Non-mormon family looking to relocate to Lehi (Saratoga Springs: sales, new house)

[johnlvs2run]

Originally Posted by hymie67

You move into the neighborhood, my kids tell your kids that they aren't allowed to play with them, you assume it's because you are not Mormon. The reality is that your kids are using foul language, my kids are picking it up and I tell them not to play with those kids anymore.

Okay since this higher or holier than thou keeps getting thrust in the faces of anyone not LDS let me give my experience on this too.

I grew up in Idaho Falls ID which is primarily Mormon. It was not a good experience. This was not because I cussed or swore or used any foul language, but because most of the people there are ignorant, close minded and bigoted. My mom taught school, 5th grade and 3rd grade. She is 86 now. I always asked why she didn't like Idaho Falls. She would only say the people were strange and wouldn't say any more about it. We talked two nights ago and I asked her again, was this because of the Mormons?

Now when I am talking of these things, I am NOT talking about the religion, but rather of the bigotry and hypocrisy. My mom still won't talk about it that much. She had a neighborhood group that met once a week. The neighbor across the street came for awhile and then stopped because she "wasn't supposed to drink coffee". Which was fine. But she DID drink coffee, she just didn't want anyone to know that she did. So she wouldn't be friends with the people in the neighborhood, the non-Mormans that is, because they might know she drank coffee???? Or whatever. My parents joined the Elks club that was run by the Mormons. They'll all get drunk, drink coffee, anything else, then the next few days they'd swear they never drank a drop of alcohol in their lives. What do you call that?

My mom was in the teachers lounge talking with the women one time and then as she was leaving she overheard one woman to another say, "too bad she's not LDS". Geesh. Talk about bigotry. Talk about prejudice. And you won't let your kids play with others, because the "other" kids don't meet your standards.

To any Mormans who think that way I will say, it is easier for others to see you, than for you to take a look at yourselves.

[sgt jeep]

I have been following the thread and finally decided to post my own .02cents, just because of DP525's one post referring to his move to Daybreak and the 'visit' to his house within 8 days. I find it quite typical of the LDS people I know to do this, and I do have "Utah' experience to back it up. From hearing of other AF members spouses not being promoted for jobs to getting declined for credit, to preferential treatment. Now, since this didn't affect me directly, I really did not care enough to judge. But, just because it was there and happened, along with other examples, I feel being non-LDS may be an issue. Is that judging? Sure is.

I too am considering a move to Utah. I was in the AF and stationed at Hill AFB for 6 years, from early '90's to the late '90's. (20 some miles north of SLC) I am now considering a move BACK to Ut. Why, because I love everything outdoors and want to raise my kids in the same seasonal environment I grew up in, sharing with them the wonderful experiences we've had. (We currently live in Florida, but I grew up in north eastern US where there is snow and 4 seasons).

The morals and values of the people in the area are quite high. Who knows if it is because of the LDS religion or just living in the West in general. We rarely experienced any different treatment being non-LDS. This was when we were 'in' and exposure was limited do to the military's unique diversity it brings to the table. Now, moving and not being affliliated with the AF will be different, and it is apparent in our apprehension. Private schools, and 'to each their own' will be our families philosphy to start with. Am I limiting myself already? Probably. Is it wrong? Not in my mind. Does it make me a bigot? Not when it concerns how I will raise my children. And the most important question: will I be judged differently by God because of it? I think not.

From reading your posts DP525 you appear sincere and respectful of others. I am curious to your other opinions and experiences you've had since your last post I mentioned.

Someone also mentioned that to be posting on this thread you are most likely moving to Ut and are concerned about the LDS issues. Those issues ranging from being non-LDS living and working in Ut, rasing your children in Ut being non-LDS, or working for an LDS boss, being non-LDS. And yes, rather it will be admitted or not, there are issues to be addressed. To debate or dispute any of the issues talked about, you are either an extremely bored person; you live to debate LDS/religion; you are part of an LDS conspiracy to quelch any and all avenues to talk down the LDS religion; you are part of an LDS conspiracy attempting to infiltrate any and all avenues of communication to recruit and brainwash troops to the LDS religion; or you really like to debate reagardless of the venue.

