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Old 07-14-2015, 06:35 PM
 
Location: Northern Colorado
4,932 posts, read 12,755,091 times
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This is what I can see from what has happened from the 60s to today's mall:

-Middle class shoppers are going more to big box centers that have discount and off-price stores
-the stores in the mall have changed. correct me if i'm wrong, but malls used to be more diverse. The music store was in your mall, the electronic store, the knife store, etc... The diversity is less. It's mostly just clothes.
-online shopping is hurting all brick and mortar retailers. All though many still prefer to try on their clothes and enjoy the shopping experience.
-Middle class shoppers are being tight squeezed more than ever in the new economy. They aren't splurging on everything. For instance, I splurge on getting high-end for a couple items that I am passionate about. Otherwise I just look for lowest prices.
-Higher end malls draw from a larger population. Most higher end malls I know of are in extremely high income, high population density, and/or are in high income areas WITH TOURISM. The tourism factor is these malls are there for vacationers who don't mind splurging on a higher end product.
ex: Del Monte Center in Monterey, Carmel Plaza in Carmel, Paseo Nuevo in Santa Barbara, Santa Monica Plaza in Santa Monica, The Lumberyard in Malibu, San Francisco Center and The Metreon.
-cost of water and energy has gone up for malls while store profits have gone down
-even if the mall does well, the stores in middle class malls are closing down

Now for the department store side, if Sear's and JCP closed, I think most malls wouldn't last long. The only replacements would be Walmart and Target. Most towns with Sears and JCP already have Walmart and Target. For malls that are on the higher end side, Forever 21 and perhaps east coast Bealls could be a replacement. I wonder if Burlington Coat Factory might snag some locations. Up to discussion on that one?
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Old 07-15-2015, 01:34 AM
 
Location: Vallejo
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JCP and Sears are anchors at one of my local malls. No one really goes there anyway, especially Sears, so it probably wouldn't have much effect. Montgomery Wards went out and Best Buy and Petco split the space. I still like Sears. Got in an impact wrench set there a few months ago. Before that I bought a battery for the motorcycle, but now we've got Battery Plus which is a better store than Sears. Funny, the motorcycle battery was about two years ago and Sears is the only place I've been in the mall in that time. The entire thing could really just vanish and I probably wouldn't notice at least six months.
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Old 07-15-2015, 02:27 AM
 
Location: Northern Colorado
4,932 posts, read 12,755,091 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Malloric View Post
JCP and Sears are anchors at one of my local malls. No one really goes there anyway, especially Sears, so it probably wouldn't have much effect. Montgomery Wards went out and Best Buy and Petco split the space. I still like Sears. Got in an impact wrench set there a few months ago. Before that I bought a battery for the motorcycle, but now we've got Battery Plus which is a better store than Sears. Funny, the motorcycle battery was about two years ago and Sears is the only place I've been in the mall in that time. The entire thing could really just vanish and I probably wouldn't notice at least six months.
Batteries Plus is taking some of our Radio Shack business too because they carry more cell phone batteries than us.

From what I can tell Radio Shack is going more of a cell phone route with the Sprint partnership. Sprint and phone stuff, audio and electronic part stuff, and a few other electronic stuff for people's conveniance. The sprint rep in our store is doing extremely well and they are getting a remodel in our store so part of the store looks like a sprint store.
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Old 07-15-2015, 06:33 AM
 
122 posts, read 176,620 times
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I think some mall owners would demall those spaces and benefit from it, after new development of residential or outdoor lifestyle center or restaurant pads replaced it.

Probably also Dillard's, Boscov's, and higher end department stores like Nordstrom, Bloomingdales and Lord&Taylor would be courted, while in some cases, Kohl's, Burlington and Target would be courted, depending on the strength of the mall and it's potential. LL Bean is also looking to build new stores. There is also popularity in putting Whole Foods and destination supermarkets like Wegmans in spaces as well, and stores like Barnes &Noble and Dick's Sporting Goods.

