U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Urban Planning
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
 
Old 04-07-2014, 11:01 AM
 
2,824 posts, read 3,347,681 times
Reputation: 3030

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by urbanlife78 View Post
You can buy an mp3 player that has radio access, not all transit runs underground. As for hearing other people's music, unless you are sharing ear buds you don't hear other music and if you have in ear buds then you definitely don't hear other people's music.
no one was talking about an "mp3 player that has radio access". Th point was that you are inattentive to what is going on around you when you choose to stick earbuds your ears to listen to your mp3.

Quote:
Originally Posted by urbanlife78 View Post
I am fully capable of driving, though city driving gets on my nerves, I prefer to enjoy being on my bike than sitting on my butt in a car.
If you can afford living close enough to work (you seem to push downtown living and work) then you might be able to accomplish that although the other things you want (mass transit, public works, etc.) tend to drive up the cost (and drive out the residents) of living there. However, your wife may not feel the same way about commuting and unless you live close enough for your future kid to walk or ride the bus to school, your solution doesn't work for anyone but you. You may also find that other families want educational opportunities for their kids that doesn't come along with "downtown living" and find themselves moving to areas where those opportunities are better - often a much longer distance from downtown or where your employer is located.

Quote:
So tell me, what place has a high crime rate on and around transit? As for crime being preventable, that is called being aware of your surroundings. Most crime on transit is phones being stolen because people aren't paying attention. You not knowing this clearly illustrates the nature of the anti-transit crowd.
What transit center doesn't. I tend to be aware of my surroundings - I'm not the idiot with the mp3 earbuds in my ears.

Last edited by IC_deLight; 04-07-2014 at 11:23 AM..
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 04-07-2014, 11:14 AM
 
2,824 posts, read 3,347,681 times
Reputation: 3030
Quote:
Originally Posted by stateofnature View Post
So it was on-topic for you to (wrongly) say that my estimate of millions was "optimistically high" but it's off-topic for me to correct you.

It's all completely on topic. To know why people don't use mass transit it helps to know how many actually do and don't use it.
After a while you need to decide whether what you are trying to use the numbers for. Someone might be interested in the number of "rides". Others might be interested in the number of "riders". When "rides" are roundtrip - it halves the number of unique riders within a 24 hour period. If the same riders are switching platforms or making extra stops the number of "rides" artificially inflates the number of "riders".

Millions of rides does not equate to 1:1 millions of riders and until the method of computing "rides" or "riders" is elaborated upon, the numbers promoted are suspect at best and frankly irrelevant. No one has disputed the general concept that "a lot of people ride transit".

Knowing the numbers does not explain why people don't use mass transit only that an even larger number of people do not. All you wind up with is debatable numbers. On the other hand, asking someone that doesn't use mass transit why they don't use it would help you understand why people don't use it. Instead a few members of the pro-transit crowd want to engage in arguments with people explaining why people don't use mass transit.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-07-2014, 11:15 AM
 
Location: Portland, Oregon
46,053 posts, read 29,504,059 times
Reputation: 7830
Quote:
Originally Posted by IC_deLight View Post
[=urbanlife78;34257407]You can buy an mp3 player that has radio access, not all transit runs underground. As for hearing other people's music, unless you are sharing ear buds you don't hear other music and if you have in ear buds then you definitely don't hear other people's music.

no one was talking about an "mp3 player that has radio access". Th point was that you are inattentive to what is going on around you when you choose to stick earbuds your ears to listen to your mp3.


If you can afford living close enough to work (you seem to push downtown living and work) then you might be able to accomplish that although although the other things you want (mass transit, public works, etc.) tend to drive up the cost (and drive out the residents) of living there. However, your wife may not feel the same way about commuting and unless you live close enough for your kid to walk or ride the bus to school, your solution doesn't work for anyone but you.


