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Old 04-06-2013, 01:20 PM
 
Location: Thunder Bay, ON
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Depends on the city when it comes to courtyards. Paris and Budapest often have several courtyards (often one per building) in their city blocks so they're smaller and less likely to have trees. Copenhagen and Prague more often have very large courtyards shared across the whole block. I've been in buildings with courtyards in both Budapest and Paris. The one in Paris didn't have trees. The one is Budapest was a bigger, it was a rather long time ago so I'm having a hard time remembering but I don't think it had trees.

I was also in building with a courtyard in Berlin (Charlottenburg) which was quite large and had trees. Berlin has quite a lot of trees, especially outside downtown (these areas are still midrise), both on the street and in courtyards.

Generally I would say street trees are an improvement, although maybe if the architecture is exceptional it would be better not to have them. However, I would say that most urban architecture is average to nice but not exceptional.

Also in neighbourhoods with buildings in the 2-3 storey range, if you have a big street tree, you should be able to see most of the building since the street canopy would be high enough that it would mostly just block the view of the sky.

Outremont, Montreal, QC - Google Maps

Winnipeg has a great tree canopy by the way, even in the North Side (low income). Looking at aerials, it's easy to mistake the streets for backyards and laneways for streets. In most cities, there will be more trees in the backyards and you can see the streets in aerials, but in many areas of Winnipeg you can't see any of the streets, while the alleys and backyards have relatively few streets.

Last edited by memph; 04-06-2013 at 01:28 PM..
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Old 04-06-2013, 01:24 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eschaton View Post
I


Could you show me where I said that trees make an urban area look suburban please? All I said was these neighborhoods were often not designed with street trees in mind. There are suburban typologies which are designed to have trees, and ones which are not.
You said:

"Even if you want trees for all the reasons others have listed, you could do like many European cities, and put them in central courtyards, instead of out on the street."

And that's not true as I've shown over and over and over and over. some of the most famous streets in Europe are tree lined.

And there is nothing about having trees on a street that is suburban. Nothing. Trees have been part of the urban fabric as long as there have been cities. I am about as committed an urbanist as it gets here. Trees make living in cities more pleasant for all the reasons discussed above. The contribute to urbanity, not detract. A city is no less urban for having trees. This is an absurd point to be making.

If you think a particular street needs to have it's trees maintained I suggest you take that up with local government.

If you want to sell us on this notion that somehow trees are anti-urban then you seriously misunderstand what it means to be urban.
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Old 04-06-2013, 01:26 PM
nei nei won $500 in our forum's Most Engaging Poster Contest - Thirteenth Edition (Jan-Feb 2015). 

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Location: Long Island / NYC
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Komeht View Post
You said:

Even if you want trees for all the reasons others have listed, you could do like many European cities, and put them in central courtyards, instead of out on the street.

And that's not true as I've shown over and over and over and over. some of the most famous streets in Europe are tree lined.
Famous, wide streets. You've shown over and over again famous European streets are tree-lined. Not typical ones. Posters have shown some treeless European streets and some streets with trees. Check out my view of Nantes earlier. No trees on the street. Plenty in back.
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Old 04-06-2013, 01:31 PM
 
Location: Vallejo
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Komeht View Post
Why distinguish between old and new paris - it's all Paris - a big modern metropolis that has layer after layer from very ancient to very modern, all intermixed.

In any case:

It isn't hard to find tree lined urban streets in paris if you have a pair of eyes.

[img]http://www.parisdigest.com/photos/paris_boulevards.jpg[/img


Because of the original typology bit. Those boulevards? Not part of the original typology. They were cut into the original typology. I'm not saying anything about how they are less urban or anything because I don't think that.

The original typology of Paris didn't have much in the way of trees lining streets and still doesn't. Ditto for Prague. If you look at some of the newer parts, eg vinohrady, they do have lots of trees along the streets. I don't know if they have always been there. To me they don't look like the type of trees that last 200 years. They're probably not the original trees even if it had them back in the day. Vinohrady was built with wider streets that accommodate trees better than old town.
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Old 04-06-2013, 01:43 PM
 
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Originally Posted by nei View Post
Famous, wide streets. You've shown over and over again famous European streets are tree-lined. Not typical ones. Posters have shown some treeless European streets and some streets with trees. Check out my view of Nantes earlier. No trees on the street. Plenty in back.
Um - ok, there are streets in Europe with trees and streets in Europe without. As that is the case everywhere. There is no general rule about European cities that makes it different. I can show you treeless suburbs and treed suburbs and treeless plazas and treed plazas and treeless neighborhoods and treed neighborhoods and treeless avenues and boulevards and treed avenues and boulevards in virtually every major metropolitan city in the world. From Europe, to south America to Asia. . .