I was thinking that it might be interesting if Sears and JCPenney merged. While Sears and Kmart has proven a dud, if the management was more tactical it could likely make Sears and JCPenney stronger together, almost like Marshall's and TJMaxx, or other chains that are co-owned but with different names. Worst case is Sears buying out JCPenney and then cherry picking which Sears and JCPenney stores to keep and which ones to close, likely keeping the Sears banner, much like Federated/May merger did with Macy's and regional name plates like Hecht's/Strawbridge's. End of day, Macy's absorbed the locations and kept which ones made most sense. Sears could also stand to make a lot of money selling off real estate. For example, in NJ, Nordstrom or Bloomingdales would likely fit in very well in Quakerbridge Mall but there is no space for it. Sears could possibly sell off one of the anchor spaces in such scenario.

Kmart on the other hand was ridden with many freestanding 1970s looking stores, and provided less in terms of real estate value.
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Old 07-15-2015, 07:50 AM
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Location: Western Massachusetts
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What does this have to do with urban planning? Seems like a better fit for a shopping forum.
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Old 07-15-2015, 09:35 AM
 
2,220 posts, read 2,798,828 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by the city View Post
This is what I can see from what has happened from the 60s to today's mall:

-Middle class shoppers are going more to big box centers that have discount and off-price stores
-the stores in the mall have changed. correct me if i'm wrong, but malls used to be more diverse. The music store was in your mall, the electronic store, the knife store, etc... The diversity is less. It's mostly just clothes.
-online shopping is hurting all brick and mortar retailers. All though many still prefer to try on their clothes and enjoy the shopping experience.
-Middle class shoppers are being tight squeezed more than ever in the new economy. They aren't splurging on everything. For instance, I splurge on getting high-end for a couple items that I am passionate about. Otherwise I just look for lowest prices.
-Higher end malls draw from a larger population. Most higher end malls I know of are in extremely high income, high population density, and/or are in high income areas WITH TOURISM. The tourism factor is these malls are there for vacationers who don't mind splurging on a higher end product.
ex: Del Monte Center in Monterey, Carmel Plaza in Carmel, Paseo Nuevo in Santa Barbara, Santa Monica Plaza in Santa Monica, The Lumberyard in Malibu, San Francisco Center and The Metreon.
-cost of water and energy has gone up for malls while store profits have gone down
-even if the mall does well, the stores in middle class malls are closing down

Now for the department store side, if Sear's and JCP closed, I think most malls wouldn't last long. The only replacements would be Walmart and Target. Most towns with Sears and JCP already have Walmart and Target. For malls that are on the higher end side, Forever 21 and perhaps east coast Bealls could be a replacement. I wonder if Burlington Coat Factory might snag some locations. Up to discussion on that one?
In some malls, the Big Box stores *became* the anchors. However, the effect was to reduce the number and appeal of "chic boutique" smaller stores.

A Wal-Mart or Target anchor next to a Victoria's Secret or Forever 21 boutique in the redesigned mall make for an odd juxtaposition, but it does happen.

Last edited by NickB1967; 07-15-2015 at 09:46 AM..
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Old 07-15-2015, 12:42 PM
 
Location: East of Seattle since 1992, 615' Elevation, Zone 8b - originally from SF Bay Area
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The upscale mall in nearby Bellevue, WA had JC Penney, one of the early anchor tenants back when it was built. They were happy to get rid of them, so they could add several more appropriate tenants to that space. This mall is part of 3 connected by skybridges and are doing so well that they are doing a major expansion. There is no Sears, and never has been. Nordstrom and Macy's are about the lowest price stores there now.
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Old 07-15-2015, 03:01 PM
 
Location: Portland, Oregon
1,740 posts, read 957,474 times
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Retail stores in general, and malls in particular, have been vastly over built. There is too much capacity. If you add in the changes in the way people shop (online) and stagnant wages for 80% of the population, then you have the perfect storm for stores and malls closing. I don't think Sears can survive, not as long as it is owned by Ed Lampert, who has done more to destroy it than anything else. He is only interested in the real estate, and has no desire to run a retail business. For the thousands of Sears employees, and the 130 yrs + legacy of one of the great retail names, I think it is tragic. I think JC Penney has a better chance, although I don't think I've bought anything there in years. There is absolutely nothing that would make me want to walk into one of their stores.

The high end stores will survive just fine: Neiman Marcus, Bloomingdales, Lord & Taylor, Nordstrom, etc. They are only in a few, high income locations. They will never be mass retailers.

