Utah - How Would I Fit In? (Salt Lake City, Provo: high school, live)

[hilgi]

Originally Posted by cglor

I will add my own personal experience here, as a non-LDS adult then involved in a same-sex relationship of many years. We moved from Reno to a suburb of Salt Lake City in 1998. We had no rainbow flags out front of the house, or anything else that would indicate anything "unusual" about us. I have never been absolutely ignored by neighbors before; it was weird. They weren't hostile, we just simply did not exist. We could see the same people every day going to work and they NEVER acknowledged our existence. At work people were friendly enough, although I stayed way in thew closet. However, just in daily office conversations, the church was always present. The conversations between office workers were about the church, the missions their kids were on, the bishop; in other words, it was not deliberately in your face but it was never not a part of the whole dynamic. The appearance of absolute obedience to the church, even to putting flags up in front of the house on all required holidays, was a bit scary to me. So, bottom line, would I ever live in Utah again - maybe, but NEVER outside of the city of Salt Lake. The city is really nice and not so lock-step, and the natural setting is absolutely spectacular. I loved the weather too. I just never liked the 'dominant culture' in most of Utah.

Must be a neighborhood thing, I know 3 same sex couples in my area. One of them lives 3 doors down from the Temple, from what I hear those houses are popular among LDS to live in. They have people over to parties and neighbors invite them to all the BBQ's etc., they have had zero problems.

Considering the history that the LDS church has had with the US Government, I don't see them as overly Patriotic.

[ChrisC]

Hmmm, interesting comments on the last few posts.

I've never seen the flag of our nation as scary (or anyone who displays it). I'm not really the flag-waving type, but I'm not fearful of or embarrassed by the US flag either. Interesting perspective there.

I think I'm beginning to see why I've never had the problematic experiences over the past 35 years that so many other posters here on CD forums have in this area. Not that I'm a hermit, but I am a rather private person. When others state that they are "ignored" around here and they say it as if it's a bad thing, I've come to realize that it's one of the things I LIKE about this area. Yes, there are way too many people around here for my tastes, but for the most part they keep to themselves. They don't bother me. They don't nag me. They don't pry into my business. They leave me alone. I see that as a plus. The fact that neighbors and such don't hound me is a good thing in my eyes. Truthfully, if I feel I need to make contact with somebody, I'll do it. Otherwise, I'm fine with being ignored--I prefer it. Not existing has its perks. I have a clear trail to do as I please, unencumbered.

Ultimately, if you are not LDS and in Utah (outside of the SLC area), I don't think you'll have any problem if you are essentially self-contained (or your family is), cherish privacy, and really don't require or want much attention. But if you are a highly social person who depends on interaction with others for contentment, fulfillment, and meaning in your life, you might have troubles unless you are part of the dominant culture. Everything I've written over the months about the Utah Valley area is true... but at the same time, it's false. You need to analyze your personality type and decide for yourself whether it's true or false for you. I still firmly maintain that it's not the area's fault, but rather the way YOU will interact with the area.

[hilgi]

Originally Posted by ChrisC

Hmmm, interesting comments on the last few posts.

I've never seen the flag of our nation as scary (or anyone who displays it). I'm not really the flag-waving type, but I'm not fearful of or embarrassed by the US flag either. Interesting perspective there.

I think I'm beginning to see why I've never had the problematic experiences over the past 35 years that so many other posters here on CD forums have in this area. Not that I'm a hermit, but I am a rather private person. When others state that they are "ignored" around here and they say it as if it's a bad thing, I've come to realize that it's one of the things I LIKE about this area. Yes, there are way too many people around here for my tastes, but for the most part they keep to themselves. They don't bother me. They don't nag me. They don't pry into my business. They leave me alone. I see that as a plus. The fact that neighbors and such don't hound me is a good thing in my eyes. Truthfully, if I feel I need to make contact with somebody, I'll do it. Otherwise, I'm fine with being ignored--I prefer it. Not existing has its perks. I have a clear trail to do as I please, unencumbered.

Ultimately, if you are not LDS and in Utah (outside of the SLC area), I don't think you'll have any problem if you are essentially self-contained (or your family is), cherish privacy, and really don't require or want much attention. But if you are a highly social person who depends on interaction with others for contentment, fulfillment, and meaning in your life, you might have troubles unless you are part of the dominant culture. Everything I've written over the months about the Utah Valley area is true... but at the same time, it's false. You need to analyze your personality type and decide for yourself whether it's true or false for you. I still firmly maintain that it's not the area's fault, but rather the way YOU will interact with the area.