I say the last because my spouse and I went on a tour of the church in SLC. I cannot rememeber what it was, but we went to the Tabernacle Choir where the tour quide dropped a pin on stage and we could hear it 50 yards away,among other sites. Anyway, towards the end of the escorted tour, we were led into a small room with a projector and screen and shown a 'propaganda' video of the LDS religion. We watched a few minutes of it until we understood what it was trying to do, which was sign us up. Well, I had had enough and attemtped to leave. As I got to the door with my spouse a young man blocked it and attempted to persuade me to stay and watch the video. I politely advised him I wished to leave and he persisted that I stay. When I tried to go around him, he moved to block me asking me to atleast fill out an address form so he could send someone by my residence to talk to us. I had to threaten him with physical violence to get him to move. This single event put a very sour taste in my mouth with regards to the LDS. But, I am still considering moving there. And this was several years ago, when the malls were not even open on Sundays due to the common religion. Things have changed since then, hence our consideration to move there.
While I welcome the responses to this last paragraph, I ask you to refrain from calling me a liar, or some other form of denegration. This would only prove the point that bigotry and hypocrisy exists soley and largely within the Church of LDS.
(I am not a Jack-Mormon either; which is one that professes to be Mormon/LDS and drinks coffee/liqour/caffeine, etc but denounces it come Sunday. )
SNL skit: "Why can't we all just get along?" Because God created us fallable.

[isakswings]

"I have also noticed that after the initial "friend-ing", the conversations with the neighbors have dropped to zero. Could be the weather or other things. I just find it interesting."

It definately could be other things. Our neighborhood is very friendly. We have a pretty good mix of people here as well. Anyway, I know I haven't spoken to a few of our neighbors in a couple of months. It has nothing to do with them, but more to do with the fact that they are not out when I am out. Hopefully that is all it is with your neighborhood too.

Angie

[isakswings]

the actual LDS church site is http://www.LDS.org :-)

[snomom2000]

Originally Posted by isakswings

"I have also noticed that after the initial "friend-ing", the conversations with the neighbors have dropped to zero. Could be the weather or other things. I just find it interesting."

It definately could be other things. Our neighborhood is very friendly. We have a pretty good mix of people here as well. Anyway, I know I haven't spoken to a few of our neighbors in a couple of months. It has nothing to do with them, but more to do with the fact that they are not out when I am out. Hopefully that is all it is with your neighborhood too.

Angie

Another thing to consider also is that maybe your neighbors prefer to spend their time elsewhere, for other reasons than they are LDS. I'm not saying anything bad about you, isakswings, but you have to admit that when you are in a new situation you scope out those around you. It's natural, that's how you decided where to spend your efforts. When I go into a new situation I look around, make an assessment of those I see, decide who I want to talk to, talk to them and then determine if I wish to continue talking to them. It's the same thing when someone moves into a neighborhood. You need to spend some amount of time with them to determine if you want to spend more time with them. I think in today's society of "no one can lose anything, ever" people have lost the ability to realize that their neighbors don't have to be their best friends, for instance. Maybe my neighbors spent time with me and decided that they didn't want to spend more time with me. That's their choice and it's okay, even if I'm upset about it! Maybe they did make that choice based on their religion, that's also okay and not bigoted of them. They made a personal choice. I haven't heard of any LDS stoning people/kids in the street or bad mouthing their non-LDS neighbors. Just some LDS neighbors choosing to spend their time elsewhere. There's nothing wrong with that. We don't have to all get along, we just have to polite and respectfull to have a successful society.
By the way, I'm not LDS. There may be LDS people who don't uphold their religious values and are hypocrits, but guess what? Every religions has people like that! Everyone struggles for balance in their lives and even the most pious people have difficulty sometimes following their own values. That is why I, for one, will give any LDS that crosses my path the same respect and margin for error that I would give anyone, regardless of religion.