What transit center doesn't. I tend to be aware of my surroundings - I'm not the idiot with the mp3 earbuds in my ears.
So you don't like listening to music through ear buds, that is a valid reason for you to choose car over transit.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-07-2014, 11:22 AM
 
2,941 posts, read 3,856,857 times
Reputation: 1439
Quote:
Originally Posted by urbanlife78 View Post
Why do you find going car free strange? Millions do it and enjoy not being tied to a car, having to sit in traffic, worry about maintenance, worry about getting into an accident they can't prevent or causing an accident due to bad driving. Heck I prefer living where I can use transit or bike to work over driving because driving is aggravating and stressful. Also, everyone these days has an mp3 player and listens to their own music, so that point of yours is equal with a car and transit. Also the chances of getting mugged while taking transit is extremely low and can typically be prevented.
I might find driving in traffic or driving more than about an hour to and hour and and a half aggravating. However I love riding when the traffic is light, and the sun is about to set behind me. I love the sensation of speed and you move on the expressway.

I love being able to get around town quickly by car. When I was young and before I had the ability to drive an relative of mine used transit to get across town and visit some relatives. The trip took 1:30 or so by public transit. While I am grateful the transit exists I can not figure why on God's green earth would I handicap myself to needing 1:30 to make a trip that could have been done in 40 mins or less driving. When I saw those purses snatched(and the crook got away), I was with her and it could have been her instead of some other woman who lost her purse.

People had Walkman back then, but the problem then and now is that people like to sing. Which depending on your mood you may or may not like. If you ride transit on the off hours like just before rush, you will run into a lot of rowdy teenagers(which depending on your mood, may annoy you.). As for getting mugged on transit, I would say low, you are more likely to get mugged while waiting for the bus or walking home but muggings do happen. Driving cuts some of that risk out esp. if you need to go through or live in an rough area.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-07-2014, 11:28 AM
 
Location: Portland, Oregon
46,053 posts, read 29,504,059 times
Reputation: 7830
Quote:
Originally Posted by chirack View Post
I might find driving in traffic or driving more than about an hour to and hour and and a half aggravating. However I love riding when the traffic is light, and the sun is about to set behind me. I love the sensation of speed and you move on the expressway.

However I love being able to get around town quickly by car. When I was young and before I had the ability to drive an relative of mine used transit to get across town and visit some relatives. The trip took 1:30 or so by public transit. While I am grateful the transit exists I can not figure why on God's green earth would I handicap myself to needing 1:30 to make a trip that could have been done in 40 mins or less driving. When I saw those purses snatched(and the crook got away), I was with her and it could have been her instead of some other woman who lost her purse.

People had Walkman back then, but the problem then and now is that people like to sing. Which depending on your mood you may or may not like. If you ride transit on the off hours like just before rush, you will run into a lot of rowdy teenagers(which depending on your mood, may annoy you.). As for getting mugged on transit, I would say low, you are more likely to get mugged while waiting for the bus or walking home but muggings do happen. Driving cuts some of that risk out esp. if you need to go through or live in an rough area.
Sure, when the roads are empty and the weather is nice driving is a lot of fun. That is what I miss about Oregon, I love when you get out of the city you are in the country and can really enjoy driving.

I rarely encounter people liking to sing with earbuds on, though I do hear people playing music for money in subway stations. My music in my earbuds tends to drown them out.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-07-2014, 11:31 AM
 
2,941 posts, read 3,856,857 times
Reputation: 1439
Quote:
Originally Posted by urbanlife78 View Post
Sure, when the roads are empty and the weather is nice driving is a lot of fun. That is what I miss about Oregon, I love when you get out of the city you are in the country and can really enjoy driving.

