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Old 04-25-2014, 07:33 PM
nei nei won $500 in our forum's Most Engaging Poster Contest - Thirteenth Edition (Jan-Feb 2015). 

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Location: Long Island / NYC
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chirack View Post
Actually it does. My own relatives used to use the car to drive to visit family that were out of state. People in this country do make road trips.
And what do people do in Europe? My relatives in England do both. Of course it's generally easier to not drive there for those things. But without making a comparison to Europe [which a number of posts on this thread don't for some reason ], your post doesn't say much. The way it reads, it almost suggests that using a car to visit family and going on road trips is American only thing.
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Old 04-25-2014, 07:34 PM
Status: "Summer!" (set 26 days ago)
 
Location: Foot of the Rockies
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nei View Post
No. Colorado is mostly know for skiing and mountains here.



Perhaps bike. But walk in any convenient sense? Probably not. You stated most people don't live 1/2 mile from amenities. You could up the distance thershold a bit further, but unless all the shops are in the same place, it's not that practical for much further.
I don't know when I said that, but I'm sure you can find chapter and verse. I maybe said I didn't live within 1/2 mi. of amenities, except for a Mormon church. Actually, many people that live in the flats of Louisville live within 1/2 mile of retail and restaurants.
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Old 04-25-2014, 07:48 PM
nei nei won $500 in our forum's Most Engaging Poster Contest - Thirteenth Edition (Jan-Feb 2015). 

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Location: Long Island / NYC
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Katiana View Post
I don't know when I said that, but I'm sure you can find chapter and verse. I maybe said I didn't live within 1/2 mi. of amenities, except for a Mormon church. Actually, many people that live in the flats of Louisville live within 1/2 mile of retail and restaurants.
Here ya go:

Do any American public transit systems earn a net profit? Could any do so (in the near future)?
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Old 04-25-2014, 07:57 PM
Status: "Summer!" (set 26 days ago)
 
Location: Foot of the Rockies
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That's probably true as far as it goes. But I do think most here in my town, whose downtown "Main Street", actually named Main St. I have posted pictures of too many times to mention, live within a mile of something. It may not be downtown, but there are a number of little strip malls, some to small to be called malls, really. There's a recreation center. There's the library (downtown), several grocery stores.
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Old 04-25-2014, 08:03 PM
 
Location: Portland, Oregon
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Katiana View Post
That's probably true as far as it goes. But I do think most here in my town, whose downtown "Main Street", actually named Main St. I have posted pictures of too many times to mention, live within a mile of something. It may not be downtown, but there are a number of little strip malls, some to small to be called malls, really. There's a recreation center. There's the library (downtown), several grocery stores.
Yes, your town functions more like a small town than a typical sprawling suburb.
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Old 04-25-2014, 08:09 PM
nei nei won $500 in our forum's Most Engaging Poster Contest - Thirteenth Edition (Jan-Feb 2015). 

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Location: Long Island / NYC
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Do you think your town is typical of the Denver metro in that way? I think at one mile, few would choose to walk. And if it's a handful of stores, it might not be what they need.

Comparing to Europe, this survey shows far fewer Americans walk for transportation:

9 reasons why the USA ended up so much more car dependent than Europe

Comparing to Western Europe, most people in western European countries don't use transit regularly, but at least half walked for transportation. I imagining in suburbs or small cities there, it's dense enough that people have a commercial district in a short walk, but their workplace (unless in the downtown) is not on a direct transit route, so most drive.
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Old 04-25-2014, 08:15 PM
Status: "Summer!" (set 26 days ago)
 
Location: Foot of the Rockies
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nei View Post
Do you think your town is typical of the Denver metro in that way? I think at one mile, few would choose to walk. And if it's a handful of stores, it might not be what they need.

