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Old 08-10-2014, 09:40 AM
 
2,824 posts, read 3,349,202 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stateofnature View Post
I never said anyone said that. It's just the implication from the statement that "one can always find some rube willing to buy a condo/apartment" (paraphrasing). If buying a condo or apartment makes someone a rube, then where else is someone who doesn't want to have a yard to maintain supposed to buy?
"Apartments" are typically rented in which case you aren't paying for a lawn to maintain.
However, apartments also typically have some type of lawn or grounds - you end up paying for the maintenance in your rent.

"Condos" may or may not have lawn around them in the "common areas". Worse than the scenario you suggested, your "assessments" are entangled with care for these areas. You pay the assessment but have no control on what it is actually spent on. You are not allowed to take care of the area itself. You have no control over the amount of money that is spent. You are an involuntary member of an organization that can foreclose upon you if you do not give it (or its vendors) the money demanded. You haven't escaped "lawn care". You relinquished all say in how it would be done, when it would be done, who will tend to it, and how much it will cost and you must pay whatever is demanded when demanded under threat of foreclosure regardless of whether the recipient performs as represented or expected.
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Old 08-10-2014, 09:57 AM
 
1,998 posts, read 2,932,190 times
Reputation: 2150
Quote:
Originally Posted by IC_deLight View Post
"Apartments" are typically rented in which case you aren't paying for a lawn to maintain.
However, apartments also typically have some type of lawn or grounds - you end up paying for the maintenance in your rent.

"Condos" may or may not have lawn around them in the "common areas". Worse than the scenario you suggested, your "assessments" are entangled with care for these areas. You pay the assessment but have no control on what it is actually spent on. You are not allowed to take care of the area itself. You have no control over the amount of money that is spent. You are an involuntary member of an organization that can foreclose upon you if you do not give it (or its vendors) the money demanded. You haven't escaped "lawn care". You relinquished all say in how it would be done, when it would be done, who will tend to it, and how much it will cost and you must pay whatever is demanded when demanded under threat of foreclosure regardless of whether the recipient performs as represented or expected.
Ok, yes thank you, I understand how owning a condo works. Of course if you own in a building you don't have control over the building itself. Some people gladly will take the restrictions you discuss because they enjoy apartment-style living, one benefit being that they don't have to physically go out and maintain a lawn. It's ok if you don't like it. You would just come across as less of a snob if you didn't call anyway who doesn't share your preferences a "rube."
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Old 08-10-2014, 03:55 PM
 
2,824 posts, read 3,349,202 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stateofnature View Post
Ok, yes thank you, I understand how owning a condo works. Of course if you own in a building you don't have control over the building itself. Some people gladly will take the restrictions you discuss because they enjoy apartment-style living, one benefit being that they don't have to physically go out and maintain a lawn. It's ok if you don't like it. You would just come across as less of a snob if you didn't call anyway who doesn't share your preferences a "rube."
The rube comment was directed at purchasing condos and had nothing to do with preferences for lawn or lawn care. You've got more rights as a tenant in an apartment than you do as an owner of a condominium.

You have tried to associate the "rube" comment with not wanting to personally do lawn care. You can achieve the latter in many ways other than purchasing a condo. The comment was not directed at "preferences for lawn care".
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Old 08-10-2014, 05:08 PM
 
Location: Vallejo
14,061 posts, read 16,074,613 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IC_deLight View Post
"Apartments" are typically rented in which case you aren't paying for a lawn to maintain.
However, apartments also typically have some type of lawn or grounds - you end up paying for the maintenance in your rent.

