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You can live however you like, as long as you can afford it today AND tomorrow. The problem is that many who think like yourself have done the former and now are complaining to OPEC, hippies, speculators, etc because they can't do the latter.
I still believe it is inevitable that we will end up more like Europe, regardless of how much we can't be dragged kicking and screaming. Either that or we live more in isolation. Take your pick.
I would like you to come up with the FACTS, how many people in large houses are over stressed, how many of these people are going through foreclosure?
We have several very large sub-divisions with very large homes (7-15,000 sqft) they have the LOWEST foreclosure rates in the city, while the small home 1500-2000 sqft homes have the HIGHEST foreclosure rates.
How many families do you know with 5 children? I don't know anybody with more than 3 and most have 1 or 2 if they have any! Now I have had 4 and our house is 2000 sq ft and we got along just fine.
I am designing several homes right now around Boulder Coloraod that have 5-7 kids. nothing to odd about that, we do occationaly get some in that have 1-2 kids, but are planning on many more.
Location: Jonquil City (aka Smyrna) Georgia- by Atlanta
16,259 posts, read 24,752,651 times
Reputation: 3587
Quote:
Originally Posted by evilnewbie
Let me get this right...
1) you want everyone in the suburb to move into the city and drive up your mortgage/rent 10X because it will be more affordable for you? Yeah, you are pretty smart perhaps you heard of supply and demand... more people buying into living in the city means YOU pay more... quite moronic thinking there... the suburbs are subsidizing and controlling your rent from increasing instead of 30 people looking for one apartment, its 3 people looking for one apartment and that leaves your rent cheap and affordable or do you still think its affordable for those who make 30-90k with families to support to live in the city with 10X rent?
2) If there were no suburbs there would be no highways and do you think sticking in five times as much people into the city will make it less congested in driving within the city? Have you SEEN NYC or Philly or driven in it? There are basically no traffic laws within the city and congestion is simply overbearing... more people stuck in the same city, do you really think the hospitals in the city would have enough beds if there weren't suburban hospitals?... wow that is so much better and I guess you like people dying! Oh well the more people die, the more room you have in the city.
3) No public transit system because of super highways? Excuse me? I have yet to see someone propose a transit system that goes everywhere... that's where it fails badly... unless you like to walk a mile to 3 miles to work in the rain, snow, and hail from the public transport hub or take a taxi... of course it costs you more than simply driving there yourself. Until someone designs an adequate system, people are going to use whatever system works best AND cheap, and that would be the super highways. Its your fault if you can't come up with a viable solution instead of blaming it on "super highways"...
3) Zoning laws precluding blue collar workers? You can't live everywhere and if you can't afford to live in Atlanta like I can't afford to live in California or New York... guess what. MOVE... I don't sit here and whine that I can't live in San Diego or NYC.. I live where I can and that is fine with me...
Wait just a second. I am old enough to remember when people- incluidng us- lived in the city before interstates were put into cities. There was no I-135 cutting my neighbourhood in half and there was no I-235 going around town. There was I-35 and 4 exits into Wichita. And the city was quite affordable and a nice place to live. And the schools were good too It also had a good bus system- the WMTA ran bus service from 6AM to midnight 6 days a week and the bus came every 15 minutes in the day which is why a family like ours- with 2 adults and 5 kids- could get along just fine with a single car. If my mother needed to use the car, dad rode the bus to his job at Boeing or caught a ride with a co-worker. It was no problem either way. Until the Republican (Nixon-Ford) hyper inflation hit in the 70s, my mother did not need to work and didn't. And most mothers in my neighbourhood did not work in the 60s.
Then they came and put in the superhighways. They cut neighbourhoods in half- including mine and destroyed them. I remember walking across highway 54- the main highway in town- at the crossing light. Now it is a superhighway and they had to build a walkway across it for the kids to go to school on my side. And they destroyed the commercial support and economy of the neighbourhood including the IGA grocery store, the hardware store, the bakery, restaurants, the cleaners and the 2 neighbourhood taverns. Thus the neighbourhood declined and people followed the superhighway out to the suburbs and beyond.
Am I saying we need to go back..? No! But what I am saying is that we need to change direction. We need to discourage- not encourage long commutes, huge SUVs and 1 occupant drivers. I actually like Bloomberg's proposal in NYC to charge people to drive into lower Manhattan during peak rush hours. Other cities should take a close look at doing it too.
Zoning needs to be changed to encourage high density smaller housing and discourage huge houses on huge lots. People DO want this kind of housing and everytime a townhouse development opens here, it is often sold out before it is even completed. The problem is that there are precious few places where such housing can be built because of land use laws. If not for that, there would be plenty of housing for everybody.