[snomom2000]

Originally Posted by isakswings

"I have also noticed that after the initial "friend-ing", the conversations with the neighbors have dropped to zero. Could be the weather or other things. I just find it interesting."

It definately could be other things. Our neighborhood is very friendly. We have a pretty good mix of people here as well. Anyway, I know I haven't spoken to a few of our neighbors in a couple of months. It has nothing to do with them, but more to do with the fact that they are not out when I am out. Hopefully that is all it is with your neighborhood too.

Angie

Another thing to consider also is that maybe your neighbors prefer to spend their time elsewhere, for other reasons than they are LDS. I'm not saying anything bad about you, isakswings, but you have to admit that when you are in a new situation you scope out those around you. It's natural, that's how you decided where to spend your efforts. When I go into a new situation I look around, make an assessment of those I see, decide who I want to talk to, talk to them and then determine if I wish to continue talking to them. It's the same thing when someone moves into a neighborhood. You need to spend some amount of time with them to determine if you want to spend more time with them. I think in today's society of "no one can lose anything, ever" people have lost the ability to realize that their neighbors don't have to be their best friends, for instance. Maybe my neighbors spent time with me and decided that they didn't want to spend more time with me. That's their choice and it's okay, even if I'm upset about it! Maybe they did make that choice based on their religion, that's also okay and not bigoted of them. They made a personal choice. I haven't heard of any LDS stoning people/kids in the street or bad mouthing their non-LDS neighbors. Just some LDS neighbors choosing to spend their time elsewhere. There's nothing wrong with that. We don't have to all get along, we just have to polite and respectfull to have a successful society.
By the way, I'm not LDS. There may be LDS people who don't uphold their religious values and are hypocrits, but guess what? Every religions has people like that! Everyone struggles for balance in their lives and even the most pious people have difficulty sometimes following their own values. That is why I, for one, will give any LDS that crosses my path the same respect and margin for error that I would give anyone, regardless of religion.

[aussie_american]

DP525 (and other IMFLSHRS - LOL to that acronym!). I found this thread today when googling for info on "lehi housing prices". My husband currently works for Micron in Virginia and we have been considering a move to Lehi because of the cheaper housing market and family currently living in SLC. We are also non-LDS and although I thought it might take a bit more time to make friends there that share interests in common with us I didn't realise that being non-LDS would be such a big consideration until reading this thread today. I'm hoping that we will be able to find people to socialise with both inside and outside of the co-worker relationship. At least the workplace might be a start. Perhaps this thread will spawn a "new to the area" social contact group?

We hadn't really thought about looking for a house anywhere outside of the Lehi, Alpine, Cedar Hills area so I am really interested to hear more about your experience in Daybreak and particularly the commute. Although it might be against the majority of traffic, once shift rotation starts, night-shift would be travelling in the reverse (worse traffic) direction.

I would imagine that with the projected hiring number for IMFT, there will be lots of non-LDS moving into the area. It would be a shame if they all chose to live in the SLC area and commute rather than live close to work.

Please keep the updates coming.

[DP525]

Originally Posted by aussie_american

Please keep the updates coming.

Another thing to keep in mind is the commute to Lehi from Salt lake County will be vastly over I-15 around Point of the Mountain. I have heard this can be quite treacherous in the winter when the wind blows the snow and causes icy conditions. Apparently there are a lot of wrecks (and traffic jams) there. There is also the Traverse Ridge (or Mountain?) Road that goes directly over the mountain from Draper almost into IMFT's parking lot. It will have less traffic but ascends a 7000+ ft mountain so I am sure it will not be fun in winter either. I also think Redwood Road (major north-south road that parallels I-15) runs all the way to Lehi. I might be wrong on that one but should find out for sure before winter hits so I have an alternate route.