"Condos" may or may not have lawn around them in the "common areas". Worse than the scenario you suggested, your "assessments" are entangled with care for these areas. You pay the assessment but have no control on what it is actually spent on. You are not allowed to take care of the area itself. You have no control over the amount of money that is spent. You are an involuntary member of an organization that can foreclose upon you if you do not give it (or its vendors) the money demanded. You haven't escaped "lawn care". You relinquished all say in how it would be done, when it would be done, who will tend to it, and how much it will cost and you must pay whatever is demanded when demanded under threat of foreclosure regardless of whether the recipient performs as represented or expected.
Uh, no. By buying the condo you are, in fact, a voluntary member. No one forces you to buy a condo.
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Old 08-10-2014, 05:45 PM
 
1,998 posts, read 2,932,190 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IC_deLight View Post
The rube comment was directed at purchasing condos and had nothing to do with preferences for lawn or lawn care. You've got more rights as a tenant in an apartment than you do as an owner of a condominium.

You have tried to associate the "rube" comment with not wanting to personally do lawn care. You can achieve the latter in many ways other than purchasing a condo. The comment was not directed at "preferences for lawn care".
Yes I am well aware that you meant that buying condos is for rubes. The lawn care reference was just one example of why someone might prefer a condo to a SFH. Of course nobody makes a housing decision based on one factor. There are many others. Some people don't want to rent, they want to own, but they don't want or need a SFH. They prefer more compact living. They want to live in a neighborhood where it is easier to walk to things, and often that means neighborhoods with less SFHs and more apartment buildings.
I understand that you find all of those factors wholly unappealing, but other people have different preferences than you.

Yes owning a condo comes with costs like having less control over your building than you would if you owned your own house, but for some people the benefits outweigh the costs. I know people who have done this and run into problems with other units in the building and with the management, yet they still don't regret their decision to buy because for them, the positives outweigh the negatives. I am sure there are many people who DO end up regretting the decision to buy a condo as well.

So it seems like an indefensible blanket statement to me to imply that anyone who buys a condo is making some idiotic mistake (ie, is a rube) when for plenty of people it works out. What might be a terrible mistake for one person could be a great move for another because different people want different things in life.

And before you give your rote "most people have no interest in hamster-style living" response let me note that I am not suggesting that a majority, or even close to a majority, of people think this way.
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Old 08-11-2014, 08:14 AM
 
2,824 posts, read 3,349,202 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Malloric View Post
Uh, no. By buying the condo you are, in fact, a voluntary member. No one forces you to buy a condo.
You are an involuntary member. The documents use euphemisms like "mandatory membership". In many areas of the country the housing issue is "which organization must you become an involuntary member of for housing".
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Old 08-11-2014, 08:28 AM
 
2,824 posts, read 3,349,202 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stateofnature View Post
Yes I am well aware that you meant that buying condos is for rubes. The lawn care reference was just one example of why someone might prefer a condo to a SFH. Of course nobody makes a housing decision based on one factor. There are many others. Some people don't want to rent, they want to own, but they don't want or need a SFH. They prefer more compact living. They want to live in a neighborhood where it is easier to walk to things, and often that means neighborhoods with less SFHs and more apartment buildings.
"Ownership" in condominium-land is a purely statutory creature - and the law is generally not favorable to the owners but rather to the vendors.

Quote:
Originally Posted by stateofnature View Post
I understand that you find all of those factors wholly unappealing, but other people have different preferences than you.
I doubt anyone enjoys being abused, having to get permission from others, restrictions in use and enjoyment of their property imposed by other persons, third parties that can borrow money using your housing as security for their spending habits, and "special assessments" that can be quite large and for which the owner receives minimal or no benefit after paying.

Quote:
Originally Posted by stateofnature View Post
Yes owning a condo comes with costs like having less control over your building than you would if you owned your own house, but for some people the benefits outweigh the costs. I know people who have done this and run into problems with other units in the building and with the management, yet they still don't regret their decision to buy because for them, the positives outweigh the negatives. I am sure there are many people who DO end up regretting the decision to buy a condo as well.
You should go into real estate sales.

Quote:
Originally Posted by stateofnature View Post
So it seems like an indefensible blanket statement to me to imply that anyone who buys a condo is making some idiotic mistake (ie, is a rube) when for plenty of people it works out. What might be a terrible mistake for one person could be a great move for another because different people want different things in life.
I'm sure plenty of folks had no idea what they were getting themselves into when they purchased a condo. There's a sucker born every minute, right?

