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Old 01-19-2015, 11:07 AM
nei nei won $500 in our forum's Most Engaging Poster Contest - Thirteenth Edition (Jan-Feb 2015). 

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Location: Long Island / NYC
45,988 posts, read 41,967,271 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Malloric View Post
Tired argument.

The fact is just about everywhere public transit is slower than driving. Car and Advertiser did a humorous article comparing driving, transit, and foot in NYC. Even there, driving was faster for their particular route. Damn Manhattan and its lacking transit.

Google Maps Comparo: Public Transit vs. Driving vs. Walking Across NYC: Final Scoring
They picked a starting point that's unusually far from a subway station for most places near Manhattan. I'm also unsure how he managed to take 45 minutes longer than google maps time, perhaps he got unlucky and the train was delayed, if it hadn't transit would have been the fastest. Of course, they could have done a radial trip where transit would have been clearly worse than driving. In any case, there's a big difference in convenience between transit taking 20-30% slower and it taking 2-3X longer than driving. The first is tolerable to many the other only tolerable if it's an occasional trip.
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Old 01-19-2015, 12:03 PM
 
Location: Portland, Oregon
46,053 posts, read 29,523,816 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nei View Post
Likely based on his description of the area, adding that "needed" transit would result in lots of buses that run mostly empty.



Not sure what you're trying to say here, not following your connection. If you're trying to say a lack of transit is likely to result in gridlock, that doesn't really connect. Look a the OP's numbers (which the conversation left): transit share is 5% nationwide. 5% not driving isn't going to make much difference in gridlock. Obviously for some routes and places, it does make a difference.
All I am doing is speaking in a general sense because I do not know this area he lives in, so I cannot say what would be the best way for them to improve transit and provide commuters with more options than just driving.

If people are sitting in traffic and see those empty buses pass them that started near where they live and going to where they work, they might start thinking about how transit is a better option. I am sure people stuck in traffic on Hwy26 in Portland think that as well when they watch a packed light rail train fly past their slow moving car on the way to work.

The reason why transit ridership is so low in this country is a combination of two things, we have inadequate transit systems in most of our cities, and we are a very rural country still so there will still be a large percentage of people living where transit wouldn't make sense anyway because it wouldn't service enough people to justify it.
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Old 01-19-2015, 12:30 PM
 
2,388 posts, read 2,955,202 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Malloric View Post
Tired argument.

The fact is just about everywhere public transit is slower than driving. Car and Advertiser did a humorous article comparing driving, transit, and foot in NYC. Even there, driving was faster for their particular route. Damn Manhattan and its lacking transit.

Google Maps Comparo: Public Transit vs. Driving vs. Walking Across NYC: Final Scoring
That's just not cherry picking a route but also ignoring the fact that you still have to park after you arrive - which can easily eat up anywhere from 5-20 minutes of your time depending on the proximity and ease of parking.


I've been a driver or passenger in a car on the occasional car trip to or taxi ride in Manhattan for about 35 years (that I can remember). Driving there is far easier these days than it was 20 years ago and that mostly because so many more people are using transit and/or bikeshare.
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Old 01-19-2015, 12:37 PM
Status: "Summer!" (set 19 days ago)
 
Location: Foot of the Rockies
87,003 posts, read 102,592,596 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nei View Post
The negatives of buses are they're often slow and unreliable, often much slower than driving. Maybe they're "good enough", but they're often much worse in quality than rail. Sometimes not.
From yesterday's Denver Post:
Meyer: Is RTD pulling a fast one on U.S. 36? - The Denver Post
My allowable 3 sentences,plus one:
"You guys are so cute, thinking you'd have a rail line from Longmont to Denver for your adorable commutes.
Well, we know how that went tax revenues were lower than expected and the costs for the Northwest line skyrocketed.....We have looked at our financial picture as far out as 2040 and don't see the funding ever coming through.
"
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Old 01-19-2015, 12:47 PM
nei nei won $500 in our forum's Most Engaging Poster Contest - Thirteenth Edition (Jan-Feb 2015). 

Over $104,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum and additional contests are planned
 
Location: Long Island / NYC
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Yes, I remember mentioning that particular rail line has funding issues. The post you quoted of mine wasn't meant to be specific to anywhere, though. If the Boulder - Denver is fast and not prone to traffic congestion, maybe the fact rail isn't being built there isn't that big a deal.
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Old 01-19-2015, 12:54 PM
 
1,915 posts, read 2,049,638 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hurricaneMan1992 View Post
The single, childless, and gay...guess what, they're still tax-paying Americans! Ditto for students and the poor and the physically challenged.

