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Old 04-09-2014, 05:20 PM
 
Location: Oakland, CA
27,171 posts, read 29,674,744 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nei View Post
some comparisons of mid century European (and a South American example) suburbs and newer American ones. Didn't use particularly appealing American ones, though.

Old Urbanist: Setbacks, Suburbs and the American Front Lawn
This was an interesting comparison. Here is the setback scenario for the single family homes a neighborhood or 2 down from mine:
https://www.google.com/maps/@37.8128...jemLB1SvnQ!2e0

This area has mostly homes from about 1920-1940 or so.

*This is one of my fave neighborhoods in Oakland, it is about 2 miles from me, not super walkable/transit friendly, but if you walk 10 or so minutes you get to a small commercial district with about 2 dozen restaurants, a dozen shops, and typical services trader joes, a couple of drug stores, and coffee shops. Add 5 more minutes and you get a weekly farmers market, and another larger commercial street with more (similar). So you might need to walk 10 minutes to get to the more frequent bus service and go about 1 mile to get to a larger neighboring commercial district. But on the scheme of things that is pretty good, better than most places by far.
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Old 04-16-2014, 07:54 PM
 
Location: Chicagoland-Joliet
147 posts, read 118,137 times
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Europe ended up less car dependent than the US, Canada etc. because the streets are older and were built long before we even existed and you really cant just change all the streets to make them wider. I was watching a show once about the protests in Spain and they showed a clip of a fire engine speeding through the street it took up ALL of that street it was really small and quite frankly I am glad we are more car dependent so our fire engines, ambulances and police cars can actually fit through the streets.
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Old 04-16-2014, 09:44 PM
 
9,520 posts, read 14,834,426 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nei View Post
some comparisons of mid century European (and a South American example) suburbs and newer American ones. Didn't use particularly appealing American ones, though.

Old Urbanist: Setbacks, Suburbs and the American Front Lawn
They didn't use particularly appealing anything. Rio, especially. Nothing says Third World like narrow cobblestone streets bordered by high walls and cars parked on the sidewalk. Frankfurt has the same prison-like feeling but avoids the Third World effect by being far too well-maintained.

The nicest place is the one in the advertisement he's making fun of. It looks like it could be my area of NJ but there's a lot of places it could be.
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Old 04-16-2014, 10:58 PM
Status: "Summer!" (set 21 days ago)
 
Location: Foot of the Rockies
87,011 posts, read 102,621,396 times
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^^Agreed. Do note that all the US/Canadian examples have sidewalks. Must be an optical illusion, as we know US suburbs don't have them!
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Old 04-16-2014, 11:16 PM
 
Location: M I N N E S O T A
14,800 posts, read 17,718,331 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nei View Post
some comparisons of mid century European (and a South American example) suburbs and newer American ones. Didn't use particularly appealing American ones, though.

Old Urbanist: Setbacks, Suburbs and the American Front Lawn
I loved the Calgary and Vegas ones
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Old 04-17-2014, 11:11 AM
 
1,110 posts, read 909,369 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Prarie State View Post
Europe ended up less car dependent than the US, Canada etc. because the streets are older and were built long before we even existed and you really cant just change all the streets to make them wider. I was watching a show once about the protests in Spain and they showed a clip of a fire engine speeding through the street it took up ALL of that street it was really small and quite frankly I am glad we are more car dependent so our fire engines, ambulances and police cars can actually fit through the streets.
I haven't heard of fires causing huge problems in European cities, so I would guess that the fire trucks and water system (for fire hydrants) have been adapted to those narrow streets.
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Old 04-17-2014, 11:23 AM
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Location: Long Island / NYC
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nybbler View Post
They didn't use particularly appealing anything. Rio, especially. Nothing says Third World like narrow cobblestone streets bordered by high walls and cars parked on the sidewalk. Frankfurt has the same prison-like feeling but avoids the Third World effect by being far too well-maintained.
At first glance, I thought Rio was the most appealing of them, mainly because of the interesting tropical vegetation. It's not as obviously monotonous, either. Of course, looking more carefully seeing a barbed wire fence above the first floor of one of the houses does say Third World, or at least Latin America. Cars parked on the sidewalk happens sometimes in England, and the street isn't any narrower than the European, first-world example. I thought the narrow cobblestone street made it more attractive.

