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Old 12-24-2013, 07:54 AM
 
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My wife and I once lived in an about a 550sqft apartment for a year, about drove us crazy. Absolutely no room and I am someone who does not have much stuff in the first place.

There is just no room, one tiny bedroom closet, kitchen where two people can hardly fit, good luck with having guests over, a queen size bed fills up the entire bedroom with just enough space to stand up and turn around, etc.

We rented it thinking we could take it and it would not be that bad, but after a month, understood that mistake.
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Old 12-24-2013, 08:35 AM
 
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Personally, about 500sf/person is all the room I need. Much more than that and it becomes inefficient to clean, much less and people start bumping into each other.

And while I don't think I would like a micro-apartment at this stage in my life, if there is a market for it and people want the option I see absolutely no reasons why our zoning codes should deny it to them. The micro apartments tend to be the size of a largish hotel room - I've certainly lived out of that kind of space for months at a time and its perfectly doable for young singles if they have:

1. plenty of nearby restaurants, cafes, take out options and delivery available near by; and
2. Great options for shared space (nearby park, plaza, jogging trails, rooftop deck, etc.).

If I had this I'd simply not bother with trying to cook at home. No sense in using space for that - just a small fridge for drinks and leftovers, a microwave and a coffee maker.
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Old 12-24-2013, 12:56 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Komeht View Post
One thing has nothing to do with the other. Liver work play has to do with where live in relation to job and leisure, not the size of your residence.

As for their lifestyles being "defined for them" - what else is there? Live, work, play. . .that's pretty much everything right. The idea is that you can do this in your home or outside your front door by choosing to live in a place that can accommodate this. If people want to do this (and many do) what's it to you?

I just don't understand the mentality that is so hostile to urbanism that people don't even want the option for it to exist.
Not hostility to urbanism just concern for the conseqences. Cramming people into small spaces isn't always a good thing. I think there should be laws regarding who may rent this type. Not a problem for a single person, but so much as an infant and this arrangment would create problems. In terms of low income housing this only has limited potential for this problem. An low income single could afford it, but if you cram a family in this small a space you will have problems. There were studies in the 80ies that found a correlation between crime and crowding in low income housing. This also likely does not help the situation in regards to housing for the disabled either as all that rearanging for sleep, cookign ect. is going to be a problem as well as perhaps lack fo space fow a wheel chair.

Last edited by chirack; 12-24-2013 at 01:07 PM..
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Old 12-24-2013, 01:18 PM
 
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Originally Posted by chirack View Post
Not hostility to urbanism just concern for the conseqences. Cramming people into small spaces isn't always a good thing. I think there should be laws regarding who may rent this type. Not a problem for a single person, but so much as an infant and this arrangment would create problems. In terms of low income housing this only has limited potential for this problem. An low income single could afford it, but if you cram a family in this small a space you will have problems. There were studies in the 80ies that found a correlation between crime and crowding in low income housing. This also likely does not help the situation in regards to housing for the disabled either as all that rearanging for sleep, cookign ect. is going to be a problem as well as perhaps lack fo space fow a wheel chair.
Are we going to make the same mistakes made with Cabrini Green in Chicago all over again? Nature abhors crowding and humans are not exempt from nature no matter how much some humans try to be.
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Old 12-24-2013, 01:35 PM
 
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Originally Posted by AtkinsonDan View Post
Are we going to make the same mistakes made with Cabrini Green in Chicago all over again? Nature abhors crowding and humans are not exempt from nature no matter how much some humans try to be.
This is insane. There are plenty of very dense places that are hugely desirable - all over the world in fact.
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Old 12-24-2013, 02:08 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Komeht View Post
This is insane. There are plenty of very dense places that are hugely desirable - all over the world in fact.
The problem wasn't lack of desirability, it was more this was what they could afford and stuffing way more people into a building than it was designed to hold. An single person in a space like this no problem, but can you imagine not having seperate rooms for other people and so on. Also people tend to buy as much space as they can afford unless other factors are at work.
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Old 12-24-2013, 02:18 PM
 
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Reminds me of the old saw about moving to Southern California. You spend more time outdoors for two reasons. One, the weather is mostly good, and two, with the size apartment you can afford, you want to be out.
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Old 12-24-2013, 02:46 PM
 
Location: Oakland, CA
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I don't understand why the creation of small apartments automatically means people,will cram 4 people into them. I live in a 500 sqft studio. Now I feel like I could use a bit more space, but I am coming off a stint of working at home, and I could definitely tone down in terms of possessions. I think 400 sqft per per person is plenty of space, with a smart design. I also think living. In a small studio in a building with great amenities would be a great option for many people.

I this article is fear mongering as all of the "micro apartments" are targeted at people who live alone not more.

In many areas there is an extreme lack of housing development, and more infrastructure would make a huge difference.

There is no rule that says living in a studio is a forever choice for all life stages.
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Old 12-24-2013, 03:34 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jade408 View Post
I don't understand why the creation of small apartments automatically means people,will cram 4 people into them. I live in a 500 sqft studio. Now I feel like I could use a bit more space, but I am coming off a stint of working at home, and I could definitely tone down in terms of possessions. I think 400 sqft per per person is plenty of space, with a smart design. I also think living. In a small studio in a building with great amenities would be a great option for many people.

I this article is fear mongering as all of the "micro apartments" are targeted at people who live alone not more.

In many areas there is an extreme lack of housing development, and more infrastructure would make a huge difference.

There is no rule that says living in a studio is a forever choice for all life stages.
This is exactly right.

In college I shared a single room and shared a bathroom with an entire floor in a high rise dorm. I had zero SF of personal space and maybe 200 sf dorm room to share.

Later 4 of us shared a two bed/two bath apartment - that time I only shared the bathroom with my roommate.

When I got a job in DC, I rented a 3 story town home with 5 other folks - we each had our own room but shared a bathroom - worked great at the time.

Later, as a young professional I got a two bed-room apartment, shared it with a guy - we each had our own room and bathroom.

As I earned more, I moved into my own place - a two bedroom/1 bath.

Then I got hitched, we bought an 1800 sf bungalow.

Took a well paying job in another city - bought a 2000 sf house.

Later, we decided to not have kids, we downsized into a 1700 sf town home.

etc. etc.

Different stages, different needs, different housing types. It's critical to provide for many options for many different people in various stages of life.
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Old 12-24-2013, 04:07 PM
 
Location: Oakland, CA
27,165 posts, read 29,650,120 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Komeht View Post

Different stages, different needs, different housing types. It's critical to provide for many options for many different people in various stages of life.
The only housing we seem to build assumes 2 parents, 2 kids, 2 cars and a dog when all go the stats and data show the average household looks a lot different these days and we refuse to build and design accordingly.

For example I have little need for a formal dining room. A few times a year I'd love to host a gathering of 12-20 people. No need to move into a huge place for that need, I'd happily use a shared entertaining room. Now my shared entertaining room is my favorite restaurant of the season.
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