Wait just a second. I am old enough to remember when people- incluidng us- lived in the city before interstates were put into cities. There was no I-135 cutting my neighbourhood in half and there was no I-235 going around town. There was I-35 and 4 exits into Wichita. And the city was quite affordable and a nice place to live. And the schools were good too It also had a good bus system- the WMTA ran bus service from 6AM to midnight 6 days a week and the bus came every 15 minutes in the day which is why a family like ours- with 2 adults and 5 kids- could get along just fine with a single car. If my mother needed to use the car, dad rode the bus to his job at Boeing or caught a ride with a co-worker. It was no problem either way. Until the Republican (Nixon-Ford) hyper inflation hit in the 70s, my mother did not need to work and didn't. And most mothers in my neighbourhood did not work in the 60s.
Then they came and put in the superhighways. They cut neighbourhoods in half- including mine and destroyed them. I remember walking across highway 54- the main highway in town- at the crossing light. Now it is a superhighway and they had to build a walkway across it for the kids to go to school on my side. And they destroyed the commercial support and economy of the neighbourhood including the IGA grocery store, the hardware store, the bakery, restaurants, the cleaners and the 2 neighbourhood taverns. Thus the neighbourhood declined and people followed the superhighway out to the suburbs and beyond.
Am I saying we need to go back..? No! But what I am saying is that we need to change direction. We need to discourage- not encourage long commutes, huge SUVs and 1 occupant drivers. I actually like Bloomberg's proposal in NYC to charge people to drive into lower Manhattan during peak rush hours. Other cities should take a close look at doing it too.
Zoning needs to be changed to encourage high density smaller housing and discourage huge houses on huge lots. People DO want this kind of housing and everytime a townhouse development opens here, it is often sold out before it is even completed. The problem is that there are precious few places where such housing can be built because of land use laws. If not for that, there would be plenty of housing for everybody.
I may not agree with your economic outlook or policies, but your memory of the way America used to be is much more spot on than some here.
I'm just very pleased that the free market is FORCING these changes on people, albeit with much more childish crybaby attitude.
I am designing several homes right now around Boulder Coloraod that have 5-7 kids. nothing to odd about that, we do occationaly get some in that have 1-2 kids, but are planning on many more.
Your anecdotal evidence doesn't jive with many nuclear families. In the data mining/statistical business I'm in, they're called 'outliers'.
Few Americans owned 6000sqft homes back in the day, and few can truly afford them now.
Why is every counterargument to the 'burbs, the city? There are rural areas, university areas, etc.
Your home isn't boring and isn't a McMansion. It should be interesting to see what the bill to heat and cool is though
I don't think any of these things. My posts are Libertarian to the extreme. I would never think to use government to prevent anyone from living in a 20,000sqft home if they wanted to.
have you been to the suburbs of Denver? I'm not talking about the modern burbs, these were the burbs in the mid to late 1800's. There are Victorian homes between 4-8000 EVERYWHERE! and many of them were torn down during the modernization of the 60's they were not few and far between as you suggest, they were quite common.
American is fast becoming a "nanny state" with everyone seeminly knowing what is best for everyone else....and not hesitating to try to force their opinions onto everyone elses lives. Whatever became of American independence? People use everything from health insurance to the environment as an excuse to regulate other people's private life and choices. The truth is, some people just can not accept the fact that other people won't accept their edicts as law.
Sadly, I agree. It is becoming a nanny state, where people want the gov't to step in and tell us what's good for us, and force this upon the entire population. The thought police, political correctness police, and the socialist types are running amok. People need to keep their nose in their own business. You are in control of your own destiny, don't try to control others destiny, thank you.
Florida and California are two epicenters in the unfolding of the real estate ponzi scheme. Don't forget Las Vegas.
In all three areas foreclosure "victim" median home prices are WELL above the national median.
Anyone who looks at foreclosure listings in Sacremento, Ft. Lauderdale, Vegas and others can see the carnage.
still these are not HARD facts, proven statistics you are just saying them, not proving it to me.
Denver and other parts of Colorado got hit HARD by the explosion, but it was not the larger homes that had the problems, it was the smaller homes that were melting down.
my house that I grew up in was built in 1966 in suburbs of Miami which my parents bought at the time there was nothing but strawberry fields surrounding.
I remember in the 80's 5 miles away Saga Bay was nothing but woods,by the 90's was all cookie cutter type houses.
Urban sprawl has been happening for generations.
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