt View Post
And now the word "codger" has reared its ugly head; we're only minutes away from the dreaded "geezer" usage..
Shucks, I didn't mean anything by it. Sorry. Old people rule.

Sincerely,
A Future Codger
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Old 01-03-2013, 11:14 AM
 
7,611 posts, read 9,465,582 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HandsUpThumbsDown View Post
Shucks, I didn't mean anything by it. Sorry. Old people rule.

Sincerely,
A Future Codger
All in fun.

Sincerely,
A Future Geezer

Get off my (suburban) lawn!
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Old 01-03-2013, 05:14 PM
 
Location: Lakewood OH
21,698 posts, read 23,692,507 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hands Up Thumbs Down View Post
Going to go out on a limb and guess you're from the north side (and not south or west)
Near west side to begin with. I am originally from Garfield Park in the 40's and 50's in the days when it was Mafia run. Then my family moved to Arcadia Terrace, Ravenswood and finally West Rogers Park near Clark street. None of these areas were gentrified at the time. Today I understand some of them are and look very different from the time when I lived there. I moved to Portland in the late 70's.

But the location in the city really isn't the point. People did move to the suburbs beginning in the 50's mostly because houses were cheap and they could get good mortgages. Houses in the city were more expensive. Everything was brand new and everyone was the same age. It was exciting and young people felt like pioneers. It was the new American dream. One could own their own home for little down payment with lots of room to grow.

But they needed a car or two in order to survive living there. And everyone was the same age. Kids never got to see an old face unless they were taken to grandma's house and their play had to be structured. No more going out and inventing games to play on the sidewalks. Heck, there were no sidewalks. Pretty sterile. So some didn't care for that and preferred the randomness of city life.

They did not want the inconvenience of the suburbs. In those days it was not at all uncommon for young women not to learn how to drive. My mom was one of those as were many of her friends. They relied on public transportation to get them where they were going but they didn't need it for to get to many places because back then you could walk to most everything you needed: the neighborhood grocery store, the dry cleaners, the park, the candy store, even friends and relatives.

What wasn't walking distance was a short bus ride away. If we wanted to go somewhere special or necessary my dad drove us on Saturday. He used our car everyday to get to work on the south side. No one had two cars.

Today when young people say they want a "walkable city" they are simply describing the way a typical city neighborhood used to be in Chicago.

My mom raised three kids without needing a car without any problem. My sisters and I learned how to use the bus, El and subway at an early age. I remember we once looked at a house in the 'burbs we could have afforded to buy. My mom kept shaking her head. She said she felt like she would have been living on a desert island. No way.

Eventually, the majority of my mom's friends did learn to drive and they loved it. They even bought their own cars. But that had nothing to do with them ever wanting to leave the city. They were there to stay.

Staying in the city was a choice for many people for many reasons and it was not by any means because they couldn't drive. They preferred city living. I always did and always will.

And the idea of being totally dependent upon a car to get around can come back someday to cause problems. Often as people get older, they find they are no longer are able to drive. Then they have to rely on other sources to get them around; maybe even a bus or a subway or two. Never say never.

Last edited by Minervah; 01-03-2013 at 05:15 PM.. Reason: spelling
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Old 01-03-2013, 07:26 PM
 
Location: Ypsilanti
389 posts, read 401,023 times
Reputation: 199
Quote:
Originally Posted by Minervah View Post
Near west side to begin with. I am originally from Garfield Park in the 40's and 50's in the days when it was Mafia run. Then my family moved to Arcadia Terrace, Ravenswood and finally West Rogers Park near Clark street. None of these areas were gentrified at the time. Today I understand some of them are and look very different from the time when I lived there. I moved to Portland in the late 70's.

But the location in the city really isn't the point. People did move to the suburbs beginning in the 50's mostly because houses were cheap and they could get good mortgages. Houses in the city were more expensive. Everything was brand new and everyone was the same age. It was exciting and young people felt like pioneers. It was the new American dream. One could own their own home for little down payment with lots of room to grow.

But they needed a car or two in order to survive living there. And everyone was the same age. Kids never got to see an old face unless they were taken to grandma's house and their play had to be structured. No more going out and inventing games to play on the sidewalks. Heck, there were no sidewalks. Pretty sterile. So some didn't care for that and preferred the randomness of city life.

They did not want the inconvenience of the suburbs. In those days it was not at all uncommon for young women not to learn how to drive. My mom was one of those as were many of her friends. They relied on public transportation to get them where they were going but they didn't need it for to get to many places because back then you could walk to most everything you needed: the neighborhood grocery store, the dry cleaners, the park, the candy store, even friends and relatives.

What wasn't walking distance was a short bus ride away. If we wanted to go somewhere special or necessary my dad drove us on Saturday. He used our car everyday to get to work on the south side. No one had two cars.