There is no general rule for this.
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Old 04-06-2013, 01:59 PM
Status: "Summer!" (set 26 days ago)
 
Location: Foot of the Rockies
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The funny thing is, one of the criticisms you hear about suburbs is sometimes, "no trees" or "no mature trees".

Why Suburbs Will Never Have Tall Trees | Garden Rant
https://iheartinspiration.com/quotes...ts-after-them/
The American Promise, Volume II: Since 1865: A History of the United States - James L. Roark, Michael P. Johnson, Patricia Cline Cohen, Sarah Stage, Susan M. Hartmann - Google Books
**Social critic Lewis Mumford blasted the suburbs as ďa multitude of uniform, unidentifiable houses in a treeless communal wasteland, inhabited by people of the ...
Selected Poems - Google Books
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Old 04-06-2013, 02:03 PM
 
Location: Thunder Bay, ON
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Komeht View Post
Um - ok, there are streets in Europe with trees and streets in Europe without. As that is the case everywhere. There is no general rule about European cities that makes it different. I can show you treeless suburbs and treed suburbs and treeless plazas and treed plazas and treeless neighborhoods and treed neighborhoods and treeless avenues and boulevards and treed avenues and boulevards in virtually every major metropolitan city in the world. From Europe, to south America to Asia. . .

There is no general rule for this.
Can you help me find a treeless suburb in Toronto? The place has to be at least a couple years old though, obviously since greenfield development is on farmland, there won't be trees until they get planted shortly after the subdivision is built.
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Old 04-06-2013, 02:13 PM
nei nei won $500 in our forum's Most Engaging Poster Contest - Thirteenth Edition (Jan-Feb 2015). 

Over $104,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum and additional contests are planned
 
Location: Long Island / NYC
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Quote:
Originally Posted by memph View Post
Can you help me find a treeless suburb in Toronto? The place has to be at least a couple years old though, obviously since greenfield development is on farmland, there won't be trees until they get planted shortly after the subdivision is built.
Here, sometimes, new development is (or was) built on forested land.
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Old 04-06-2013, 02:18 PM
 
Location: Vallejo
14,079 posts, read 16,109,257 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Katiana View Post
The funny thing is, one of the criticisms you hear about suburbs is sometimes, "no trees" or "no mature trees".

Why Suburbs Will Never Have Tall Trees | Garden Rant
https://iheartinspiration.com/quotes...ts-after-them/
The American Promise, Volume II: Since 1865: A History of the United States - James L. Roark, Michael P. Johnson, Patricia Cline Cohen, Sarah Stage, Susan M. Hartmann - Google Books
**Social critic Lewis Mumford blasted the suburbs as ďa multitude of uniform, unidentifiable houses in a treeless communal wasteland, inhabited by people of the ...
Selected Poems - Google Books
No trees is my predominant complaint of new suburbs.

In some of the semi-custom tracts, they do a better job.

https://maps.google.com/maps?q=El+Do...alifornia&z=17

Quite the contrast. While the left is older, but there's a lot of trees left there that are much older than the houses.
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Old 04-06-2013, 02:20 PM
nei nei won $500 in our forum's Most Engaging Poster Contest - Thirteenth Edition (Jan-Feb 2015). 

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Location: Long Island / NYC
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Malloric View Post
There's a pretty stark contrast between old Paris and planned Paris. I don't even care if it's a residential street. Good luck finding a tree in much of Paris that isn't in a park/church/public square or something like that.

Here's one:
https://maps.google.com/maps?q=paris...,36.88,,0,6.79

A rare find.

Contrast that to nearby Boulevard Raspail:
https://maps.google.com/maps?q=paris...,1.81,,0,-4.71
I don't really mind the lack of trees there. There's so much concrete there, a few trees isn't going to make much difference. Ditto with the Manhattan street I posted on the first page, which is rather similar to the "old Paris" view.

Quote:
Basically, an earlier version of the American freeway cutting through the heart of the city. It faced the same criticisms for just going through and bull dozing anything its way in the 19th century when it, along with many other similar streets, where cut through the middle of Paris like a knife through hot butter. I don't know that I exactly agree with the criticism. It's definitely completely different than the Paris it cut through, however. Whether one likes or dislikes it, I think at least that it's very different isn't controversial.
And some locals still criticize it:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rozenn View Post
Agreed. Baron Haussmann should've gone easy on the old urban fabric imho. Sure, the city needed to modernize to cope with the unsanitary conditions, but as often in this country, change came in a very brutal way. Ironically,nowadays, touching anything Haussmannian is deemed as sacrilege, even if there are thousands of similar buildings all over the city. In the CBD, most fronts were preserved thanks to facadism. I think that quite a bit of them didn't deserve such a special treatment and should have been leveled altogether.
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