[chazcrew]

Originally Posted by DP525

Another thing to keep in mind is the commute to Lehi from Salt lake County will be vastly over I-15 around Point of the Mountain. I have heard this can be quite treacherous in the winter when the wind blows the snow and causes icy conditions. Apparently there are a lot of wrecks (and traffic jams) there. There is also the Traverse Ridge (or Mountain?) Road that goes directly over the mountain from Draper almost into IMFT's parking lot. It will have less traffic but ascends a 7000+ ft mountain so I am sure it will not be fun in winter either. I also think Redwood Road (major north-south road that parallels I-15) runs all the way to Lehi. I might be wrong on that one but should find out for sure before winter hits so I have an alternate route.

Yes, the point of the mountain tends to be the worst part of the commute, weather wise. I don't know why, just geographical factors, I guess. It can be fine everywhere else, and the point will have high winds and drifting snow. My husband drives it every day, and there are some days I'm pretty nervous, but most of the time it's not that bad. But it is a consideration.

The Traverse Mountain road is not direct; it winds among suburban housing and snakes down the mountain, and would take longer for that reason, plus it can get high winds and drifting too, just like the point. If you live on the east side of draper and want to bypass the freeway, then Traverse is an okay option. Otherwise, it's out of the way and might not offer a savings in time. Redwood Road is a major road that does continue clear to Lehi, but it is very far west of Lehi (Saratoga Springs area), so if you take that road to get to IMFT, you will end up going through the downtown Lehi traffic (very VERY bad) to get over to the east side of Lehi. I wouldn't consider Redwood Road a viable alternative, unless there's a complete shutdown of I-15 for an accident or something. Even then, I'd opt for one of the frontage roads instead. There simply is no decent east-west road on that side of Lehi yet. They're supposedly working on a bypass route sometime in the future, but I don't know when it will be done. Until then, I avoid downtown Lehi at rush hour. It's just a parking lot.

[DP525]

Originally Posted by isakswings

"I have also noticed that after the initial "friend-ing", the conversations with the neighbors have dropped to zero. Could be the weather or other things. I just find it interesting."

It definately could be other things. Our neighborhood is very friendly. We have a pretty good mix of people here as well. Anyway, I know I haven't spoken to a few of our neighbors in a couple of months. It has nothing to do with them, but more to do with the fact that they are not out when I am out. Hopefully that is all it is with your neighborhood too.

Angie

I am probably just being paranoid. I had neighbors in other cities who I NEVER spoke to. I haven't been going out of my way to speak to my current neighbors either. I am just too busy. I say "Hi" or wave if I see them but that has been the extent of it lately.

I just hate that this whole LDS / non-LDS issue, real or made-up, has made me so paranoid. If I have the slightest inkling that something is not quite right, I will tend to think it is because the neighbors have discovered we are not "members".

But nothing bad has happened...

I still think my neighbors are great and just real busy like us. Find me a couple in their 30's with a kid or four who isn't busy. And their kids keep ringing the doorbell looking for playmates and my kids are only too happy to oblige. And that is the answer to the issue that started this thread.

Are my wife and I happy? The jury is still out. We enjoy the shopping and taking the kids to the Childrens Museum on TRAX. The weather has been very agreeable. There are a couple of kick-@#$ radio stations. We like Daybreak and enjoy its parks, playgrounds, and paths. It will be truly great as it continues to grow. But aside from the increase in our property value, we are not real happy about the temple being built there. Nothing like helping to cement the "outsider" feeling. And that basically sums up our feelings right now. We feel a bit like outsiders. My wife is angry that she feels she can't wear certain clothes for fear that the neighbors might stop letting their kids come over. I have to drive 10 miles to buy a bottle of wine or six-pack of "real" beer and then am afraid to sit on my large front porch and drink it for the same reason. We are afraid to invite someone over for a cup of coffee for fear of offending them. It is just different living here. And again, it might be mostly our own paranoia. But if we weren't in Utah we wouldn't be so paranoid. Maybe time will prove us wrong and I sincerely hope so. There is a lot of potential here and I hope we grow to like it and feel comfortable.