Good post! I look at it as you can have neighbors and acquaintances with many, some people are just that, waving neighbors. If you need to have everyone around you be your best friend and you don't want to put effort in to finding friends, you may have issues.

[SouthernBelleInUtah]

When the Boy Scouts did the flag thing in my neighborhood, several of us who are not LDS participated b/c we like the display. Nothing sinister about it.

[Creo006]

Originally Posted by hilgi

How come my Hispanic, Black and Vietnamese neighbors all say the opposite?

I don't know I'm not them, I was talking about my experiences in Utah. However, how come my French, Australian, Japanese, lesbian, gay and Pygmy friends agree with me?

Originally Posted by Katzpur

Jeesh! I can't imagine why you don't like it here. I mean you sound like such a likable person.

Your sarcasm is duly noted and sorely lacking wit or anything to further the discussion. Thanks

This is another thing, anytime you express any kind of displeasure or even a hint of negativity about Utah in an unhostile way -- all of the sudden people jump to defend it or make snide remarks. Why? It's just my opinion. Not everyone is going to like it here. Frankly the weather sucks, theres not much to do and the people here are rude.

[lauramc27]

Originally Posted by Creo006

I don't know I'm not them, I was talking about my experiences in Utah. However, how come my French, Australian, Japanese, lesbian, gay and Pygmy friends agree with me?




Your sarcasm is duly noted and sorely lacking wit or anything to further the discussion. Thanks

This is another thing, anytime you express any kind of displeasure or even a hint of negativity about Utah in an unhostile way -- all of the sudden people jump to defend it or make snide remarks. Why? It's just my opinion. Not everyone is going to like it here. Frankly the weather sucks, theres not much to do and the people here are rude.

What he/she said

[Katzpur]

Originally Posted by Creo006

Your sarcasm is duly noted and sorely lacking wit or anything to further the discussion. Thanks

I'm so glad you picked up on it. Sometimes I'm not very good at getting my point across.

This is another thing, anytime you express any kind of displeasure or even a hint of negativity about Utah in an unhostile way -- all of the sudden people jump to defend it or make snide remarks.

That's not the truth. Any time you make negative generalizations about three million people, you're going to offend an enormous number of very nice people. Why would you be surprised or think it inappropriate for those people jump to defend themselves?

Frankly the weather sucks, theres not much to do and the people here are rude.

I'm with you with respect to the weather. I'd say winter sucks. ChrisC would say the summer sucks. As far as I'm concerned, winter would suck in most of the country. As far as he is concerned, summer would suck in most of the country. There is nothing much more subjective that preference for weather. On the other hand, there is tons of stuff to do here. Obviously, we're not New York City, but for a city of its size, Salt Lake City offers a lot of great activities. And as far as being at a good location for outdoor recreation, it's unparalleled anywhere in the country. As far as the people here being rude, you and those like you are proof of that.

[hilgi]

Originally Posted by Creo006

I don't know I'm not them, I was talking about my experiences in Utah. However, how come my French, Australian, Japanese, lesbian, gay and Pygmy friends agree with me?

I thought you said "just that aside from the occasional Mexican or Pacific Islander there is no exposure to alternative cultures or ways of thinking."

Sounds like you have exposure to a lot of alternative cultures?

[irman]

Originally Posted by Creo006

I don't know I'm not them, I was talking about my experiences in Utah. However, how come my French, Australian, Japanese, lesbian, gay and Pygmy friends agree with me?

Pygmy ???
Geesj, didn't know that they started to invade this strange quirky non alcoholic area .....
I need a beer now ...

[ChrisC]

Originally Posted by Katzpur

Obviously, we're not New York City,

Thank heavens. Of all the places in the US, NYC would be the one with the least "things to do" for me in the entire nation. I'd feel imprisoned. Living 50 miles from nowhere, on the other hand, would probably have the most "things to do" for me.

Point being, just like your weather comment response (which is certainly true! ), "things to do" is another very, very subjective and personal thing.

When the previous poster stated "not much to do here," I just had to shake my head--as I always do when I read this comment on EVERY state forum I visit. There's never anything to do anywhere, is there? I've come to the conclusion that "nothing to do" is a personality disorder rather than the shortcoming of a location. I've never found "nothing to do" in my entire life, no matter where I've been. There is ALWAYS something to do. My problem is never that there is "nothing to do," it's that I don't have time to do all the things there are to do that I want to do.