Quote:
Originally Posted by stateofnature View Post
And before you give your rote "most people have no interest in hamster-style living" response let me note that I am not suggesting that a majority, or even close to a majority, of people think this way.
The comment wasn't about hamster-style living, it was about the ease with which condos could be marketed to some prospective purchasers (rubes).
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Old 08-11-2014, 08:41 AM
 
1,998 posts, read 2,932,190 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IC_deLight View Post
"Ownership" in condominium-land is a purely statutory creature - and the law is generally not favorable to the owners but rather to the vendors.



I doubt anyone enjoys being abused, having to get permission from others, restrictions in use and enjoyment of their property imposed by other persons, third parties that can borrow money using your housing as security for their spending habits, and "special assessments" that can be quite large and for which the owner receives minimal or no benefit after paying.




I'm sure plenty of folks had no idea what they were getting themselves into when they purchased a condo. There's a sucker born every minute, right?



The comment wasn't about hamster-style living, it was about the ease with which condos could be marketed to some prospective purchasers (rubes).
What you call "abuse" is your opinion and subjective interpretation. Again, for other people with different preferences than you, the positives can outweigh the negatives. It's nonsense to deny that these people exist, even if they are a minority.
And as I already said, I am sure many people do end up regretting buying a condo. But others don't regret it. "Plenty of folks" have no idea what they are getting themselves into, but plenty of other folks do.
The idea that buying a condo is always a mistake is an indefensible blanket statement, and that's proven by the fact that you do such a poor job of defending it. I point out that I know people for whom condo ownership has worked for them--the exception that disproves your rule--and you have no response other than a joke about how I should work in sales.
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Old 08-11-2014, 09:34 AM
 
2,824 posts, read 3,349,202 times
Reputation: 3030
Quote:
Originally Posted by stateofnature View Post
What you call "abuse" is your opinion and subjective interpretation. Again, for other people with different preferences than you, the positives can outweigh the negatives. It's nonsense to deny that these people exist, even if they are a minority.
And as I already said, I am sure many people do end up regretting buying a condo. But others don't regret it. "Plenty of folks" have no idea what they are getting themselves into, but plenty of other folks do.
The idea that buying a condo is always a mistake is an indefensible blanket statement, and that's proven by the fact that you do such a poor job of defending it. I point out that I know people for whom condo ownership has worked for them--the exception that disproves your rule--and you have no response other than a joke about how I should work in sales.
Good luck with your condo.
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Old 08-11-2014, 11:28 AM
 
Location: Vancouver
12,685 posts, read 8,747,108 times
Reputation: 7293
Quote:
Originally Posted by stateofnature View Post
What you call "abuse" is your opinion and subjective interpretation. Again, for other people with different preferences than you, the positives can outweigh the negatives. It's nonsense to deny that these people exist, even if they are a minority.
And as I already said, I am sure many people do end up regretting buying a condo. But others don't regret it. "Plenty of folks" have no idea what they are getting themselves into, but plenty of other folks do.
The idea that buying a condo is always a mistake is an indefensible blanket statement, and that's proven by the fact that you do such a poor job of defending it. I point out that I know people for whom condo ownership has worked for them--the exception that disproves your rule--and you have no response other than a joke about how I should work in sales.
I bought a condo in 1995. I have been mortgage free for 7 years. The tax and condo fees I pay are a pittance compared to what my place would cost if I were to rent.
Very rough figures but aprox $16,800 in condo fees for 7 years.
$ 5,000 in taxes ( aprox 700 per year )

total $ 21, 800

If I rented for seven years cost would be aprox between $140,000 to $160,000. If I had rented since 1995…well I've would of paid even more into thin air.

Even taking into the cost of my mortgage over they years I paid it, compared to the increase in my property's worth, I still come out ahead.

So, for me. it was worth it, especially since my tax, condo and living expenses are halved with my partner.

I agree it may not work for everyone. It really depends on mortgage, market etc, etc. However as one poster is implying that it's a bad choice for all is simply wrong.
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