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Old 03-23-2013, 08:41 PM
 
3,836 posts, read 4,719,218 times
Reputation: 2538

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Quote:
Originally Posted by buenos View Post
-What is ugly about it?
oh, IDK, maybe this:

http://farm2.staticflickr.com/1072/1...6fd_z.jpg?zz=1

and this

http://farm2.staticflickr.com/1151/1...5ec0de01_z.jpg

and this

http://monarchguide.com/images/ch1/habitats.jpg

and this

http://www.buffalorising.com/assets_...x423-32244.jpg

and this

http://www.newurbanism.org/images/460_Sprawl.jpg

and this

http://0.tqn.com/d/architecture/1/0/...0344738001.jpg

and this

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-KZJN6RJO_V...0/Picture7.jpg

and this

http://www.fastcoexist.com/multisite...cgielen-1b.jpg

and this

http://consortiumnews.com/wp-content...rbansprawl.jpg

and this

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3173/...5b597d4261.jpg

and this

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7111/7...12472a4f5e.jpg


is a bunch of dehumanizing crap that constitutes 90% of most cities now.

Last edited by nei; 03-23-2013 at 10:34 PM..
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Old 03-23-2013, 09:29 PM
 
Location: Monmouth County, NJ & Staten Island, NY
407 posts, read 408,145 times
Reputation: 661
Quote:
Originally Posted by Komeht View Post
is a bunch of dehumanizing crap that constitutes 90% of most cities now.
In your opinion.

Which thankfully, in the real world, is completely meaningless.
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Old 03-23-2013, 09:36 PM
 
Location: Monmouth County, NJ & Staten Island, NY
407 posts, read 408,145 times
Reputation: 661
Quote:
Originally Posted by Komeht View Post
A couple of things:

People pay a huge premium to live centrally. Even further out developments that are new urbanists command a higher price than their distantly related cousin, sprawl.

Secondly, sprawl isn't choice. Sprawl is mandated by codes. If developers had a choice they'd build urban becaus urban pays better. Everything about sprawl is by government fiat: from the setbacks to the curb sweeps to the width of the traffic lanes, to the number of parking spaces, the heights of the buildings, the impervious cover restrictions, the color and the widthe of the parking strip, the bio Swales and the berms and those silly little scrub plants that are supposed to make us feel better about hell on earth... Precisely all of it is to code.

So don't give me any crap about choice. Sprawl is by mandate.
Actually, a huge percentage of Americans choose to live in these types of areas, so I see nothing wrong with the government helping to support the lifestyle that tens of millions of Americans want. Actually, see people do like living like that, as opposed to your stuck up belief that nobody does. But since you like to talk in absolutes and also as if there is absolutely no other way that people could actually want to live, I don't think it's even worth telling you. And lets not forget that the federal government also paid for a one billion dollar light rail system in New Jersey to spur transit-oriented development along the Gold Coast, just as there is a demand for urban living as well. As far as codes are concerned, some communities don't mind them and some do. Personally, I would stay away from HOAs myself but HOA != suburban community.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Phyxius View Post
So let's keep wasting resources?
Actually, no, because I don't consider it a "waste" of resources.
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Old 03-23-2013, 09:41 PM
 
3,836 posts, read 4,719,218 times
Reputation: 2538
Quote:
Originally Posted by KeepRightPassLeft View Post
Actually, a huge percentage of Americans choose to live in these types of areas, so I see nothing wrong with the government helping to support the lifestyle that tens of millions of Americans want. Actually, see people do like living like that, as opposed to your stuck up belief that nobody does. But since you like to talk in absolutes and also as if there is absolutely no other way that people could actually want to live, I don't think it's even worth telling you. And lets not forget that the federal government also paid for a one billion dollar light rail system in New Jersey to spur transit-oriented development along the Gold Coast, just as there is a demand for urban living as well. As far as codes are concerned, some communities don't mind them and some do. Personally, I would stay away from HOAs myself but HOA != suburban community.