If you have children, it's probably for 20-30 years of your 70-80+ year life expectancy, so ...

Please let's stop extrapolating the transportation needs and logistics of healthy, well-to-do suburban families to the rest of America!!!
Sorry, we are the ones raising the future workers who will be paying your pension. And there are still a lot more of us than you.

If anyone is doing the extrapolating, it is you "New Urbanists" who want to herd our nuclear families into communes.
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Old 01-19-2015, 12:54 PM
 
Location: Portland, Oregon
46,053 posts, read 29,523,816 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drive carephilly View Post
That's just not cherry picking a route but also ignoring the fact that you still have to park after you arrive - which can easily eat up anywhere from 5-20 minutes of your time depending on the proximity and ease of parking.


I've been a driver or passenger in a car on the occasional car trip to or taxi ride in Manhattan for about 35 years (that I can remember). Driving there is far easier these days than it was 20 years ago and that mostly because so many more people are using transit and/or bikeshare.
A couple things I am noticing about the transit portion of that article. The man waited for a bus rather than walk half a mile. That is just lazy to wait for a bus if you are capable of walking. Most New Yorkers have no problem walking a half a mile or more to get to the subway. In this case, that walk would have taken him about 7-10 minutes.

I love the part where he complains about the smell...newsflash, all of New York City has a smell, it is an old dirty big city. Some times it smells like old gym socks and pee.

Also another thing that is very questionable that he doesn't address is did he take a local or an express train. Any New Yorker knows you take an express train for any long commutes unless you like riding a train for a long time. I have a feeling a local train helped pad his numbers on how long it took him.

Actually looking at his route, it should have taken him just under an hour to do. It taking him almost 2 hours to make that commute is a bold faced lie. And he could have saved himself $2.50, by just walking to the nearest subway station rather than wait for a bus.
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Old 01-19-2015, 12:57 PM
Status: "Summer!" (set 19 days ago)
 
Location: Foot of the Rockies
87,003 posts, read 102,592,596 times
Reputation: 33059
Quote:
Originally Posted by nei View Post
Yes, I remember mentioning that particular rail line has funding issues. The post you quoted of mine wasn't meant to be specific to anywhere, though. If the Boulder - Denver is fast and not prone to traffic congestion, maybe the fact rail isn't being built there isn't that big a deal.
I just quoted you to bring the conversation back to rail vs bus. Re: the bold-heard any more good jokes lately? That's a very congested traffic corridor. We in the NW metro got screwed. There's no other way to put it. Did you read the whole article?
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Old 01-19-2015, 01:00 PM
nei nei won $500 in our forum's Most Engaging Poster Contest - Thirteenth Edition (Jan-Feb 2015). 

Over $104,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum and additional contests are planned
 
Location: Long Island / NYC
45,988 posts, read 41,967,271 times
Reputation: 14805
Quote:
Originally Posted by FallsAngel View Post
I just quoted you to bring the conversation back to rail vs bus. Re: the bold-heard any more good jokes lately? That's a very congested traffic corridor. We in the NW metro got screwed. There's no other way to put it. Did you read the whole article?
I did read it now. As for it being congested, I thought you were saying the corridor wasn't congested, at least the bus route:

Quote:
Originally Posted by FallsAngel View Post
We have express buses w/fewer stops, and they can use the HOV lanes of I-25. We're getting BRT up here in Boulder County, after having voted for rail.
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Old 01-19-2015, 01:02 PM
nei nei won $500 in our forum's Most Engaging Poster Contest - Thirteenth Edition (Jan-Feb 2015). 

Over $104,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum and additional contests are planned
 
Location: Long Island / NYC
45,988 posts, read 41,967,271 times
Reputation: 14805
Quote:
Originally Posted by urbanlife78 View Post
Also another thing that is very questionable that he doesn't address is did he take a local or an express train. Any New Yorker knows you take an express train for any long commutes unless you like riding a train for a long time. I have a feeling a local train helped pad his numbers on how long it took him.
Taking a bus to go half a mile did sound off. Many outer borough locations don't have an express subway, it's just local.
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