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In my home town (pop, excluding surrounding countryside, about 15,000) scooters have become a popular option, One of the local "Mr. Fixits" scratch-builds them from golf carts and the like, and the back porch is sometimes modified with a ramp to the driveway. Not likely to work in a concentrated urban area, but not as likely to be needed there either.
^^Pittsburgh is one of the whitest cities in the country.
Quote:
Originally Posted by nei
Yes, I know.
Where on earth did you two get that idea? Certainly not from the 2013 U.S. Census. Pittsburgh is less white than the nation as a whole and less white than Pennsylvania as a state (81.9%)
Percent of whites in the U.S. population: 77% In Pittsburgh: 66%
Percent of people identifying as black or African-American in the US: 13.2% In Pittsburgh: 26.1%
Percent of Asians in the U.S.: 5.3% In Pittsburgh: 4.4%.
Percent of Latinos/Hispanics in the U.S.: 17% In Pittsburgh: 3%
Percent of people identifying as bi-racial in the U.S.: 2.4% In Pittsburgh: 2.5%
So other than Pittsburgh needing to import some Latinos to measure up, the city is more diversified than the nation as a whole. How can you say that a city that is more than one-quarter black is "one of the whitest cities in the country"? I lived in the 'burgh for many decades and while I never saw it as a model of racial harmony, I certainly don't think it lacks diversity compared to many other places.
Also, what does whiteness have to do with boomers getting too old to drive?
Let's accept that there are going to be no certainties here. So no, I don't know anything for a "fact". I just know that eventually it will be too much house for them. And I believe (note the difference) that the longer they wait, the more they risk getting hosed on the sale price.
Since my parents are far from senile, we are blessed with a fairly even-handed relationship. I hope they do care about where I live, and I hope they want me to care about where they live too. If they have reason to believe that I should re-consider my choice of housing, I hope they tell me. And I hope they listen if I tell them.
The reason I believe they should listen to me on this subject is that I'm talking to them about my generation (as well as the one that's just a couple years behind me. I'm at the tail end of Gen X.) My parents, as well as many baby boomers, seem to be a little under-informed about the value differences between their generation and ours, or else they assume that, if there's something we do that doesn't make sense to them, we'll just "grow out of it."
My relationship with my parents is one marked by respect. This is a fact that I would not expect strangers on a forum to be aware of, which is why I'm telling you now. This means that I will share with them what I know, and what I believe, and then respect them enough to make that decision without any further pestering from me.
I suggest you take a little trip to the Caregiving forum to see the REALITY of how it's going to turn out.
Not only are people driving way into their 80s, they're doing it with dementia and while living in Assisted Living REGARDLESS of what their special snowflake children think. And they ABSOLUTELY will CONTINUE to do whatever they want regardless of all of your ~input in most cases. Including setting the house on fire and running down the street naked banging on neighbor's doors, accusing you of trying to kill them. Which one may think proves your point but NO - what it proves is that INDIVIDUALITY and the INDOMITABLE SPIRIT of generations before yours are alive and strong.
Of course, nobody before your generation ever got a trophy for just showing up to soccer at age 8 forward.
The fact that you say Boomers seem to be "under-informed" about the subsequent generation just shows that you really are living in a bubble and have no grasp of history or people.
This claim has been asserted since time began. "my kids' generations think they know it all."
If you REALLY WANT TO HELP your parents, you will stop the condescending lectures and convince them to purchase LTC insurance policies that will pay the very expensive monthly fees for Assisted Living or Memory Care facility in the future. I work in an ALF and the MOST ACTIVE resident there is 100 years old. She NEVER stops doing "something" all day long until after dinner. And there are cars with drivers in the good facilities to take you anywhere. OR you pay an aid.
Or pay the policies yourself. It's worth every penny when your pipe dream of RESPECTFUL PARENTS crumbles in 20 years and everything you THOUGHT is proven wrong. And of course, because they live nowhere near each other, or the CHILDREN of these people are "busy" with their own lives. Or making unrealistic demands that the parents are not interested in. Like SELLING THEIR ASSETS and building ADDITIONS onto their childrens' homes. Clever. /not.
