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If you go over to the Parenting forum and look at the topics that people are discussing, none of them have anything to do with "city or suburb". I've never even seen that subject come up over there. It's just about raising kids, which is the same everywhere.
I'm not saying that parenting is different in different places. I'm saying that for our family it was wonderful to live in a very urban neighborhood. We took full advantage of city offerings. We could not find those same benefits in a suburban neighborhood. You seemed to be suggesting that kids didn't get much out of the benefits of city living. Yet lots of families who live in urban neighborhoods both really enjoy the day-to-day aspects of city living (which is different than a quiet suburban neighborhood) and do enjoy things like cultural attractions, which you seemed to discount.
I think kids and families can do well in a wide variety of locations. But the daily experience of raising kids CAN be drastically different depending on physical environment. Having lived in a few different types of neighborhoods with a child, I can attest to that from first-hand experience. Our current neighborhood is night-and-day-different than our very urban neighborhood. I'm the same parent in both places, but our daily life and routine -- and my child's experiences -- are drastically different. I think the urban one was far better for our family because as parents we were were far happier in that kind of place, but I can certainly understand why others prefer this lifestyle. But although kids can thrive in both places, they ARE different.
Whatever. I can't imagine that raising my two, one now with a doctorate and married herself and the other in grad school, would have been that different in "the city", any city. Parenting is more about the parent-child relationship than the environment. If you can understand the preference for the suburban lifestyle, why do you keep arguing about it?
Whatever. I can't imagine that raising my two, one now with a doctorate and married herself and the other in grad school, would have been that different in "the city", any city. Parenting is more about the parent-child relationship than the environment. If you can understand the preference for the suburban lifestyle, why do you keep arguing about it?
Kind of baiting to make it about your kids but you have to have respect for people who can say I grew up in nyc, boston, philly, chicago, san fran, etc. That confidence will help their careers. (I can assure you the opposite, growing in a rural environment, hampers your confidence and opportunities) When I'm downtown philly the conversations I over hear is of an international scope. When I take public transportation around like everyone does I'm exposed from upper class ivy leaguers to rather modest class. I'm around people speaking different languages and groups of people of significantly different cultures. Many great museums etc that don't have be field trips to go to. That exposure is NOT going to happen for a kid in a suburb.
That also doesn't keep in mind the endless job opportunities for kids while they're growing up. Although how the kids end up is important I think the primary concern is which external to the house environment is better for a kid while they are growing up.
To be fair though affording enough space in a true desirable urban neighbourhood for a family more then 1 or 2 is EXPENSIVE. Not many kids are going to even have the chance to grow up there to come back and tell the rest of us where they would have rather grown up.
Kind of baiting to make it about your kids but you have to have respect for people who can say I grew up in nyc, boston, philly, chicago, san fran, etc. That confidence will help their careers. (I can assure you the opposite, growing in a rural environment, hampers your confidence and opportunities) When I'm downtown philly the conversations I over hear is of an international scope. When I take public transportation around like everyone does I'm exposed from upper class ivy leaguers to rather modest class. I'm around people speaking different languages and groups of people of significantly different cultures. Many great museums etc that don't have be field trips to go to. That exposure is NOT going to happen for a kid in a suburb.
That also doesn't keep in mind the endless job opportunities for kids while they're growing up. Although how the kids end up is important I think the primary concern is which external to the house environment is better for a kid while they are growing up.
To be fair though affording enough space in a true desirable urban neighbourhood for a family more then 1 or 2 is EXPENSIVE. Not many kids are going to even have the chance to grow up there to come back and tell the rest of us where they would have rather grown up.
I don't know what you mean about having "respect" for people who can say they grew up in some city. I respect everyone as human beings. I was just pointing out that my kids aren't living under a bridge somewhere. I think it's BS that growing up in a rural area hampers your confidence and opportunities. My mother grew up in abject poverty in a rural area, yet she and her sibs all managed to do quite well, thank you very much. I an not at all impressed with your Ivy Leaguers. Even out here in flyover country, I have a boss who is an Ivy Leaguer and I myself went to a highly ranked university. It's also BS that suburban kids don't get "exposed" to museums outside of field trips. My kids loved the museum of Nature and Science and we went there frequently. It's only a half hour drive from our house. And what's with these "endless job opportunities" for city kids? Is it better to work at an urban fast-food restaurant than a suburban one? My kids were gymnasts and coached gymnastics for pay. I disagree 100% that the "house environment" has anything to do with city/suburbs/rural. And everyone has some beef with their childhoods. We read it here all the time. Half the people on this forum, it seems, would have had a much better life if they had lived somewhere else. Perhaps the problem was not in the starts, as Shakespeare said.