I think one of the big reasons for the difficulty of malls and dept stores in general is all the consolidation that has taken place over the last 20 years. There are virtually no regional dept stores left anymore. You have the same stores, coast to coast, with the identical merchandise and look. All regional differences, local color, and individuality has been wiped out. I have worked in retail management for a long time, and I have seen first hand the consolidation and centralization of buying and operations. When I first started, I knew our buyers, they would come to the stores, they would talk with the sales associates to see what customers were asking for, and would help customers themselves so they could learn first hand what sells, what doesn't, what were the customers requesting, etc. Buyers were actually allowed to BUY. They met with the vendors, would go to New York, and sometimes Europe, and be given an amount of freedom that is unheard of today. New labels and designers would be introduced into the stores. Sometimes they sold, sometimes they didn't. But the customer was given newness and variety. Now, all buying is highly centralized in one office. The buyers NEVER go to the stores. They have no contact with store management, let alone sales associates or customers. They have very little freedom in their buying as well. All major merchandising decisions are made at the highest levels, and there is an approved list of vendors the buyers can deal with. It's the same tired brands and looks, season after season. It's safe and boring. And virtually all the stores are identical with little to no variation. This is one of the main reasons so many major retailers are having trouble. Even though I get a discount, at least when it comes to clothes, there are few items that we stock that I have any interest in buying.
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Old 07-15-2015, 09:51 PM
 
Location: Northern Colorado
4,932 posts, read 12,755,091 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NeutralZone View Post
Retail stores in general, and malls in particular, have been vastly over built. There is too much capacity. If you add in the changes in the way people shop (online) and stagnant wages for 80% of the population, then you have the perfect storm for stores and malls closing. I don't think Sears can survive, not as long as it is owned by Ed Lampert, who has done more to destroy it than anything else. He is only interested in the real estate, and has no desire to run a retail business. For the thousands of Sears employees, and the 130 yrs + legacy of one of the great retail names, I think it is tragic. I think JC Penney has a better chance, although I don't think I've bought anything there in years. There is absolutely nothing that would make me want to walk into one of their stores.

The high end stores will survive just fine: Neiman Marcus, Bloomingdales, Lord & Taylor, Nordstrom, etc. They are only in a few, high income locations. They will never be mass retailers.

I think one of the big reasons for the difficulty of malls and dept stores in general is all the consolidation that has taken place over the last 20 years. There are virtually no regional dept stores left anymore. You have the same stores, coast to coast, with the identical merchandise and look. All regional differences, local color, and individuality has been wiped out. I have worked in retail management for a long time, and I have seen first hand the consolidation and centralization of buying and operations. When I first started, I knew our buyers, they would come to the stores, they would talk with the sales associates to see what customers were asking for, and would help customers themselves so they could learn first hand what sells, what doesn't, what were the customers requesting, etc. Buyers were actually allowed to BUY. They met with the vendors, would go to New York, and sometimes Europe, and be given an amount of freedom that is unheard of today. New labels and designers would be introduced into the stores. Sometimes they sold, sometimes they didn't. But the customer was given newness and variety. Now, all buying is highly centralized in one office. The buyers NEVER go to the stores. They have no contact with store management, let alone sales associates or customers. They have very little freedom in their buying as well. All major merchandising decisions are made at the highest levels, and there is an approved list of vendors the buyers can deal with. It's the same tired brands and looks, season after season. It's safe and boring. And virtually all the stores are identical with little to no variation. This is one of the main reasons so many major retailers are having trouble. Even though I get a discount, at least when it comes to clothes, there are few items that we stock that I have any interest in buying.
I agree with you. I think Macy's does all right because of their "My Macy's" campaign which allows them to cater. It's why Macy's in Hawaii sells kayaks and hawaiin outfits.
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Old 07-18-2015, 09:34 PM
 
1,099 posts, read 1,143,001 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by the city View Post
I agree with you. I think Macy's does all right because of their "My Macy's" campaign which allows them to cater. It's why Macy's in Hawaii sells kayaks and hawaiin outfits.
The dumbest thing they ever did was to get rid of the local department store names. Here in Ohio, Lazarus meant something. Why take a name that's been around since 1851 and replace it with the name of a tacky New York department store that isn't even a half-step above JCPenney?

Kroger does it right. It keeps the local names and its stores are locally merchandised.
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