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Old 03-10-2014, 01:42 PM
 
Location: Mt. Airy
5,312 posts, read 5,363,077 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KaaBoom View Post
That is correct. The examples given in the map images actually showed the railroad lines along the western boundary of Globeville. The rail lines inside the neighborhood are like the ones below. Hardly anything that would impact people from walking. A big difference from two 20 foot high sound walls with six lanes of freeway traffic in between them .
You mean this isn't walkable?

https://maps.google.com/maps?q=Globe...81.88,,0,10.94

You surely COULD walk here:

https://maps.google.com/maps?q=Globe...,8.71,,0,12.02

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Old 03-10-2014, 01:42 PM
 
Location: Foot of the Rockies
87,138 posts, read 102,962,171 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KaaBoom View Post
That is correct. The examples given in the map images actually showed the railroad lines along the western boundary of Globeville. The rail lines inside the neighborhood are like the ones below. Hardly anything that would impact people from walking. A big difference from two 20 foot high sound walls with six lanes of freeway traffic in between them .
How disingenous! If you look at this map, https://www.google.com/maps/place/25...28dd70e0eb176c, you will see that there are for the most part several sets of track. (Look east of I-25 to find the tracks.) Please note also, nei, this is just a picture, no way to look around.
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Old 03-10-2014, 01:58 PM
 
3,565 posts, read 1,888,695 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Katiana View Post
Exactly! We shouldn't get too caught up in these conspiracy theories.
That's really not what I mean. I would not characterize such speculation as conspiracy theories. I would suggest that they are hypotheses without proof (although in at least some cases, you could probably find meeting minutes or interviews suggestive of intent). I think that the effect of the construction is more important than the intent, anyways.
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Old 03-10-2014, 02:07 PM
 
Location: Oakland, CA
27,170 posts, read 29,814,382 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Katiana View Post
Walkability seems harder to define than suburb, so don't ask me to do it! If you HAVE to walk, b/c you don't have a car, you look for the shortest way to get somewhere. Convenience helps. But it's not everything. Now if you're walking b/c you want to, to make a statement, or whatever, and the car is home in the driveway/garage, you might want more "entertainment" and nice views along your route.
From my perspective, the bare minimum for a place being walkable combines both safe infrastructure and reasonable distances to useful stuff. I think for "choice" walkers, the reasonable distance is 10 minutes. For "non-choice" walkers, that number is about 20 minutes.

But the definition of usefulness also has a bit to do with lifestyle and lifestyle phase.

I choice my neighborhood and apartment because it was pretty much equally convenient for walking, driving and transit. Although, most of the useful stuff (i.e. retail and services) to me is a 10-15 minute walk. The train stations are a bit further: 1-1.25 miles away. Biking wasn't on my radar when I moved in, so it didn't rank on the list. But over the past 5 years, they have added bike lanes too.

Now my non-driving sister did live with me for a few months. So for her, my apartment was a little bit "bad" on the walkability scale. Because I have a bit of a hill home from every destination, and about a 10 minute walk to the bus that goes to most of her destinations. She survived just fine, but wanted something a little closer to the stuff. So when she found her own place, she stayed in the same neighborhood, but she lives closer (via walking) to the useful stuff. For her it is a 5 minute walk to the "main street" as well as the bus she uses most. And she has a 10 minute walk to the train station.

Since I don't "have" to walk all the time, I don't mind the extra couple of minutes. (And now, I just got lazier and started biking there.)
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Old 03-10-2014, 02:14 PM
nei nei won $500 in our forum's Most Engaging Poster Contest - Thirteenth Edition (Jan-Feb 2015). 

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Location: Long Island / NYC
45,993 posts, read 42,220,191 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Katiana View Post
How disingenous! If you look at this map, https://www.google.com/maps/place/25...28dd70e0eb176c, you will see that there are for the most part several sets of track. (Look east of I-25 to find the tracks.) Please note also, nei, this is just a picture, no way to look around.
Not sure what the point of the snark is, it's easy to look around and check the area. Which was my point earlier.
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Old 03-10-2014, 02:18 PM
nei nei won $500 in our forum's Most Engaging Poster Contest - Thirteenth Edition (Jan-Feb 2015). 