Comparing to Europe, this survey shows far fewer Americans walk for transportation:

9 reasons why the USA ended up so much more car dependent than Europe

Comparing to Western Europe, most people in western European countries don't use transit regularly, but at least half walked for transportation. I imagining in suburbs or small cities there, it's dense enough that people have a commercial district in a short walk, but their workplace (unless in the downtown) is not on a direct transit route, so most drive.
There are a lot of Denver suburbs that were once small towns. There are a lot of Denver suburbs that have little strip malls scattered about. Now if you can tolerate walking to the mall, you can walk. My daughter lives in a housing development in an unincorporated area of one of the suburban counties and she has a grocery store and a Kohl's within walking distance at a strip mall. It's probably under a mile. One does see people out and about, walking, when the weather is nice.
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Old 04-25-2014, 09:21 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nei View Post
And what do people do in Europe? My relatives in England do both. Of course it's generally easier to not drive there for those things. But without making a comparison to Europe [which a number of posts on this thread don't for some reason ], your post doesn't say much. The way it reads, it almost suggests that using a car to visit family and going on road trips is American only thing.
No what I am saying is that when you compare the US to countries in Europe, you are talking about countries that are about the size of an large US state, countries that have greater population density and much older roads that were not designed for an car or even an street car. This is going to make huge impacts as to what transportation is viable.

The UK is about 94,500 square miles, about the size of Michigan. It has a population density of 649 people per square mile. The US has an population density of 83.8 people per square mile and the state of Michigan has an population density of 175 per square mile. The UK as an whole has three times the density of Michigan.

In the US, you are much more likely to be or go somewhere where there is NOT the density to support an mass transit system and often NOT 24 hours. I used to head out to a burb 43 miles from Chicago at night for an social event. There is no way I could expect an town of 53,000 to be able to support an public transit system capable of getting me there after 6P.M. and back to the rail station. Sure there is commuter rail and some limited bus service to said town, but I don’t live that close to the rail line on the Chicago end and there is no way from the station save an taxi on the other end. The social function meet at one place and then traveled to another for dinner (another taxi ride or impose on them to take me there). Driving is the best option here.

In addition density drives how viable retail can be. You need a certain amount of customers within a reasonable distance from the store. You can have more stores in shorter distances in the UK than the US.

The shorted distances that the rail system has to go likely make more frequent service and service to more areas viable as well as the destiny. The US has about 1379 persons per KM of rail track. The UK has 3825. If I need X number of people to make the train trip profitable or affordable I have three times as many potential customers per KM in the UK than the US.

This is why those areas are less car dependent. They are more likely to go to a town where the busses or rail are more easy to fill because there is enough density across the country as an whole. There are old roads that can’t support car transit as well and they are not likely to be going huge distances for anything. It is much easier to have retail in walking distance of much of the country when the population density of the country is high.

My relatives drove from Chicago to a small town in Mississippi (which used to have rail service but lost it in the last decade, even when it had it may be less than 6 people would get off the train or on the train at the station). I also have relatives that drive to Michigan for a vacation home, there is bus service but no rail service and the town has very little public transit because it is pretty rural outside it's core as the town only has 4,000 people.

Last edited by chirack; 04-25-2014 at 10:11 PM..
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Old 04-25-2014, 11:18 PM
 
Location: Oakland, CA
27,171 posts, read 29,708,722 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Katiana View Post
There are a lot of Denver suburbs that were once small towns. There are a lot of Denver suburbs that have little strip malls scattered about. Now if you can tolerate walking to the mall, you can walk. My daughter lives in a housing development in an unincorporated area of one of the suburban counties and she has a grocery store and a Kohl's within walking distance at a strip mall. It's probably under a mile. One does see people out and about, walking, when the weather is nice.
A mile is too far for most people. It is fine for a leisurely stroll but not if you have stuff to do. The practical distance is 1/2 mile or less to regularly walk for errands and such. Probably more like 1/4 mile.
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Old 04-25-2014, 11:42 PM
 
Location: Portland, Oregon
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Originally Posted by jade408 View Post
A mile is too far for most people. It is fine for a leisurely stroll but not if you have stuff to do. The practical distance is 1/2 mile or less to regularly walk for errands and such. Probably more like 1/4 mile.
I have to walk about 3/4 a mile to get to the train and it is just a bit too long but still doable. Can do the walk in about 12-15 minutes. But the drop off rate after 1/2 miles goes down quickly.
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