utah & alcohol... (Francis: attorney, house, job transfer)

[dogmom]

Cinnabon...we here in St. George area just recently got our 2nd liquor store...the first one was way over on the other side of town near Santa Clara and extremely small. The new one is much bigger, I have not been down there yet, but it is closer to downtown, easier for those folks in Washington and Coral Canyon.

You can go on a state website and find out where the liquor stores are. If you live out in the sticks, you pretty much have to travel some distance..
[url="http://http://www.alcbev.state.ut.us/Stores/about_stores.html"]

Do what we do...when we go to California we just buy what we want for private consumption and yes i know its against the law to bring it across the border but it's not kegs and it's just for personal use...i can't even tell you how many people go to Mesquite for their booze...

[SergeantL]

Originally Posted by cinnabon

I think it is a myth among non-drinkers that drinking is always "bad" so I wanted to comment on this. I would not necesarily call light to moderate drinking a "bad habit", when in fact it has been found to have certain health benefits. The vast majority of social drinkers do not drink to get drunk, and do not behave irresponsibly as a result of their drinking. When I drink I usually have 1 or maybe 2 drinks in an evening.

I understand how you feel; however, your views are not the dominant attitude in Utah. Next, the studies to which you refer regarding the advantages of light to moderate alcohol consumption have recently been discredited. Even if there were some substantiated advantages to drinking, it is a matter of record that the downsides to alcohol consumption far outweigh any advantages. Anyone moving to Utah, who consumes alcohol, needs to be prepared for a mindset that does not necessarily view drinking as socially acceptable.

[cinnabon]

Originally Posted by dogmom

Cinnabon...we here in St. George area just recently got our 2nd liquor store...the first one was way over on the other side of town near Santa Clara and extremely small. The new one is much bigger, I have not been down there yet, but it is closer to downtown, easier for those folks in Washington and Coral Canyon.

You can go on a state website and find out where the liquor stores are. If you live out in the sticks, you pretty much have to travel some distance..
[url="http://http://www.alcbev.state.ut.us/Stores/about_stores.html"]

Do what we do...when we go to California we just buy what we want for private consumption and yes i know its against the law to bring it across the border but it's not kegs and it's just for personal use...i can't even tell you how many people go to Mesquite for their booze...

lol I was thinking I'll have to bring a few cases when I move there! I'll most likely be in SLC so hopefully there will be a few state stores there. I will be curious to see how prices in the state stores, as well as selection, compares to what I'm used to.

Originally Posted by SergeantL

I understand how you feel; however, your views are not the dominant attitude in Utah. Next, the studies to which you refer regarding the advantages of light to moderate alcohol consumption have recently been discredited. Even if there were some substantiated advantages to drinking, it is a matter of record that the downsides to alcohol consumption far outweigh any advantages. Anyone moving to Utah, who consumes alcohol, needs to be prepared for a mindset that does not necessarily view drinking as socially acceptable.

Hmmm - I had not heard that. Well regardless of health benefits or not, to me the issue is not so much advantages vs. disadvantages. I work in mental health and am well of the negatives, particularly for people who are basically allergic to it (biological alcoholics), and of course the same can be said of other addictive substances, such as certain Rx drugs and street drugs.

In my case, all of my life I have been around people who are social drinkers and those who suffer no ill effects from their drinking, which is why I feel like in many cases drinking is pretty benign. But I realize not everyone feels that way, and it's not only Mormons who are against it (born again Christians often are as well). I'm not too concerned about people who will disapprove, as most likely I will be socializing more with people whose views are consistent with my own.

[lolagranola]

Originally Posted by cinnabon
I think it is a myth among non-drinkers that drinking is always "bad" so I wanted to comment on this. I would not necesarily call light to moderate drinking a "bad habit", when in fact it has been found to have certain health benefits. The vast majority of social drinkers do not drink to get drunk, and do not behave irresponsibly as a result of their drinking. When I drink I usually have 1 or maybe 2 drinks in an evening.

I understand how you feel; however, your views are not the dominant attitude in Utah. Next, the studies to which you refer regarding the advantages of light to moderate alcohol consumption have recently been discredited. Even if there were some substantiated advantages to drinking, it is a matter of record that the downsides to alcohol consumption far outweigh any advantages. Anyone moving to Utah, who consumes alcohol, needs to be prepared for a mindset that does not necessarily view drinking as socially acceptable.

(responding here as a "non" who has lived in UT for 6 years and LOVE it and LOVE the people)

I personally don't have a problem with the alcohol laws...usually when I go to the liquor store it is because I need some wine to cook with and get a few bottles of something that I'll forget I have 6 months down the road when I go again. Or, I'm having out of state company.

But what I really want to comment on is how everyone seems to think that if you drink-at all- you have a problem.

[Aerorick]

Cinnabon, to answer your question about how spread out state liquor stores are I'll give an example. In Southwest Utah starting from the Arizona border at St. George to at least 50 miles north past Cedar City there were two. But I guess they opened another in St. George so there's three. That's three stores for a population of approximately 140,000 people in two counties. Am I complaining that's there not enough booze in the state? Not at all. I just get a kick out some of the things they do in Utah to keep us all in line. Am I going to leave because of it? Heck no, you can't buy this kind of entertainment.