It's all about money and planning and has nothing to do with cars versus THE BUS, FFS.
Last edited by runswithscissors; 08-01-2014 at 06:19 AM..
I suggest you take a little trip to the Caregiving forum to see the REALITY of how it's going to turn out.
Not only are people driving way into their 80s, they're doing it with dementia and while living in Assisted Living REGARDLESS of what their special snowflake children think. And they ABSOLUTELY will CONTINUE to do whatever they want regardless of all of your ~input in most cases. Including setting the house on fire and running down the street naked banging on neighbor's doors, accusing you of trying to kill them. Which one may think proves your point but NO - what it proves is that INDIVIDUALITY and the INDOMITABLE SPIRIT of generations before yours are alive and strong.
Of course, nobody before your generation ever got a trophy for just showing up to soccer at age 8 forward.
The fact that you say Boomers seem to be "under-informed" about the subsequent generation just shows that you really are living in a bubble and have no grasp of history or people.
This claim has been asserted since time began. "my kids' generations think they know it all."
If you REALLY WANT TO HELP your parents, you will stop the condescending lectures and convince them to purchase LTC insurance policies that will pay the very expensive monthly fees for Assisted Living or Memory Care facility in the future. I work in an ALF and the MOST ACTIVE resident there is 100 years old. She NEVER stops doing "something" all day long until after dinner. And there are cars with drivers in the good facilities to take you anywhere. OR you pay an aid.
Or pay the policies yourself. It's worth every penny when your pipe dream of RESPECTFUL PARENTS crumbles in 20 years and everything you THOUGHT is proven wrong. And of course, because they live nowhere near each other, or the CHILDREN of these people are "busy" with their own lives. Or making unrealistic demands that the parents are not interested in. Like SELLING THEIR ASSETS and building ADDITIONS onto their childrens' homes. Clever. /not.
It's all about money and planning and has nothing to do with cars versus THE BUS, FFS.
I hope your not suggesting that people with dementia should be driving, and the fact that some people will lose their mind the way you describe is sad, and has nothing to do with "individuality and imdomitable spirit". I know working in a care facility has colored your view of all this, and it has colored your view of the children of these patients. I watched my parents and inlaws care for their ailing parents and they did it with compassion and common sense. I realize some do not, but no matter what those providing the care sometimes have to do things that the older person will not like. Sometimes the car must be taken away, and independence curbed for the good of the senior and those who would share the road with them. That being said some people keep their ability to drive well into the 80s and even 90s. Some however should not be driving at 78. Some of us just get better genes then others.
Last week a 92 year old lady went northbound on the southbound lanes of the interstate near here and caused a head on collision that took her life and the life of the other driver. I knew her and was surprised that she made that mistake. She drove that route at least once a week and did not seem to have problems. How do you know when someone should not be driving?
Where on earth did you two get that idea? Certainly not from the 2013 U.S. Census. Pittsburgh is less white than the nation as a whole and less white than Pennsylvania as a state (81.9%)
Percent of whites in the U.S. population: 77% In Pittsburgh: 66%
Percent of people identifying as black or African-American in the US: 13.2% In Pittsburgh: 26.1%
Percent of Asians in the U.S.: 5.3% In Pittsburgh: 4.4%.
Percent of Latinos/Hispanics in the U.S.: 17% In Pittsburgh: 3%
Percent of people identifying as bi-racial in the U.S.: 2.4% In Pittsburgh: 2.5%
So other than Pittsburgh needing to import some Latinos to measure up, the city is more diversified than the nation as a whole. How can you say that a city that is more than one-quarter black is "one of the whitest cities in the country"? I lived in the 'burgh for many decades and while I never saw it as a model of racial harmony, I certainly don't think it lacks diversity compared to many other places.
Also, what does whiteness have to do with boomers getting too old to drive?
I can say that because it is true. It doesn't matter than Pittsburgh has more minorities than the general US population, or the Pennsylvania population. It still has more whites that almost any US city, and its suburbs are 91% white.
Last week a 92 year old lady went northbound on the southbound lanes of the interstate near here and caused a head on collision that took her life and the life of the other driver. I knew her and was surprised that she made that mistake. She drove that route at least once a week and did not seem to have problems. How do you know when someone should not be driving?
