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Old 04-20-2013, 03:48 PM
Status: "Summer!" (set 14 days ago)
 
Location: Foot of the Rockies
86,980 posts, read 102,527,356 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by goofy328 View Post
Teachers having to purchase their own school supplies, etc.
For all one hears about this, I don't think I've ever heard a teacher say it, and I have several teacher friends. Nor have I seen teachers post about buying their own supplies on CD. One might have to buy something and get reimbursed later, due to bureaucracy, but that's not the same.
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Old 04-20-2013, 11:30 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by texdav View Post
Basically problems start with people and what they value. A decline or a upward movement in this doesn't happen overnite.Asians for example have a clear value for eduction altho they arewhere amoung thew poorest not that long ago.its t without cost in other areas for genrations either.
There were some things I never addressed since I've been in and out of this thread, but what you just posted is one of those stereotypes that get repeated ad nauseum that aren't true that's been posted or implied earlier in this thread: that certain cultures or ethnic groups value education while others don't.

I work with inner city low income kids and I speak to their parents. While their parents may not have the means, time, or resources to help their children out the way other advantaged families can, doesn't mean they don't care about their education. They do and like any parent that loves their child, they want the best for their child.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Katiana View Post
For all one hears about this, I don't think I've ever heard a teacher say it, and I have several teacher friends. Nor have I seen teachers post about buying their own supplies on CD. One might have to buy something and get reimbursed later, due to bureaucracy, but that's not the same.
It depends on the district, but sometimes teachers will get something like $200 at the beginning of the year to spend on outside supplies and once they run out they have to pay out of pocket for the rest. At my school, the teachers have to provide their own paper to make copies for things like worksheets for examples.
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Old 04-20-2013, 11:45 PM
Status: "Summer!" (set 14 days ago)
 
Location: Foot of the Rockies
86,980 posts, read 102,527,356 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Octa View Post

It depends on the district, but sometimes teachers will get something like $200 at the beginning of the year to spend on outside supplies and once they run out they have to pay out of pocket for the rest. At my school, the teachers have to provide their own paper to make copies for things like worksheets for examples.
So the school has some limits on what it will pay for? That doesn't sound too unusual to me. I once worked at a home health agency that made us provide our own pens. Now that was cheap, I thought.
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Old 04-22-2013, 08:57 AM
 
Location: Crooklyn, New York
28,247 posts, read 26,214,003 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Malloric View Post
Street level drug dealers don't even make as much as Target workers... plus they're about 1000x as likely to get shot/jumped or otherwise maimed. Better off being a 7-11 cashier on the same corner than the one selling rocks.
That's not the way they're looking at it. They're hoping to move beyond corner boy/lookout status. As Memphis Bleek said in "Coming of Age":

Quote:
I'm tired of bein out here round the clock
and breakin day, and chasin crackheads up the block for my pay
I'm stayin fresh, so chickens check
I'm tryin to step up to the next level, pushin Vettes to the Jets
Diamonds reflect from the sun, directly in your equilibirum
and stunned I'm waitin for my day to come
I got the urge, to splurge, I don't wanna lifetime sentence
just give me the word
True, he may be on the corner grinding right now, but the "come up" from corner boy to major dealer status has a much greater payoff than the come up from cashier to floor manager at Target.

Once they get that first offense, it's extremely difficult to do anything else. Target may not even be an option after that.
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Old 04-22-2013, 10:01 AM
 
Location: Vallejo
14,056 posts, read 16,063,174 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Katiana View Post
For all one hears about this, I don't think I've ever heard a teacher say it, and I have several teacher friends. Nor have I seen teachers post about buying their own supplies on CD. One might have to buy something and get reimbursed later, due to bureaucracy, but that's not the same.
There's a reason it's a write-off in the tax code. My mom taught briefly when she got tired of her job. Especially with younger kids when you're looking at wanting things like coloring books, pens, crayons, lots of very simple worksheets. Older kids don't really need as much in the way of materials. Cheapest way is generally to copy everything from what's available (obviously doesn't work well with crayons, which is why you always had all the crappy colors and none of the good ones). But even then, I had a lot of teachers that blew through their entire budget on copies. They could either pay for them themselves or just not copy anything.

And Bajan, there's a reason Memphis Bleek moved laterally into a different career. Easier to make money in the entertainment business and less likely to result in bodily harm than in the selling drugs and shooting people over corners business. Also more legal. It's not what I'd call a sure thing... most artists never make much money. I'd say there's a much better chance of making it to store manager at a Target ($80-140k) than as a successful artist.
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Old 04-22-2013, 05:14 PM
Status: "Summer!" (set 14 days ago)
 
Location: Foot of the Rockies
86,980 posts, read 102,527,356 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Malloric View Post
There's a reason it's a write-off in the tax code. My mom taught briefly when she got tired of her job. Especially with younger kids when you're looking at wanting things like coloring books, pens, crayons, lots of very simple worksheets. Older kids don't really need as much in the way of materials. Cheapest way is generally to copy everything from what's available (obviously doesn't work well with crayons, which is why you always had all the crappy colors and none of the good ones). But even then, I had a lot of teachers that blew through their entire budget on copies. They could either pay for them themselves or just not copy anything.

And Bajan, there's a reason Memphis Bleek moved laterally into a different career. Easier to make money in the entertainment business and less likely to result in bodily harm than in the selling drugs and shooting people over corners business. Also more legal. It's not what I'd call a sure thing... most artists never make much money. I'd say there's a much better chance of making it to store manager at a Target ($80-140k) than as a successful artist.
Don't know where you mom taught, but here in CO, the kids get a list, every year from K-12, of what they needed for school supplies. In the earlier grades, crayons, pens, pencils, colored pencils, construction paper, kleenex, etc were on the list. As they got older, just pens and pencils (for writing instruments), plus notebooks, calculators, etc. Plus there were supplies to buy for specific classes, and lab fees. If you were on free/reduced lunch, you could get some free supplies.

