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What will depend on city? The thread questions whether families will "really live in cities".
The link to the article regarding the rising unaffordability suggests that families (and singles) looking for affordable housing will be headed out of the city. Has nothing to do with race but rather the unsustainable economics of urbanism as promoted in these forums.
Last edited by IC_deLight; 07-10-2014 at 09:53 PM..
What will depend on city? The thread questions whether families will "really live in cities".
The link to the article regarding the rising unaffordability suggests that families (and singles) looking for affordable housing will be headed out of the city. Has nothing to do with race but rather the unsustainable economics of urbanism as promoted in these forums.
True, but the article suggested rising housing costs are common in many, perhaps the majority of cities. Youngstown is an extreme for low housing costs, due to high levels of abandonment plus being a rather poor and small metro overall.
I didn't have Youngstown in mind when I made the post.
I don't keep a close eye on the real estate markets in these cities, but I believe housing in Cleveland, Columbus, Cincinnati, Pittsburgh, etc. is still relatively affordable.
As to Pittsburgh, I can say while it's affordable by national standards, by local standards there has been a huge increase in prices in the walkable urban core.
Seven years ago, I bought a modest, 1260 square foot rowhouse for $53,000. We've put a lot of work into it, and can sell it for upwards of $200,000 now. This is a great thing, since now that we have two kids our house is getting way too small (especially having only one bathroom). We also don't have to worry about local schools now, so theoretically we can move anywhere in the city.
But the housing search has not gone well. It's pretty much impossible to buy a larger size rowhouse (e.g., 3-4 bedrooms, 1.5-2 baths) in Pittsburgh for under $300,000. By national standards this would be considered affordable, but by Pittsburgh standards it isn't really, and it would result in essentially a doubling of our current mortgage (which is around $525 per month). So even though our preferences are for an attached rowhouse with no front yard near a major business district, we're finding we'd need to make too many sacrifices ( too small, needs a lot of work, bad street parking situation) to only marginally trade up in space. Whereas if we look at one of the less walkable neighborhoods in the city, and a detached early 20th century home, we can just get a lot more house for the money.
As to Pittsburgh, I can say while it's affordable by national standards, by local standards there has been a huge increase in prices in the walkable urban core.
Seven years ago, I bought a modest, 1260 square foot rowhouse for $53,000. We've put a lot of work into it, and can sell it for upwards of $200,000 now. This is a great thing, since now that we have two kids our house is getting way too small (especially having only one bathroom). We also don't have to worry about local schools now, so theoretically we can move anywhere in the city.
But the housing search has not gone well. It's pretty much impossible to buy a larger size rowhouse (e.g., 3-4 bedrooms, 1.5-2 baths) in Pittsburgh for under $300,000. By national standards this would be considered affordable, but by Pittsburgh standards it isn't really, and it would result in essentially a doubling of our current mortgage (which is around $525 per month). So even though our preferences are for an attached rowhouse with no front yard near a major business district, we're finding we'd need to make too many sacrifices ( too small, needs a lot of work, bad street parking situation) to only marginally trade up in space. Whereas if we look at one of the less walkable neighborhoods in the city, and a detached early 20th century home, we can just get a lot more house for the money.
How does that $300k compare to a newer house in the suburbs, though?
In Cleveland, (a city whose real estate I'm only marginally more familiar with) a fully renovated house in its most gentrified neighborhoods will still cost about the same as a nearly equivalent house in the stereotypical 'burbs.
How does that $300k compare to a newer house in the suburbs, though?
It's almost certainly cheaper. Honestly I tend to filter out any houses built after 1929 from housing searches, so I don't like newer styles. We could easily buy a "dated house" (e.g., a historic one otherwise in good shape) in the top school districts in the county for around the same price however.
Good article here on housing affordability in Philly (relevant to a lot of other places) and if you scroll down it has a graph price per square foot in various cities.
Seven years ago, I bought a modest, 1260 square foot rowhouse for $53,000. We've put a lot of work into it, and can sell it for upwards of $200,000 now. This is a great thing, since now that we have two kids our house is getting way too small (especially having only one bathroom). We also don't have to worry about local schools now, so theoretically we can move anywhere in the city.
Now just think about that for a minute. For what intrinsic reason should your rowhouse possibly
appreciate nearly 400% in seven years? Granted you've put a lot of work into it and surely have
reaped a lot of sweat equity. And if it is in certain neighborhoods that used to be sketchy but are
quickly gentrifying (Lawrenceville, East Liberty) that has an effect too.
But unless you built a deck out of 24 karat gold or something this is really hard to defend.
What I have noticed as a long-time Pittsburgher is a lot of people moving in here from D.C.,
Boston, the West Coast, etc. who have more money than brains. A house near my parents
that no local would ever have offered more than around $80K for recently went to a couple
from California for over $200 grand. They would have paid even more where they came from
so they think they are getting a good deal.
And realtors are taking full advantage of it.
Granted it does have the positive effect of encouraging people to move into long-declining
neighborhoods to buy fixer-uppers and invest in turning these places around.
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