Describing the Frankfurt one as prison-like seems really extreme. It's just a bunch of houses near the street with some bushes and fences. Don't like the fences, but prison-like? Houses are definitely cookie-cutter (at least try painting the houses different colors!), but then again so are the North America ones, with the added detraction of a wide expanse of ashaplt and for a couple, a rather monotonous expanse of grass.

But no, none of the non-North American are that nice looking, but I didn't think they were obviously awful. The Prague one isn't bad even with the annoying fences, and the bushes in front of the Rome ones go well with the houses. Except for what appears to be a lack of sidewalk in the Rome one.
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Old 04-17-2014, 11:24 AM
nei nei won $500 in our forum's Most Engaging Poster Contest - Thirteenth Edition (Jan-Feb 2015). 

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Location: Long Island / NYC
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Quote:
Originally Posted by orlando-calrissian View Post
I haven't heard of fires causing huge problems in European cities, so I would guess that the fire trucks and water system (for fire hydrants) have been adapted to those narrow streets.
From his quote, it sounded like the fire engine managed to speed through.
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Old 04-17-2014, 01:15 PM
 
Location: Chicagoland-Joliet
147 posts, read 118,137 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by orlando-calrissian View Post
I haven't heard of fires causing huge problems in European cities, so I would guess that the fire trucks and water system (for fire hydrants) have been adapted to those narrow streets.
yea but even then it is a pretty tight squeeze.
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Old 04-24-2014, 04:42 PM
 
8,977 posts, read 8,109,767 times
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I have read throughout the postings and keep realizing there are two types of people reading and commenting on these threads.

Type 1--Big City Residents. They think public transportation, bicycles, and walking are all that anyone should need for transportation.

Type 2--Rural Population. They look at altogether differently, and realize that auto transportation is the only way for them to get around locally and by auto or air when they want to go cross country.

Some keep talking about how it is done in Europe, especially England. That is so different a situation than the majority of the U.S. it is not even funny.

Take my state of Montana as an example. Montana with a population of just about exactly 1,000,000 in the entire state with the largest city of 100,000 is almost 3 times the size of England with a population of 56,500,000 people or about half again the population of the entire United Kingdom with a population of 63,395,486. Towns and cities are many miles apart, unlike England where the next town is 5 miles down the road. Example we drive 50 miles to Billings the largest city, just to go shopping. We drive to Billings for any medical specialties. Billings has top rated medical facilities that serve 4 states and Southern Canada. One of the few medical facilities that own 2 helicopters, and 3 twin engine turbo prop aircraft to handle emergency medical problems. All fully staffed with top people.

My daughter has to drive to Denver, Co. for a medical appointment on Monday with a top specialist this weekend, which is a day each way. The has to make this trip 4 to 6 times every year.

In our part of the country, public transportation is not an option, and never will be.

Some people cry on this thread that we should tax gasoline, etc., etc., to the point people cannot afford to drive, and have to use public transportation.

They complain that the states out here in the west, often receive more in tax money than they pay in, which they think is unfair. What the don't realize is, a lot of this extra money is government payment in lieu of the government paying property taxes on land the government owns in the state. When you consider all the federal government owns in the state, some states such as Nevada is 86% owned by the federal government, there is no way that the state would not receive more from the federal government than the citizens pay out to the government. Consider a lot of that money in the west, goes to the Indian Reservations and counted as money into the state being more than is paid out. Montana has 7 large Indian reservations, with largest larger than the smallest state.

I have lived both in largest cities in U.S., and in small town America. I understand both sides of the coin, unlike so many on these threads, that only see their local situation and beliefs.

Population is concentrated. 80% of people live within 62 miles of the coast, with about 40% living within 37 miles of a coast. Just think that there is nearly 3,000 miles between those population concentrations. What works within 50 miles of a coast, is not usable for nearly 3,000 miles except for a few major cities.

We are a large country, and what works in one area does not work other areas, especially for transportation.
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