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Old 01-20-2015, 02:49 PM
 
3,952 posts, read 4,069,858 times
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Do tell which cities and suburbs are being left behind. I'm not sure what you mean by cultural events. The whole world watched 9/11. That isn't just an event for you Millennials, some of whom weren't even born then, just as one example. Music tastes don't break down by age, IME.
Cultural touchstones are exactly that - events that drove policy decisions for the next decade. I was just using 911 as an example. Kennedy and the Cuban missle crisis had some generations afraid of communism. The younger gen isn't afraid of communism or Russia, so those policies don't fly. 9/11 has us fighting in the Middle East - those are cultural touchstones which have driven gov't policy decisions.

Quote:
One said she didn't need anything; asked for a donation in her name to the American Cancer Society or Lutheran World Relief to fight Ebola. The other one couldn't think of anything, so I got her a sweater.
This points to your social class, as different classes have different desires. These are not your average Christmas ask.

Of course music tastes do break down by age. The younger generation isn't spending large amounts of money on opera, and as such it has to be subsized by the generation that likes it. Rock music is also becoming the music of older people, and as such may have to be subsidized by the generation that likes it in the future.
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Old 01-20-2015, 02:54 PM
 
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Quote:
I'm not sure how much of the walkable environment has been driven by the high gas prices
I doubt it has been driven that much. Maybe the total price of autos, insurance, and licensing has been a driver (especially for the young), but who knows?

Zoning, highway design, and governmental policy decisions driven by racism have been much stronger drivers over the past 50 years. As these policies are subsiding, walkable areas are gaining in popularity.
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Old 01-20-2015, 03:09 PM
 
Location: Foot of the Rockies
87,118 posts, read 102,899,540 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheOverdog View Post
Cultural touchstones are exactly that - events that drove policy decisions for the next decade. I was just using 911 as an example. Kennedy and the Cuban missle crisis had some generations afraid of communism. The younger gen isn't afraid of communism or Russia, so those policies don't fly. 9/11 has us fighting in the Middle East - those are cultural touchstones which have driven gov't policy decisions.



This points to your social class, as different classes have different desires. These are not your average Christmas ask.

Of course music tastes do break down by age. The younger generation isn't spending large amounts of money on opera, and as such it has to be subsized by the generation that likes it. Rock music is also becoming the music of older people, and as such may have to be subsidized by the generation that likes it in the future.
I wasn't afraid of Russia, either, not for years. Neither was our fearless leader. It looks like we all should have been a little more afraid. If you guys aren't afraid of it, you have another think coming.

My daughters' social class is similar to those who supposedly would turn down a job b/c it's not in a "walkable" environment.

I'm not sure who likes opera. I think it's a small subset of music lovers, regardless of age. It's not my thing.
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Old 01-20-2015, 03:59 PM
 
Location: Oakland, CA
27,170 posts, read 29,791,254 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oakparkdude View Post
Its anecdotal, but have been lots of corporations relocating at least some of their tech staff from suburban Chicago to the Loop in the past few years. When interviewed by the business press, the need to attract young employees who tend to be urban-oriented is uniformly cited as the reason.

Off the top of my head here are a few:
Motorola Mobility (at the time owned by Google, now owned by Lenovo)
United Airlines
Sears Holdings (their IT division)
McDonalds (IT division)
plus quite a few more that I can't remember

This trend is abetted by the fact that the burgeoning Chicago tech industry is located in the Loop and adjacent neighborhoods, not the suburbs.
Similar things are happening here in the Bay Area too. Most new school tech companies are trying to move or start in SF. And the VC funding is following this to. And of course there is the google bus phenom here. Companies haven't moved their offices en masse, but they are building amenities (i.e. transit) to get people from the city to the burbs.
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Old 01-20-2015, 04:01 PM
 
Location: Oakland, CA
27,170 posts, read 29,791,254 times
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Originally Posted by nei View Post
I think it was more for historical reasons. The first tech companies come from large industrial parks (that often had some manufacturing) or Stanford University. Once some started in region, more clustered in the same spot.
And the office space was really really cheap.
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Old 01-20-2015, 04:05 PM
 
Location: Oakland, CA
27,170 posts, read 29,791,254 times
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Originally Posted by FallsAngel View Post
I almost snorted my soda out onto the screen reading that! "Walkable doesn't have anything to do with walking to work"!!?? I know lots of people on here like to define words to mean whatever they want. Why, here's a quote that showed up on the Pittsburgh forum yesterday:

""When I use a word, it means just what I choose it to mean — neither more nor less."

—Humpty Dumpty, Alice in Wonderland"

So go ahead, decide walkable means anything you want it to mean. I reserve the right to disagree. And "power lunches", seriously? Happy hours, yes, I know that according to this board, millennials generally like to drink, a lot.

And just who are these millennials, anyway? Depending on the source you read, they're everyone born between 1980 and 2004. Millennials - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
At that rate, many of them are still in middle/high school. The youngest of them just started turning 11 years old 19 days ago! The last high school class, the class of 2014, was born in 1995-96. The last college class, assuming 5 years to get through college as is common these days, was born in 1990-91. Now I know not everyone goes to college, and fewer graduate, but a huge hunk of this millennial generation is still in school, anywhere from 5th grade to grad school.

