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Old 02-27-2014, 08:15 PM
 
Location: California
30,701 posts, read 33,467,623 times
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Geographically Oakland should be a place people aspire to live in, a world class city that not everyone can afford. Unfortunately it didn't end up that way for a multitude of reasons, but I think over time that could change. It might not be a place where large amounts of poor people can live though, or perpetual generations because THEIR ancestors lived there, but that's ok. There can only be so much low cost housing anywhere and the more desirable the area, the less affordable housing there will be. You can't fight that..
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Old 02-27-2014, 08:18 PM
 
82 posts, read 105,007 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ohiogirl81 View Post
Underscoring this.
I think you may have hit the nail on the head. I'm not the problem if I move in. I am only part of the problem if I work against the people who need help. I would be part of the solution if I work towards solutions to poverty such as a decent transit, education and medical services for said neigborhood.
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Old 02-27-2014, 08:30 PM
 
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Originally Posted by verybadgnome View Post
It is not a system but rather how our real estate market works. In order to bring new units to market and also to fix up old homes and apartments in disrepair it takes capital. There are homes in East Austin that have been condemned b/c they are unlivable. The only way any developer will build a new home is if he can recoup his costs for labor, materials and permits. There is no way he be will do this and be able to rent out the home for $600/mo. - the numbers just don't add up. Are you suggesting that developers become non-profits? Or do you want to subsidize them and add to our already high property taxes?

Sorry but if you have less resources you have less options in life. People with degrees who were born in the U.A.E. have more options than those with a second grade education from Uganda. Neither you nor I can rectify that situation.

All people are created equal but that does not mean that all outcomes will be equal. Some people work to maximize their incomes while others work to maximize their leisure time. It's their choice. I cannot afford to live in DT Austin or Tarrytown so should someone give me enough money so I can? Will you write me a frickin' six figure check so I can live in The Austonian?

Now the market is fair in that those selling their homes will get market prices.
No offense, I' am not one to buy that line of thinking. Yes, some people do have less options than I do. It is true that no one can change the world by themselves alone but one person can make a difference. Another way to put it is that yes I will not going to be able to end poverty all by myself but if I can help a few immigrants learn English or help a few ex-cons to get their GED's so they get decent jobs and stay out of the system, then I'll be happy because I did everything I can do.
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Old 02-27-2014, 08:42 PM
 
82 posts, read 105,007 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Considering Coming Back View Post
Did you say where you are going to live?

Personally, I am all for gentrification. When I lived in DC it was exciting to see the city finally recover from the riots and deurbanization. The new residents there value urban living in a way the preious residents did not. The new residents are less likely to own cars, more likely to use alternative transportation, consume less space, and demand walkable shops and grocery stores.

That said, some times gentrifies are just plain dumb. I have dear firends paying more to live in Crown Heights than an equal apartment would cost on the Upper West Side. I would never tell them they are making a bad choice, but anonymously I can tell you: they are making a bad choice. The transportation access, commute times, services, parks, etc are all much better on W 79th street than Nostrand Ave. They are paying money for the cache of walking to cool bars. At least that's how I see it.

In sum just don't be like me friends. LOL
I'm not really sure yet. I'm from Indiana. Indianapolis, for me, is the "safe bet." With that being said, Chicago is probably my 1st pick. The rest of the cities in the Midwest are definitely in consideration. Outside of that, I would say the short list is: Raleigh Durham, Nashville, Dallas, Austin, San Antonio, Denver, Albuquerque, and pretty much the whole West Coast. I'm hesitant about moving out east; too cold and too many a## holes.
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Old 02-27-2014, 11:55 PM
 
Location: Oakland, CA
27,166 posts, read 29,665,044 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ceece View Post
Geographically Oakland should be a place people aspire to live in, a world class city that not everyone can afford. Unfortunately it didn't end up that way for a multitude of reasons, but I think over time that could change. It might not be a place where large amounts of poor people can live though, or perpetual generations because THEIR ancestors lived there, but that's ok. There can only be so much low cost housing anywhere and the more desirable the area, the less affordable housing there will be. You can't fight that..
I don't completely agree. Oakland is like a Tale of 2 Cities. From my vantage point, in the nice part of town, lots of great stuff is happening. But I am started off from a place of privilege. There are plenty of people that aspire to live in Oakland (there are loads of nice neighborhoods). For people in different parts of town, it is hard to see or believe that living in the "other" Oakland is even an option.

A city isn't better because it has eliminated poor people. There are always going to be different income levels, and people at all income levels deserve a safe and convenient place to live.

But what Oakland does need is to close the opportunity gap between the haves and have nots. Close the opportunity gap, and the crime will take care of itself. There will always be a subset of people drawn to crime because they are criminals, but eliminating the people who choose crime because there is no other option or opportunity is critical. Poor educational quality and economic opportunity is the real issue. (And there are a few more that are way off topic, but we need to work on letting people who served their time participate more fully in society)
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Old 02-28-2014, 12:08 AM
 
26,589 posts, read 52,286,267 times
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Had our first Neighborhood watch meeting tonight... much we already do... everyone on the street has the phone and e-mail and we already use it... might not be anything for a month or two or a couple of messages in one day.

