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Outside 9 12.68%
Center 62 87.32%
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Old 08-22-2014, 05:50 AM
nei nei won $500 in our forum's Most Engaging Poster Contest - Thirteenth Edition (Jan-Feb 2015). 

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Location: Long Island / NYC
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eddyline View Post
I'm sure there was some bad planning by the train people, but it was largely due to the fact you could neither walk or bike to this years Super Bowl.
How would walking help? How many of the attendees at any stadium location could be in walking distance even in the busiest most lived downtown? A few % at most. Cycling would be a little better, but a lot don't choose to bicycle.
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Old 08-22-2014, 06:17 AM
 
Location: Englewood, Near Eastside Indy
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Katiana View Post
"Most fans do not spend additional money as a result of a new stadium; they re-direct money they would have spent elsewhere on movies, dining, bowling, tarot-card reading, or other businesses....And for every out-of-state fan who comes into the city on game day and buys a bucket of Bud Light Platinum, another non-fan decides not to visit and purchases his latte at the coffee shop next door."

Could that not be said about any land use? If you have a ballet studio, the patrons are just redirecting money they would have spent on, oh, I don't know, going to the ballet somewhere else! And for every out of state ballet patron who comes into the city on performance day and buys a case of champagne, a kilo of dope, and some cocaine, another non-patron decides not to visit and purchases her latte at the coffee shop next door.

And of course, it makes fun of sports fans in general.
The difference is, a ballet studio uses a lot less land than a football stadium. If you are looking at this from an economic standpoint, you have to factor in the opportunity costs of taking up the land with a football stadium.

To this point, no one has given an example of a football stadium integrated into a downtown. The most brought up example continues to be Denver and New Orleans. Those are not good examples.

EDIT: I see this has been brought up, and refuted using nothing resembling logic. Carry on folks. Nothing to see here.
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Old 08-22-2014, 06:17 AM
 
Location: Fishers, IN
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nei View Post
How would walking help? How many of the attendees at any stadium location could be in walking distance even in the busiest most lived downtown? A few % at most. Cycling would be a little better, but a lot don't choose to bicycle.
Most people going to a Super Bowl wouldn't be locals. They'd be people from out-of-town likely staying at hotels. In Indianapolis and I imagine New Orleans, you can easily walk from many hotels to the football stadium. Note this is specific to the Super Bowl, which is what was talked about in your quoted post. I agree that normally there isn't going to be a lot of people walking or biking to a stadium.
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Old 08-22-2014, 06:26 AM
nei nei won $500 in our forum's Most Engaging Poster Contest - Thirteenth Edition (Jan-Feb 2015). 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by ischyros View Post
Most people going to a Super Bowl wouldn't be locals. They'd be people from out-of-town likely staying at hotels. In Indianapolis and I imagine New Orleans, you can easily walk from many hotels to the football stadium. Note this is specific to the Super Bowl, which is what was talked about in your quoted post. I agree that normally there isn't going to be a lot of people walking or biking to a stadium.
Oh, that makes more sense.
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Old 08-22-2014, 08:11 AM
 
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Originally Posted by gwillyfromphilly View Post
I don't see how Philly would be able to fit all of its teams in the downtown area. I actually like having the sports complex in South Philly. It would be nice if the Philadelphia Union(MLS) could relocate there in the near future.
If we could go back to the John Street era (what a clown) I would have put Citizen's Bank Park somewhere along the regional rail trunk line near Center City but not necessarily in it.

I would've put the Flyers/Sixers in North Philly either near Fern Rock or at North Broad/North Philly station.

The Eagles and Union schedules are better suited for South Philly.

If we could have a complete do-over I'd put the convention center at Pattison along with a couple of hotels and put the baseball stadium where the convention center is.
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Old 08-22-2014, 08:23 AM
 
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Originally Posted by nei View Post
I wasn't following too carefully, but I think that was from poor planning on NJTransit's part. The rail agency assumed fewer would use the trains. It was also on a single-track rail line not capable of that high frequencies, though it still could have better.
The rail line to the Meadowlands is double-tracked. The problem was, as you said, their flawed assumption on numbers and then, even when they saw the crush of people going in they didn't mobilize more equipment to get those people home.

The other major issue was that, even though most people were staying in Manhattan, NJT was only shuttling people between the stadium and Secaucus when they should have been running a train to Secaucus and Hoboken on alternating 10 minute headways. Secaucus couldn't handle the entire stadium and the trains they had scheduled from Secaucus into Penn Station could barely handle it. Hoboken Station, while smaller than Secaucus would've offered fans much more frequent connections into Manhattan via the PATH trains and ferries.
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Old 08-22-2014, 08:39 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nei View Post
How would walking help? How many of the attendees at any stadium location could be in walking distance even in the busiest most lived downtown? A few % at most. Cycling would be a little better, but a lot don't choose to bicycle.

For many big events, many property owners within a mile or two will offer parking on their property for the big game. This puts many more people within walking distance of the stadium.

As I recall, the on site parking for the Super Bowl was both very limited and very expensive, which opens up the opportunity for near by property owners to offer "walking distance" parking. Happens at most big events and venues that I am familiar with.
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Old 08-22-2014, 08:45 AM
nei nei won $500 in our forum's Most Engaging Poster Contest - Thirteenth Edition (Jan-Feb 2015). 

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Those drivers would still create a big traffic jam. For downtown locations, there's usually few business with their own surface parking to offer. There are plenty of garages whose main business is selling parking to daytripers, especially commuting workers. They'll have extra room in the evening and weekends so can accommodate some of the parking demand.
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Old 08-22-2014, 08:46 AM
nei nei won $500 in our forum's Most Engaging Poster Contest - Thirteenth Edition (Jan-Feb 2015). 

Over $104,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum and additional contests are planned
 
Location: Long Island / NYC
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The Meadowlands sports complex is rather isolated, highways and industrial land separate it from the nearby communities:

https://www.google.com/maps/@40.8166.../data=!3m1!1e3

And marshland is in the surroundings.
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Old 08-22-2014, 08:54 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nei View Post
Those drivers would still create a big traffic jam. For downtown locations, there's usually few business with their own surface parking to offer. There are plenty of garages whose main business is selling parking to daytripers, especially commuting workers. They'll have extra room in the evening and weekends so can accommodate some of the parking demand.

Well we were discussing the Super Bowl at Giants Stadium, so I'm not sure what downtown has to do with it. But for every Bronco game (just as an example) the biggest traffic jams are entering and exiting the on site parking lots. So almost every property owner within a mile or so offers parking for say $20 vs $40 on site. Instead of every car going to the same location, the traffic is spread out and many (most?) people walk the last mile or so. If there is good bike access (which there is at the Broncos stadium) I could park in a unused parking lot (or street parking) five miles away and cruise in and out.
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