So these people born in the 1980s-the oldest will be 35 this year; the youngest will be 26 by year's end. Most are just getting started in their careers; many haven't bought houses yet. Once one buys a house, it limits one's ability to move every time one changes jobs, so that one can walk to work, or even take transit sometimes.
I am a little older than the millenials. Walking to work has never been on my radar as a neighborhood amenity. Jobs are transient. Instead I picked a walkable area with the amenities I want. And I pick jobs that are i a reasonable commute so I don't have to move. I have had 5 jobs since I moved into my apartment. That would have been a lot of moving.
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Old 01-20-2015, 06:56 PM
 
Location: Chicago - Logan Square
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I think if you're talking about young recruits, then being close to an urban center with public transit and amenities is a plus. I also think it isn't a definite negative for older workers, or any workers living in the suburbs.

I certainly don't think that anyone should be saying things like "all the Millennials want to live in cities", but at the same time urban centers no longer carry the stigma they did from the late 60's until the late 80's. During that time, some people who wanted to live in a city center were afraid of the crime and the return on any property they might buy, and moved to the suburbs. I think those stigmas are gone, and most people today regard city centers as being vibrant and livable. The automobile has also lost a lot of it's attraction as a modern toy or status symbol for most people, and even intra-suburban commutes have become a dreary slog in many areas. Anyone who prefers to live in a dense urban area will feel comfortable doing it in a way that they wouldn't have 40, 30, or 20 years ago.

These changes have led to a larger percentage of people feeling comfortable moving into an central city area, and for younger people (who are more removed from the historical negative stigma of cities, and the attraction of cars) the attraction is greater. A larger percentage of them will see urban areas as being a desirable place to live than any other generation. They also have the freedom to take advantage of many of the things cities offer - restaurants, bars, music, sports leagues, classes, museums, etc...

It's also important to look at commutes. If someone is driving from suburb to suburb, it's easier for them to drive into the city (or take commuter rail) than it is for someone living in the city to buy a car and start commuting by car. A company is more likely to lose a younger worker (who is less afraid to leave a job) by asking them to buy a car or move, than they are to lose an older worker who is just looking at a different commute.


Quote:
Originally Posted by rwiksell View Post
I see a lot of companies (especially in the midwest) re-locating to office parks in the 'burbs, and still expecting to attract lots of bright millenial college grads. However, my theory is that this type of location is a major turnoff to that generation.
What companies and Midwestern cities? I haven't been seeing that going on in any of the cities I'm familiar with.
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Old 01-20-2015, 08:39 PM
 
2,493 posts, read 2,202,637 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rwiksell View Post
It also seems to be a Boomer assumption (along with the older Gen-Xers) that having kids = suburban life. As if it's some kind of child abuse to raise a family in an apartment, loft, or condo in an urban neighborhood. Yes, some millennials will want the yard and the picket fence, but many won't. As more millennials have kids, the city will evolve to meet their needs, with more options for great nearby elementary schools, child care facilities and kid-friendly entertainment options. The reason the city doesn't look very accommodating to young families NOW is simply that it hasn't happened yet.
One of the things I find fascinating about cities is how they have evolved over time.
It has been fun to watch one industry, craft brewing, change the face of many neighborhoods.
I'm sure families staying in the city will product similar change.

Unfortunately, I believe a city's ability to evolve in an organic manner has decreased over time.
Today's regulations, legal envirnoment, NIMBYism and Wall Street based financing has made change
slower and more uniform and controlled. I would rather see a city that evolved than one that was overly planned by giant corporations.
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Old 01-20-2015, 10:40 PM
 
101 posts, read 294,989 times
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I suspect all this "walkable, work-live-play" hype appeals most to companies that want to hire new college graduates or inexpensive H1B labor, then put them in apartment complexes close to work, and have them walk to work so that they don't need to buy cars, etc. Not having a car payment will allow potential employees to work for less.

I would rather an employer be close to highways and mass transit in an "Edge City" environment.
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Old 01-21-2015, 08:05 AM
 
Location: Foot of the Rockies
87,118 posts, read 102,899,540 times
Reputation: 33170
In thinking about the thread title question, "Is a walkable urban location a must?" (emphasis mine), I'd have to say the answer is "no". I know enough Millennials to have a fairly good sample size, and none of them have ever said they'd have to work in a walkable environment, that they'd turn down a job if it weren't in such an environment. In point of fact, most are not working in such places, including Jukesgrrl, in Denver.

jade408 is right; jobs are transient. In 35 years, DH has had 4 (or 5 depending on how you count them) jobs in 6 or 7 locations, all but one here in metro Denver. Lest you say, he's an old Boomer, yes, he is, but at this point in time he's working with some Millennials as well. As far as "power lunches", he does walk to Wendy's for lunch at times. When he was younger, he'd join some of his co-workers for a happy hour, deep in suburban Jefferson County. They drove. You don't have to get rip-roaring drunk at those things. He did have to drive home.

As for me, I've had many jobs. Since most have been visiting nurse jobs, the walkable environment didn't matter a bit. Nurses don't "power lunch", we're lucky to have time to get a lunch some days. It's down to the hospital cafeteria for us a lot, unless we're out visiting, and then, in a mostly residential area, it's the local fare. Again, in my youth, I did some "Happy Houring". One job was close enough to a Pizza Hut that we'd walk over and leave our cars at the office. This was in Champaign, IL the pizza parlor capital of the US.
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