We have not had any problems and want to keep it that way and this is half the battle.

Oakland is like this... On one block everyone gets involved and looks out and the next no one cares about getting involved.

One of the topics that came up is bay area crime stats... seems many other cities are making the news regarding crime... one's that didn't... even going back only a few years.

The police officer was very candid... part of the presentation was about making our little corner of East Oakland undesirable for criminals.

Some of my neighbors have been on the street over 50 years and others 18 months.

To me, it says something when people choose to stay and even after 40 or 50 years are willing to come together to make it better.
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Old 02-28-2014, 12:15 AM
 
Location: Oakland, CA
27,166 posts, read 29,665,044 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ultrarunner View Post
Had our first Neighborhood watch meeting tonight... much we already do... everyone on the street has the phone and e-mail and we already use it... might not be anything for a month or two or a couple of messages in one day.

We have not had any problems and want to keep it that way and this is half the battle.

Oakland is like this... On one block everyone gets involved and looks out and the next no one cares about getting involved.

One of the topics that came up is bay area crime stats... seems many other cities are making the news regarding crime... one's that didn't... even going back only a few years.

The police officer was very candid... part of the presentation was about making our little corner of East Oakland undesirable for criminals.
It is very interesting how uneven the crime reporting in the Bay Area is. Sorry to burst everyone's bubble in the thread, but SF severely under reports its crime in the main media sources, while simultaneously reporting most crimes in Oakland. I.E. a non-fatal shooting in Oakland will be a headlong story, but a similar incident in SF is buried in the news briefs...maybe. More like only reported in one of the indie papers.

There is this perception that "no one in Oakland cares about crime." That isn't the case at all. But the news never covers the crimes that don't happen. Or the quite pockets where criminals aren't welcome.
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Old 02-28-2014, 06:46 AM
 
5,691 posts, read 8,758,435 times
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Raleigh Durham, Nashville, Dallas, Austin, San Antonio, Denver, Albuquerque, and pretty much the whole West Coast.

OP, I think if you choose a city like San Antonio, ABQ, Indianappolis, Chicago and perhaps Dallas you can be part of the solution. Cities that have become trendy and prices are driving people out - Durham, Nashville, Austin, Denver - you can't help but be part of the problem, no matter how well intentioned you are. I suppose you could mitigate this by living in a new multi unit building that took the place of 2+ houses or an abandoned industrial site. But in the first case you still have 2+ families that have been displaced.
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Old 02-28-2014, 06:57 AM
 
2,388 posts, read 2,954,813 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ultrarunner View Post
I have seen this repeated many times as an Oakland resident and property manager.

Rented a 3 bedroom home to a single mom with 4 kids... she worked and her kids were in school.

Two years ago she gave notice to move and said the place was great... she just wanted to get out of Oakland... she moved to much newer 3 bedroom home in Vallejo... my home was built in the 1920's and her new home in the 1980's... it had A/C and a dishwasher.

Anyway, she said moving was a huge mistake and nothing like she had imagined.... she wants to move back to Oakland and finds rents have risen and is priced out... things they liked to do as a family like go to Lake Merrit or the Oakland Zoo are things they miss... they also miss their friends and worry everytime they leave their new home... she never had an alarm in Oakland and had to put one in at the new place after two breakins the first month they moved in.

Another family sold and moved to a very nice new home in Tracy... they are very unhappy with everything except their big home... and even then, paying for A/C all summer runs up their electric bill.

Another family moved to Antioch and if anything, there kids that attended Skyline in Oakland are constantly having problems in Antioch having to prove themselves.

The grass is not always greener...
This. All day.

I like most of my neighbors - there are 2 households on our block that are trouble but everyone else is cool - but at least half of them talk about selling out and moving to the suburbs. Most of them are 1st generation immigrants and as much as I try it's hard to get across to them that the places they talk about moving to are in decline (inner-ring suburbs in Delaware County) while the neighborhood they already live in is on the upswing. They don't see it or don't care. They just want that "american dream".

*There are a few apartments on my block over the corner stores but almost everyone else owns their house.
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Old 02-28-2014, 07:32 AM
 
Location: North by Northwest
7,442 posts, read 9,880,422 times
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Neighborhoods change--sometimes for the better, sometimes for the worse. Gentrification has its pros and cons, and it's certainly not a one-off solution to urban decay. However, one thing I do firmly believe is that no one group of people has the inherent right to "be in control" of any neighborhood, be they upper class whites in an exurban gated community or working poor minorities in the inner city.

That said, I advocate for collaboration and goodwill in "transitioning" neighborhoods whenever possible. Sometimes rising rents prohibit that. Other times, one side (or both sides) is closed off to interacting with their "others." Be a positive part of that change by trying to work with, rather than against, your new neighbors.
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