Today when young people say they want a "walkable city" they are simply describing the way a typical city neighborhood used to be in Chicago.

My mom raised three kids without needing a car without any problem. My sisters and I learned how to use the bus, El and subway at an early age. I remember we once looked at a house in the 'burbs we could have afforded to buy. My mom kept shaking her head. She said she felt like she would have been living on a desert island. No way.

Eventually, the majority of my mom's friends did learn to drive and they loved it. They even bought their own cars. But that had nothing to do with them ever wanting to leave the city. They were there to stay.

Staying in the city was a choice for many people for many reasons and it was not by any means because they couldn't drive. They preferred city living. I always did and always will.

And the idea of being totally dependent upon a car to get around can come back someday to cause problems. Often as people get older, they find they are no longer are able to drive. Then they have to rely on other sources to get them around; maybe even a bus or a subway or two. Never say never.
Finally someone gets it haha, that isn't my age I'm assuming.
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Old 01-03-2013, 07:56 PM
 
1,015 posts, read 1,543,684 times
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There are lots of old people who feel like they must keep driving because they don't have any decent alternatives. Many of them recognize that they really shouldn't be driving, and would take transit if they lived in a neighborhood that was walkable and had decent transit service. So it's not about tapas bars, it's about daily life.
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Old 01-03-2013, 08:23 PM
Status: "Summer!" (set 26 days ago)
 
Location: Foot of the Rockies
87,024 posts, read 102,689,903 times
Reputation: 33083
Quote:
Originally Posted by HandsUpThumbsDown View Post
Maybe so, but plenty "retire in place" (Katiana's phrase) and just stay in NY. Anyway, my real-world example of the several-hundred resident senior apartments in my neighborhood is being ignored. A few blocks away there's another senior apartment building and those codgers are at the bus stop every morning, too.

They maybe aren't looking for the tapas places (I don't think we have more than one or two in the whole city) but to visit relatives, friends, go to the post office, bother grandchildren, go to the bank, etc.

As I said, I'm sure it's just a continuation of what you're used to. I don't think that's unreasonable.
I probably didn't reply b/c I came home from work brain dead and was in no condition to counter-point. I'm in about the same condition tonight, but I'll give it a try. There are many types of senior apartments, from independent living (what you and I do, presumably) to some assistance, to assisted living, to nursing home (though NH doesn't usually count as apartment living). There are some complexes that are all those things together. My MIL lives in a place that gives a little help to the residents, but less than assisted living. They get one meal a day; there is a hairdresser that comes in to do hair; they have activities (MIL likes to play bingo and the other gambling games); they clean the apts and change the bed linens, and they have a bus that takes people to stores, etc in Papillion, Nebraska. One can keep one's car, and indeed, MIL kept hers for a while, but eventually sold it b/c she wasn't using it any more. Now she wasn't going anywhere by city bus (they have the Ometro there) either. She simply needs more help when going out than that, as do most of the residents there. I would not want to be on the road with most of those people driving cars. Lots of them have some disablities that make it difficult to board a bus, many need some supervision when out. Some need more help than it appears at first glance.
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Old 01-03-2013, 09:03 PM
 
Location: North Baltimore ----> Seattle
6,473 posts, read 11,112,325 times
Reputation: 3117
Quote:
Originally Posted by Katiana View Post
I probably didn't reply b/c I came home from work brain dead and was in no condition to counter-point. I'm in about the same condition tonight, but I'll give it a try. There are many types of senior apartments, from independent living (what you and I do, presumably) to some assistance, to assisted living, to nursing home (though NH doesn't usually count as apartment living). There are some complexes that are all those things together. My MIL lives in a place that gives a little help to the residents, but less than assisted living. They get one meal a day; there is a hairdresser that comes in to do hair; they have activities (MIL likes to play bingo and the other gambling games); they clean the apts and change the bed linens, and they have a bus that takes people to stores, etc in Papillion, Nebraska. One can keep one's car, and indeed, MIL kept hers for a while, but eventually sold it b/c she wasn't using it any more. Now she wasn't going anywhere by city bus (they have the Ometro there) either. She simply needs more help when going out than that, as do most of the residents there. I would not want to be on the road with most of those people driving cars. Lots of them have some disablities that make it difficult to board a bus, many need some supervision when out. Some need more help than it appears at first glance.
It actually not too hard to board our buses, as they all "kneel" to the curb, and are equipped with a ramp for wheelchairs. I'd imagine since we have a higher transit share here (and higher percentage of carless) than in omaha then it would make sense that I see a greater number of elderly from the senior center on the bus.

I think the center by me is similar to you describe. A few on my street have parents or grandparents there and they walk over to visit sometime.

I just think it's unreasonable to assume that a person who walked and used transit for years 10-61 would not care about that mobility at age 62 (which is what I have been trying to get across). Anyway I see it everyday.

Im sure there are also residents therein who don't get out much.
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