Please provide a link that Target managers make that much. When I worked at a health dept that had a low-income maternity clinic, we would get patients who either were managers at such places, or married to such managers.

Actully, you don't need to provide the link; I found one. A store manager at Target makes ~ $66K/yr; a department manager (which may have been what our patients did), $48,500/yr.

Target vs. Walmart -- Which One Is a Better Place to Work? - Careers Articles

District managers may make up to $110K/yr.
How much does a Target store manager make? Someone who manages one entire Target store? - Yahoo! Answers
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Old 04-24-2013, 02:13 PM
 
56,500 posts, read 80,803,243 times
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I think some people need to read this great article: Thomas Sowell - "The Education of Minority Children"

Also, in Buffalo, you can actually find some magnet high schools that have/had equal or higher Black graduation rates than White student graduation rates. You may have a gap in rates, but both are high at times. These are for schools with high or relatively respectable overall graduation rates as well. So, it really does vary. Here are some examples: https://reportcards.nysed.gov/files/...0600010105.pdf

https://reportcards.nysed.gov/files/...0600010128.pdf

https://reportcards.nysed.gov/files/...0600010102.pdf

https://reportcards.nysed.gov/files/...0600010104.pdf

https://reportcards.nysed.gov/files/...0600010098.pdf

Here is a program that is available in both Syracuse and Buffalo as well: Chapters | Say Yes to Education

I also think that expectations from educators play a big part in this as well as the fact that many urban schools have a variety of students to deal with, including refugees, which tend to be poorer and come with less education(including SE Asians).

I also think that it depends on the individual/family, as my parents didn't finish HS(GED's), but had 6 of their 7 children go on to graduate from college. They did send us to private and later predominately white public schools, I don't think we sacrificed any cultural aspects especially given that the "Black" church shaped much of our lives as well to include education. Just at the church I attended growing up, we had kids go to colleges ranging from Michigan State, Penn State, many SUNY schools to HBCU's like Howard. Some attended public urban schools and some attended public suburban schools. Some lived in public housing and some lived in relatively affluent areas. So, it all depends and can vary.
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Old 04-24-2013, 04:09 PM
 
Location: North by Northwest
7,442 posts, read 9,873,926 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Katiana View Post
For all one hears about this, I don't think I've ever heard a teacher say it, and I have several teacher friends. Nor have I seen teachers post about buying their own supplies on CD. One might have to buy something and get reimbursed later, due to bureaucracy, but that's not the same.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Katiana View Post
So the school has some limits on what it will pay for? That doesn't sound too unusual to me. I once worked at a home health agency that made us provide our own pens. Now that was cheap, I thought.
The limits in Philadelphia city schools are insanely low, except for the good neighborhood K-8/magnet schools, and I think even those don't have healthy classroom stipends. I did some pro bono teaching at a school in far West Philly and the teacher I worked with had to buy everything from chalk to construction paper, and these teachers aren't making a ton of money either. It's really a mess in a lot of places.
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Old 04-25-2013, 10:42 AM
Status: "Summer!" (set 14 days ago)
 
Location: Foot of the Rockies
86,980 posts, read 102,527,356 times
Reputation: 33045
Quote:
Originally Posted by HeavenWood View Post
The limits in Philadelphia city schools are insanely low, except for the good neighborhood K-8/magnet schools, and I think even those don't have healthy classroom stipends. I did some pro bono teaching at a school in far West Philly and the teacher I worked with had to buy everything from chalk to construction paper, and these teachers aren't making a ton of money either. It's really a mess in a lot of places.
I certainly will accept your personal experiences. One has to wonder just what is going on in the Philadelphia schools though. According to this source, the per-pupil expenditure in the Phila. schools is $10,584. It is $6800 in Denver.

Moderator cut: link removed, linking to competitor sites is not allowed
Find your district’s 2012-13 funding numbers | EdNewsColorado

Beginning teacher salary in Philly is $41,111, top is $75,572.
Beginning teacher salary in DPS is $37,927, top is $74,960.

http://static.dpsk12.org/gems/hr2009/20122013Salary.pdf
http://www.nctq.org/docs/7-08.pdf

These salaries are fairly comparable.
Metro Denver Economic Development Corporation

So what's going on in Philly? Too many highly paid administrators? I've always wondered why schools need so many administrators, especially when there is so much professional staff. It seems schools have way more admins than say, a hospital, which has a lot of unskilled laborers.

Last edited by Yac; 05-21-2013 at 06:59 AM..
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Old 04-25-2013, 11:03 AM
nei nei won $500 in our forum's Most Engaging Poster Contest - Thirteenth Edition (Jan-Feb 2015). 

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Location: Long Island / NYC
45,983 posts, read 41,921,149 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Katiana View Post
I certainly will accept your personal experiences. One has to wonder just what is going on in the Philadelphia schools though. According to this source, the per-pupil expenditure in the Phila. schools is $10,584. It is $6800 in Denver.
Most of the neighboring towns to Philadelphia fund their schools quite a bit higher.

$17,165 for the one I went to. New York City is $19,000. As an aside, rural areas aren't mentioned much, but the school district my aunt lives in in upstate NY (rather rural) scores quite a bit worse than NYC for 4th grade reading and math scores. That district is probably worse than most, but it seems many rural areas have issues with schools, too. There's something funny with this map:

New York City Public Schools

Zoom out. Why does Conneticut and Pennsyvlannia score so much higher than neighboring states? Different state tests?
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