[john2timex]

Next, by creating a restrictive, yet not insurmountable distribution system, the state satisfies certain objectives. One, for those who want alcohol, they can find it. Two, by making the process of purchase somewhat laborious, the process may discourage those who are not absolutely determined to consume alcohol, which may lead to one less person in the state with a bad habit at best and an addiction at worst. Three, allowing but controlling the sales of alcohol reduces or eliminates criminal distribution incentives. Four, restrictive laws reduces the total number of persons involved in sales and therefore makes supervision and enforcement easier. Fifth, and finally, the state hopes to reduce alcohol consumption, which leads to reduced inhibitions, which can be directly linked to a number of antisocial or illegal behaviors and a whole host of mental health and medical problems.

Sarge, I think that you would agree that with great freedom comes great responsibility. I understand that others don't live up to your expectations of how people should behave. The problem that I have with many of your posts is that you belive others need to meet your standards or leave the state. As a non-member, alcohol drinking, probably less than perfect individual by your standards, person. I still think that I have the right to live wherever I choose within the United States. It would be convenient to give away our freedoms and have the government regulate what is and isn't appropriate. For many this would be a utopia, because the negative social consequeces of drug use and alcohol abuse would go away. But the reality is that people will always shirk thier responsibilities and it is not your place to dictate what behaviors are appropriate for me. I would suggest that if you don't want to live in an area where people have the freedom to live as they choose, you should move someplace which does not fall under the purview of the US constitution.

[Purplegrapes]

I have lived here only a year and am a social drinker...If we go out to dinner and have a drink or beer I can't say that I have been ever looked down upon for having one or have been made to feel uncomfortable...If I have ever been judged for doing it I sure haven't noticed nor would I have cared. Personally I wouldn't even give it a thought.

My son is in law enforcement..Each month he and his buddies at work have a get together at their homes...Some are LDS others aren't...Some have a beer, others root beer...Uhh yeah it is possible to live together in harmony in this state, imagine that! lol..

[cinnabon]

Originally Posted by Purplegrapes

I have lived here only a year and am a social drinker...If we go out to dinner and have a drink or beer I can't say that I have been ever looked down upon for having one or have been made to feel uncomfortable...If I have ever been judged for doing it I sure haven't noticed nor would I have cared. Personally I wouldn't even give it a thought.

My son is in law enforcement..Each month he and his buddies at work have a get together at their homes...Some are LDS others aren't...Some have a beer, others root beer...Uhh yeah it is possible to live together in harmony in this state, imagine that! lol..

Good to hear! I don't expect everyone to be like me, and they shouldn't expect me to be like them either. I have no problem with people choosing not to drink, Mormon or not, but in the majority of the developed world, drinking is a part of life for many, whether it's wine in France or Italy, Vodka in Russia, beer in England or Germany, or Sake in Japan... and somehow, life goes on in these places. I don't think people who choose to abstain should pass judgement on everyone else.

[jazzlover]

I hesitate to weigh in on us because I don't live in Utah, though I go there fairly regularly and I personally wouldn't mind living there.

I also:
a) am not LDS.
b) am not adverse to having a drink once in a while.
c) don't usually tell others how to live their lives.

All of that said, Utah's alcohol laws are what they are--until and if the Legislature decides to change them. If you don't like Utah's alcohol laws, THEN DON'T MOVE THERE or don't vacation there. Real simple. I also have to say that anyone who bases their decision on where to move solely on that criteria (getting a drink) needs to get a real life. I enjoy "having a belt" every so often as much as anybody, but my life doesn't revolve around it. If Utah were a "dry" state, it wouldn't stop me from moving there if that is where I chose to relocate--and its current alcohol laws have certainly not stopped me from visiting there on both business and pleasure.

It is also comforting to know when I am driving in Utah that it consistently ranks as the state safest from the carnage of drunk driving. Whether that is attributable to the state's drinking laws or its high LDS population, or both--that is certainly something to take into account before the state "tinkers" with its current alcohol statutes.

[cinnabon]

Originally Posted by jazzlover

I hesitate to weigh in on us because I don't live in Utah, though I go there fairly regularly and I personally wouldn't mind living there.

I also:
a) am not LDS.
b) am not adverse to having a drink once in a while.
c) don't usually tell others how to live their lives.

All of that said, Utah's alcohol laws are what they are--until and if the Legislature decides to change them. If you don't like Utah's alcohol laws, THEN DON'T MOVE THERE or don't vacation there. Real simple. I also have to say that anyone who bases their decision on where to move solely on that criteria (getting a drink) needs to get a real life.

You contradict yourself! I don't like the alcohol laws at all, but they play absolutely no part in my decision to move there. Now, if the entire state was completely dry, then I might not want to move there, but as it stands, it's just a bit of an inconvenience to get it, but not really a big deal... Also, as the overall percentage of Mormons drops in Utah, as it seems to be doing, maybe eventually the laws will loosen up a bit more.

Sorry, I just wish people would stop saying "If you don't like it, don't come" about every issue people bring up. There are pros and cons to living ANYWHERE. In my view the pros in Utah seem to far outweigh the cons, although that may not be true of everyone. But just because someone has concerns about the Mormon influence or the availability of alcohol or the inversion smog does not automatically mean they should just give up and go elsewhere. Some things are worth putting up with!