Over $104,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum and additional contests are planned
 
Location: Long Island / NYC
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AJNEOA View Post
Crossing that onramp looks like "fun" in heavy traffic. Once a car started turning towards me (I knew it saw me), I stopped and stared the driver down.
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Old 03-10-2014, 02:21 PM
 
Location: Foot of the Rockies
87,138 posts, read 102,962,171 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nei View Post
Not sure what the point of the snark is, it's easy to look around and check the area. Which was my point earlier.
The idyllic picture Kaboom posted is simply a photo. That's what I was talking about. I don't think it's representative of the railroad tracks in that area. I was not being snarky (for once)!
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Old 03-10-2014, 02:25 PM
nei nei won $500 in our forum's Most Engaging Poster Contest - Thirteenth Edition (Jan-Feb 2015). 

Over $104,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum and additional contests are planned
 
Location: Long Island / NYC
45,993 posts, read 42,220,191 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Katiana View Post
The idyllic picture Kaboom posted is simply a photo. That's what I was talking about. I don't think it's representative of the railroad tracks in that area. I was not being snarky (for once)!
I thought you were referring to the map you linked to, my mistake.
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Old 03-10-2014, 03:07 PM
nei nei won $500 in our forum's Most Engaging Poster Contest - Thirteenth Edition (Jan-Feb 2015). 

Over $104,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum and additional contests are planned
 
Location: Long Island / NYC
45,993 posts, read 42,220,191 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wburg View Post
I didn't argue for it 100%--it was a beneficial side effect from the point of view of most city governments and chambers of commerce, not the primary purpose. There were other ways to get rid of nonwhite neighborhoods, like eminent domain and redevelopment. And poor whites were considered just as expendable as poor blacks (or poor Mexicans, Japanese, Chinese, etc), so the elimination of poor white neighborhoods isn't much of an argument against the use of highways to relocate undesirable neighborhoods...also, there was a time when ethnic whites, from Italians to Irish, weren't considered "white." Also note that, technically, the standard was called "blight," which was a term meant to describe, not slums, but neighborhoods likely to become slums. One of the determining factors was close proximity to nonwhite neighborhoods. So a poor Jewish or Polish community that was near a growing Black neighborhood might be considered "blighted" as it was the most likely place where the nonwhite population would expand.
The political establishment in many northern US cities was heavily "ethnic white" by the 1940s.

Fiorello H. La Guardia - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Boston [city proper, not suburbs] would be dominanted by "ethnic whites" after the first couple decades of the 20th century. It even had a mayor that gave speeches with anti-WASP speeches to increase his popular appeal.
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Old 03-10-2014, 03:42 PM
 
Location: Coos Bay, Oregon
7,142 posts, read 8,925,631 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Katiana View Post
If you read my link, there was only one streetcar stop NEAR Globeville, and none within it. Jeez, I even posted that, you didn't even have to open the link! You posted that undated link, that talks about bus service to the stockyards. IIt's not clear that changing the routes was a total inconvenience, as they maintained the bus service, just routed it a different way, apparently over an overpass. Bus service was not gone, as you assert.
I did read the article. Thank you for posting it. I have also read that article before.

Streetcars were never a big part of Globeville. Globeville was the first Denver Tramway route to get busses. Even before they officially started converting to busses. So yes the article is technically correct. At least in later years, people had to walk a ways from Globeville to get to a streetcar line, or they could ride the bus routes that served Globeville.

My point for posting that, was to show that the freeway construction did impact people's transit options. When they tear out your bus stop to construct a freeway. Then your bus gets rerouted onto the freeway. Because the street where you used to catch it, no longer exists. That doesn't help you much. It was just another message to people, to buy a car.
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