I rarely encounter people liking to sing with earbuds on, though I do hear people playing music for money in subway stations. My music in my earbuds tends to drown them out.
I am too leery to wear ear buds on the CTA and esp. not when walking home. I need my senses. I have listened to music on Metra but that is rather a different experience less riff raft and less danger on the cars(but perhaps more danger at the stations in the off hours as the stations in the city outside of downtown lack personal. )
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-07-2014, 11:34 AM
 
Location: Portland, Oregon
46,053 posts, read 29,504,059 times
Reputation: 7830
Quote:
Originally Posted by chirack View Post
I am too leery to wear ear buds on the CTA and esp. not when walking home. I need my senses. I have listened to music on Metra but that is rather a different experience less riff raft and less danger on the cars(but perhaps more danger at the stations in the off hours as the stations in the city outside of downtown lack personal. )
That might have to do with where you live than it does CTA. I have had no issues wearing my earbuds while riding transit in NYC.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-07-2014, 11:37 AM
 
2,941 posts, read 3,856,857 times
Reputation: 1439
Quote:
Originally Posted by urbanlife78 View Post
That might have to do with where you live than it does CTA. I have had no issues wearing my earbuds while riding transit in NYC.
Almost all CTA trains and many buses run through rough areas as well as nice areas. You can have problems anywhere due to that factor.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-07-2014, 11:48 AM
 
2,824 posts, read 3,347,681 times
Reputation: 3030
Quote:
Originally Posted by urbanlife78 View Post
Speaking of reading comprehension, my comment about biking in the rain was not related to the article, it was in relation to an off handed comment you made about people not biking in the rain, we Portlanders aren't afraid to bike in the rain.
To quote you, you stated:

Quote:
Originally Posted by urbanlife78 View Post
The U.S. Cities Where the Fewest Commuters Get to Work By Car - Emily Badger - The Atlantic Cities

Oh and it is Portland, we aren't scared of biking in the rain there.
It was not unreasonable (due to your grammar error, obsession with Portland, and the fact that Portland was identified in two charts in the article) to understand you to be claiming that this article was somehow relevant to Portland. Chart 1 re Portland didn't differentiate between biking, walking, or transit for commuting and thus offered nothing of value to the thread or your hypothesis. Chart 2 re Portland showed Portland as being "first" in "% of trips by bike", whatever that is supposed to mean. The trips weren't necessarily related to commuting and they weren't exclusive of other modes of transportation used in the same trip given the article's reference to "biking mode share". Chart 2 wasn't even relevant to the article it accompanied. The article didn't make your case for anything much less anything related to the topic of this thread.

Your communitarian "we" is showing through again. No one claimed the population had a fear of biking in the rain. That's different from whether people have the common sense to avoid it or to recognize that you aren't speaking for all the other commuters or the parents taking kids to and from school.

Quote:
Oh and those aren't "my facts" they are just actual facts.

And you are correct, this thread is about why people don't use transit, so please continue telling us why you don't use transit.
Your so-called "facts" in your article didn't have anything to do with "why people don't use mass transit" and didn't bear out any hypothesis you've promulgated. I've already previously pointed out the uselessness of the article you linked to for much of anything.

At best to the extent your article and post has any bearing in this thread it would be "some people don't take mass transit because they [choose: 'can' or 'have no choice but to'] bike or walk to work"
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 04-07-2014, 11:56 AM
 
2,941 posts, read 3,856,857 times
Reputation: 1439
Quote:
Originally Posted by urbanlife78 View Post
Sure, when the roads are empty and the weather is nice driving is a lot of fun. That is what I miss about Oregon, I love when you get out of the city you are in the country and can really enjoy driving.
Who said you have to be outside of an city to have fun driving. I love riding up/down Lake Shore Drive and the Dan Ryan. Roads are not always fully jammed with traffic, that only happens during rush.

Driving also shields you from rough weather conditions like extreme cold as well as rain. About the only thing the bus has over the Car in bad weather is the fact that there might not be clear on the street parking for a day or two after a snow storm or your car might get trapped in the garage by snow.

Otherwise having control of the heat is so wonderful. Buses and Trains can be either nippy or if they don't open the doors and you are wearing heavy winter clothes roasting. Never a comfortable temperature. Waiting outside with sub zero wind chills is not fun and people have a bad habit of not promptly clearing the snow from in front of their houses which makes the walking difficult(or forcing you to walk in the streets sometimes).
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:

Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Urban Planning
Follow City-Data.com founder on our Forum or

All times are GMT -6.

2005-2019, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35 - Top