Actually, no, because I don't consider it a "waste" of resources.
oh, the government spent 1 billion dollars on a light rail system? wowie

The federal government spends 30-40 billion dollars every. . .single. . .year on highways - 90% of them to support sprawl.
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Old 03-23-2013, 09:43 PM
 
Location: Monmouth County, NJ & Staten Island, NY
407 posts, read 408,145 times
Reputation: 661
Quote:
Originally Posted by Komeht View Post
Long commutes are by choice. Always by choice.
Complete bullsh*t. I'm convinced you simply do not live in the real world with the rest of us.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Komeht View Post
I do not feel sorry for people who opt to live in a suburb and commute long distances. Not only do I not feel sorry for them, I'm irritated that:
Aww boo hoo.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Komeht View Post
1. They expect me to subsidize bad choices.
Again, aww boo hoo.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Komeht View Post
2. They pollute the air I breath
So does anyone who lives in modern society.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Komeht View Post
3. The warm the planet
See above.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Komeht View Post
4. The help to perpetuate the most wasteful allocation of resources in the modern world, and
Ok, Kunstler....

Quote:
Originally Posted by Komeht View Post
5. They contribute to a sinister ugliness that pervades what use to be beautiful cities.
.....in your opinion.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Komeht View Post
*overused Samuel L Jackson meme*
How could you not understand this question? Do you understand English?
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Old 03-23-2013, 09:43 PM
 
3,836 posts, read 4,719,218 times
Reputation: 2538
Quote:
Originally Posted by KeepRightPassLeft View Post
Actually, a huge percentage of Americans choose to live in these types of areas, so I see nothing wrong with the government helping to support the lifestyle that tens of millions of Americans want. Actually, see people do like living like that, as opposed to your stuck up belief that nobody does. But since you like to talk in absolutes and also as if there is absolutely no other way that people could actually want to live, I don't think it's even worth telling you. And lets not forget that the federal government also paid for a one billion dollar light rail system in New Jersey to spur transit-oriented development along the Gold Coast, just as there is a demand for urban living as well. As far as codes are concerned, some communities don't mind them and some do. Personally, I would stay away from HOAs myself but HOA != suburban community.



Actually, no, because I don't consider it a "waste" of resources.
So wait - before you were arguing for choice. . .now you want it the other way - fiat.

Which is it you want, choice or fiat? Right now - sprawl is by fiat.
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Old 03-23-2013, 09:45 PM
 
Location: Monmouth County, NJ & Staten Island, NY
407 posts, read 408,145 times
Reputation: 661
Quote:
Originally Posted by Komeht View Post
oh, the government spent 1 billion dollars on a light rail system? wowie

The federal government spends 30-40 billion dollars every. . .single. . .year on highways - 90% of them to support sprawl.
Maybe because a large majority of people *GASP* like living in suburban areas? Noooo, absolutley no way that could be true. That would go against your Path of Self Righteousness because only you know how everybody should like and how they will all be happier..
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Old 03-23-2013, 09:47 PM
 
Location: Monmouth County, NJ & Staten Island, NY
407 posts, read 408,145 times
Reputation: 661
Quote:
Originally Posted by Komeht View Post
So wait - before you were arguing for choice. . .now you want it the other way - fiat.

Which is it you want, choice or fiat? Right now - sprawl is by fiat.
If a certain place wants codes in place for development, that's fine by me...it's their choice. If they don't like it, don't live there. If I wanted to grow vegetables in front of my house, I wouldn't move to a neighborhood that requires me to have a freshly mowed lawn at all times, and I wouldn't expect the people there to change for me, unless the majority of people decided that you should be able to. Why is it anyone's business what a certain municipality wants to be like? Plenty of living arrangements and lifestyles for everyone.
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Old 03-23-2013, 09:51 PM
 
3,836 posts, read 4,719,218 times
Reputation: 2538
Quote:
Originally Posted by KeepRightPassLeft View Post
If a certain place wants codes in place for development, that's fine by me...it's their choice. If they don't like it, don't live there. If I wanted to grow vegetables in front of my house, I wouldn't move to a neighborhood that requires me to have a freshly mowed lawn at all times, and I wouldn't expect the people there to change for me, unless the majority of people decided that you should be able to. Why is it anyone's business what a certain municipality wants to be like? Plenty of living arrangements and lifestyles for everyone.
OK - I just wanted you to clarify your earlier statement that you are in fact against choice and for sprawl.

Thanks.
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Old 03-23-2013, 09:53 PM
 
3,836 posts, read 4,719,218 times
Reputation: 2538
Quote:
Originally Posted by KeepRightPassLeft View Post
Maybe because a large majority of people *GASP* like living in suburban areas? Noooo, absolutley no way that could be true. That would go against your Path of Self Righteousness because only you know how everybody should like and how they will all be happier..
sorry - I thought I was responding to your outrage about government subsidy of light rail. . .seems you would be even more outraged about government subsidies of highways.

guess not.

Consistency is tricky for you isn't it?
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