To say that the environment doesn't matter is a bit misguided. The environment does matter especially, imo, they get into their teen years. Depression for middle class teens is on the rise and has been. Along with that, teens who live out in subdivisions find themselves dabbling in drugs, vandalizing property, trespassing, and just getting into trouble in general because they have nothing better to do when all you have are houses, a strip mall, and a McDonalds up the road. I'm strictly talking about middle class teens, not poor inner city youth who are definitely victims of their environment.
The environment definitely plays a role in the type of experiences a parent can offer their child and what the the child discovers for themselves.
I don't know what you mean about having "respect" for people who can say they grew up in some city. I respect everyone as human beings. I was just pointing out that my kids aren't living under a bridge somewhere. I think it's BS that growing up in a rural area hampers your confidence and opportunities. My mother grew up in abject poverty in a rural area, yet she and her sibs all managed to do quite well, thank you very much. I an not at all impressed with your Ivy Leaguers. Even out here in flyover country, I have a boss who is an Ivy Leaguer and I myself went to a highly ranked university. It's also BS that suburban kids don't get "exposed" to museums outside of field trips. My kids loved the museum of Nature and Science and we went there frequently. It's only a half hour drive from our house. And what's with these "endless job opportunities" for city kids? Is it better to work at an urban fast-food restaurant than a suburban one? My kids were gymnasts and coached gymnastics for pay. I disagree 100% that the "house environment" has anything to do with city/suburbs/rural. And everyone has some beef with their childhoods. We read it here all the time. Half the people on this forum, it seems, would have had a much better life if they had lived somewhere else. Perhaps the problem was not in the starts, as Shakespeare said.
Your kids aren't the representation of all suburban kids. I wish I would've grown up in the city, except I didn't. City kids are definitely more exposed to a more diverse lifestyle and typically greater opportunities.
I can't name one kid who grew up in the city who just wants to move to the burbs and get a desk job, in the suburbs, thats most of the kids I went to school with. Most of them have kids, are married, and are too young to be buying a home but still do it. The kids who grew up in the city tend to travel more and start a family later.
I can't name one kid who grew up in the city who just wants to move to the burbs and get a desk job, in the suburbs, thats most of the kids I went to school with. Most of them have kids, are married, and are too young to be buying a home but still do it. The kids who grew up in the city tend to travel more and start a family later.
While I'm as much an urban booster as anyone else, I'm guessing most (if not all) of the people you knew who grew up in the city are middle/upper middle class and white.
From what I've seen, few people who grow up within city limits and came from a somewhat wealthy background have suburban aspirations. But plenty of black kids do (particularly the ones who grow up in the worst neighborhoods), as do the kids who grow up in the remaining working-class white enclaves within major cities. They might not actually ever get the means to be in the suburbs, but that's still what they want.
While I'm as much an urban booster as anyone else, I'm guessing most (if not all) of the people you knew who grew up in the city are middle/upper middle class and white.
From what I've seen, few people who grow up within city limits and came from a somewhat wealthy background have suburban aspirations. But plenty of black kids do (particularly the ones who grow up in the worst neighborhoods), as do the kids who grow up in the remaining working-class white enclaves within major cities. They might not actually ever get the means to be in the suburbs, but that's still what they want.
Another anecdotal take-- I work with many professionals who are wealthy beyond our wildest dreams. Many reside in the borough of Manhattan, but also own real estate in the Hamptons, CT shoreline, Aspen/Vail, Palm Beach, etc. Despite all of the cultural opportunities presented by NYC, that is not where this cohort choose to spend weekends or retirement.
Suburban schools take field trips to both the city and rural areas.
But do any schools take field trips to suburbia?
A lot of our field trips were to neighborhood programs. Or we'd go to other schools. One family had a Dia de los Muertos set up (though at the time that celebration wasn't well known or known at all as such) so we went to their house. Then there were amusement parks and beaches to look at the tide pools. Or to the pier. A lot of the factories we visited were in the suburbs, being a multi-nodal kind of area. Broad strokes don't do fine lines very well.
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