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Old 05-31-2014, 01:25 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nei View Post
Also, I felt like you did a thread on SFHs and the Bay Area a while back ago already. Wasn't your OP meant to be something different?
Yes, but people here argue the intent behind talking about the topic, rather than discussing the topic itself.

There was growth for thousands of years, so I don't see any reason why and how it should stop in 2014. It is a very artificial concern, and irrational. We are not running out of land any time soon.
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Old 05-31-2014, 01:55 PM
 
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So, we have been driving automobiles and building autocentric single-family suburbs as the dominant mode of housing for thousands of years?
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Old 05-31-2014, 02:38 PM
 
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No. Cities were growing in size for thousands of years, and new cities were popping up on previously wilderness areas. Don't ask silly questions.
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Old 05-31-2014, 03:14 PM
 
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Cities, like the human population, has been growing in size for thousands of years, but never this many. A century ago, there were fewer than 2 billion people on Earth and fewer than 3 million in California. Now there are 7 billion people, 40 million in California. The Bay Area went from about 900,000, half of whom were in San Francisco, to 7.5 million, of which San Francisco represents a bit over 10%. And during that century, we went from cities that were primarily very high-density, with most people getting around on foot or by transit (horses and carriages were the exception, not the rule) to cities that required enormously more room per capita to make space for broad automotive highways and boulevards, parking spaces and parking lots, and a "social engineering" movement that insisted broad suburban lawns and widely separated uses were necessary (along with separation by class and race.) At the same time, the amount of land is relatively static, other than the aforementioned efforts to build housing on former wetlands, as we have not just 8-12 times as many people but each person needs more space per capita for their automobile and broad suburban home. Your implication is that growth is somehow static and cyclical--it's not.

As to Sacramento's suburban growth, we build on floodplains during drought years when we can get the land certified as dry enough to build on, then end up with building moratoriums when people realize that floodplains can flood. It's not a good idea.
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Old 05-31-2014, 04:14 PM
 
Location: Foot of the Rockies
87,141 posts, read 102,990,855 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wburg View Post
Cities, like the human population, has been growing in size for thousands of years, but never this many. A century ago, there were fewer than 2 billion people on Earth and fewer than 3 million in California. Now there are 7 billion people, 40 million in California. The Bay Area went from about 900,000, half of whom were in San Francisco, to 7.5 million, of which San Francisco represents a bit over 10%. And during that century, we went from cities that were primarily very high-density, with most people getting around on foot or by transit (horses and carriages were the exception, not the rule) to cities that required enormously more room per capita to make space for broad automotive highways and boulevards, parking spaces and parking lots, and a "social engineering" movement that insisted broad suburban lawns and widely separated uses were necessary (along with separation by class and race.) At the same time, the amount of land is relatively static, other than the aforementioned efforts to build housing on former wetlands, as we have not just 8-12 times as many people but each person needs more space per capita for their automobile and broad suburban home. Your implication is that growth is somehow static and cyclical--it's not.

As to Sacramento's suburban growth, we build on floodplains during drought years when we can get the land certified as dry enough to build on, then end up with building moratoriums when people realize that floodplains can flood. It's not a good idea.
They probably got their idea from the Netherlands, where they've been building below sea level for a few centuries.

Netherlands - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
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Old 05-31-2014, 10:17 PM
 
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One thing to keep in mind about these regional planning agencies: they have no executive authority. They can't force cities or real estate developers to build anything, or prevent them from building anything. Their job is basically to make plans, with the idea that the plans can be a roadmap for smart development that avoids patterns of development that we already know are wasteful of resources and hazardous to the environment, which means they are hazardous to human beings in the long run.

But in terms of authority? No, they aren't going to ban construction of single-family homes, because they can't.

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