It may well be that age, nor dementia had anything to do with that accident, since she drove that road frequently. Brain fart, maybe?
I don't know the difference in size between the Millennials' and Boomers' generation, but I really think that is the only solid consideration in this whole conversation re: precipitously falling values of larger Boomer homes. Perhaps the argument that the current generation of young workers is having a harder time getting established will be relevant as well, time will tell.
As for "the younger generation prefers a more urban lifestyle", "Millennial's don't share the 'ownership' value" etc. etc.--these are pretty broad assumptions being viewed through some apparently hipster glasses. I don't think we can make predictions on the long-term real estate market based on current trends (and I do mean trendy trends) and style preferences of what would be in my experience the minority of people that age in any case.
...
Who knows what people will want, what it will cost to heat a house, what family sizes will look like in 20 years? No one. Just like no one predicted that not ALL retiring Boomers would want to downsize into a 2 bedroom one bath condo. Just like no one predicted that a housing boom predicated on buyers borrowing money with no ability to pay it back would end up...oh, wait, some of us did predict that one...lol
All this predictifying is a little silly. (Of course, I hope it's true, and I'll buy me a big 'ole house to grow old in for cheap.)
It's interesting to discuss, and I'll be interested to watch it play out, but that's about it. No one knows.
As for driving (the, uh, topic at hand) I do think the Boomer demand will do us all a big favor (oh, finally!) in speeding along the development of self-driving cars. So there's one thing my generation will thank them for.
Two things:
1. You call the re-urbanization of Millenials a "trendy trend" but let's not forget that SUBurbanization is a trend itself, and one that is much less rooted in history. Who knows, it may yet prove itself, but in the scheme of things, it's still just a trend. Which brings me to...
2. You're correct that no one knows what people will want. The trick of it, though, is this: Millions of people have sunk hundreds of thousands of dollars each into their particular "predictifications" on that subject. And many of them don't even realize what grand assumptions they're required to make in order to consider these investments worth making. I'd say there's literally a trillion dollars riding on the prediction that Millenials will value large suburban homes as much as Boomers do, and, additionally, that they'll be able to actually afford them.
Even if they don't reject these houses entirely, but just aren't as crazy about them as their grandparents, we're talking about an economic setback to the tune of hundreds-of-billions of dollars.
So yes, nobody really knows. But no realtor ever mentioned that fact on closing day.
Oh, for Ford's Sake! Can the armchair psychology, Dr. Sigmund Fraud. rwiksell's parents do not have dementia. They are in their 60s! They're probably still working. Surely you have co-workers in their 60s who you consider your colleagues. Adult kids regularly tell their parents to "MYOB", and we parents have learned to NEVER offer advice. These people have managed their affairs successfully for 40+years. Why do they need some whippersnapper telling them to sell their house b/c the whippersnapper, not the parents, thinks it's too big? The whipper also thinks there's going to be a housing crash. Well, maybe there will be and maybe there won't be. The parents are still likely to get way more back than they paid for the house.
If MY PARENTS told me to mind my own business, I would. But they haven't. It's ironic that I'm hearing it, instead, from people who know neither them, nor me.
Just in case it interests you, my parents bought their current house in 2003, not 1983 or 1993. Whatever makes you think that they are "likely to get way more back than they paid for [it], with NO facts at your disposal, is beyond me.
If you want to disagree with my principles on their own merit, that's fine. But nobody is getting anywhere by making a lot of assumptions about my parents.
If MY PARENTS told me to mind my own business, I would. But they haven't. It's ironic that I'm hearing it, instead, from people who know neither them, nor me.
Just in case it interests you, my parents bought their current house in 2003, not 1983 or 1993. Whatever makes you think that they are "likely to get way more back than they paid for [it], with NO facts at your disposal, is beyond me.
If you want to disagree with my principles on their own merit, that's fine. But nobody is getting anywhere by making a lot of assumptions about my parents.
2003 is still 11 years ago. A good prinicple of real estate is that if you hang on to it long enough, you'll at least get back what you paid for it.
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