Non-mormon family looking to relocate to Lehi (Salt Lake City, Sandy: real estate, travel)

[DP525]

Originally Posted by Reluctant Coloradan

It is wrong to stereotype, but these people had real experiences too. Any religion where a small group claims exclusive rights to decide how and who gets to access God's presence is a cult. The members are usually too lazy to study and pray on their own, and just want someone to tell them what to think. Nothing beats studying the Bible on your own.

Ooooohhh! You are in trouble now!

[coolcats]

Originally Posted by DP525

Ooooohhh! You are in trouble now!

I think the problem is we see all these people who really know nothing about the state or LDS church either: 1) make a ridiculous claim about the Mormon religion that is so far from the truth it is laughable, or 2) make it seem like Utah is a close second to Saudi Arabia when it comes to lifestyle.

Then it taints people's perceptions before they even have a chance to experience or decide for themselves. So then, when a neighbor is less friendly after a couple of weeks, this change is attributed to discrimination against the non-LDS rather than just a change in the weather and the busy holiday season.

The thing is, I don't think either ReluctantColoradan or DP525 will be able to understand what I'm saying. I've only been to Colorado a couple of times, but I have it on good information that Coors is so powerful there, that it convinced the state legislature to replace milk at school lunch with cartons of beer. That, combined with lower oxygen levels at high altitudes, causes massive destruction of brain cells in the youth so no one goes to school past the 9th grade there.

The above is firmly tongue-in-cheek, because actually DP525 you seem to be willing to think through the issues and respectfully discuss them. But it just illustrates how ridiculous and even offensive some of these statements can seem

[DP525]

Originally Posted by coolcats

I think the problem is we see all these people who really know nothing about the state or LDS church either: 1) make a ridiculous claim about the Mormon religion that is so far from the truth it is laughable, or 2) make it seem like Utah is a close second to Saudi Arabia when it comes to lifestyle.

Then it taints people's perceptions before they even have a chance to experience or decide for themselves. So then, when a neighbor is less friendly after a couple of weeks, this change is attributed to discrimination against the non-LDS rather than just a change in the weather and the busy holiday season.

The thing is, I don't think either ReluctantColoradan or DP525 will be able to understand what I'm saying. I've only been to Colorado a couple of times, but I have it on good information that Coors is so powerful there, that it convinced the state legislature to replace milk at school lunch with cartons of beer. That, combined with lower oxygen levels at high altitudes, causes massive destruction of brain cells in the youth so no one goes to school past the 9th grade there.

The above is firmly tongue-in-cheek, because actually DP525 you seem to be willing to think through the issues and respectfully discuss them. But it just illustrates how ridiculous and even offensive some of these statements can seem

Talk about offensive statements!! Coors???? No self-respecting Coloradan would drink that bilge water.

And the women are much better looking in Utah than Saudi Arabia.

[Zuma Mama]

Originally Posted by DP525

Too late, I already forwarded your message to your bishop. He wants to talk to you on Sunday.

That's cute, DP ~ you don't miss a beat do you! As it turns out, you are funnier, or perhaps more intuitive, than you know. I really did have an appointment with my Bishop last Sunday! Thankfully, he did not ask me about the kind of language I'm using in cyber space.

[DP525]

Originally Posted by Zuma Mama

That's cute, DP ~ you don't miss a beat do you! As it turns out, you are funnier, or perhaps more intuitive, than you know. I really did have an appointment with my Bishop last Sunday! Thankfully, he did not ask me about the kind of language I'm using in cyber space.

I am glad you have taken the high road and decided to clean up your act. I was about ready to see if coolcats could wash out your mouth with Postum.

Welcome back.

[chazcrew]

ROFL DP.......I almost choked on my caffeine-free beverage.

Postum does rival soap in taste.

[coolcats]

Originally Posted by DP525

I am glad you have taken the high road and decided to clean up your act. I was about ready to see if coolcats could wash out your mouth with Postum.

Welcome back.

I think we've created a monster with way too much inside knowledge

[REguy]

I've spent part of my Friday night, now part of my Saturday morning reading each and every thread of this subject started by DP. I ran into this by Googling the following : "why so many wards in utah?" I really was trying to learn why there are SO MANY "wards"/temples in Utah. The subject was touched on briefly by DP, but I am intreagued by your story which began for us in May 06, and continues to this day. I'm glad you stuck with this board and kept posting about your experience.
I'm 29 & live in Ca. (my entire life). My brother, age 31, moved to Utah last year from Ca after he converted out here to Mormanism (if thats what you call it). He moved there with his wife who has always been Morman, as her entire Utah family is. My wife, my young son, and I made our first trip out there to visit them in Jan 06 - a few months after their move. Going into it, I knew Utah was "Morman Country" so to speak. I didnt get a real sense of that though passing through St George, but I did once entering Provo approx. I can't impress upon you how beautiful I think the state is, my wife thinks so too. But as soon as we noticed the first Space Needle like temple, then the second, then the third, then the fourth, then the ....and these were all within a few blocks of each other, it become obvious it would be this way the entire way traveling up the 15 freeway. Us in the car: "another one, theres another one, uhp, another one, one more" Its crazy, and I use the word crazy lightly because I do respect every religeons right to practice (I should throw in develop/build) as they wish.
The sad thing is, before our trip, and 3/4 way into it, we were really excited to visit a new place where my brother had moved to. We even discussed checking out housing and job opportunities because we'd like to experience living outside of Ca, somewhere that actually gets snow too, somewhere beautiful like Utah. But, and theres always one of those right? We find the in-your-face presence of the Wards/Temples (not sure what to call them) much to much to bare with. I won't say its exclusionary since IM SURE they'd love for me to walk right through their door and become one of them, but that is the feeling any normal warm blooded Non-LDS member will feel. Upon ending our long road trip at my brothers home address, I was able to finally say - "Uhp - another one". My brothers cute little housing tract indeed had its very own little "Ward" of its own too.
Even if the Wards/Temples were instead actually a "neighborhood" Republican National Committe gathering place for its members ( I am a stout 'R' as well), I can only imagine how a Democrat entering "Utah" "SLC" "Davis/Weber" counties would feel. Probably like they don't belong.
It is now November 06, eleven months since my 1st trip to Utah. I was actually pondering leaving Ca again earlier tonight, and pondering the beautiful state of Utah again. I started looking up facts, opinions, and anything I could to understand the state more.
DP, now I need to know nothing more than you and some others have already provided here over the last few months. Aside from the huge obstacle of the abundant wards/temples reminding me of being "different" (aka non LDS), I don't think (rather I know) I could ever move to a place where I can't enjoy a cold Sam Adams on my day off, on my awesome front porch, while I watch my sexy wife trim the rose bushes in an innocent tank top - all because I am paranoid about my uptight (in general) "potential" LDS neighbors.

Thats my 87 cents. DP, thank God for your limited 2 year work obligation, but I do however sincerely hope that week by week and month by month this becomes the best move you and your family ever made.

By the way... what is the deal with the "wards/temples" anyway??? Are they guaranteed a spot in ANY new development of new homes there? Obviously they are an extremely wealthy church to pop a building up in every neighborhood. But really, is there some sort of state mandate/law that guarantees the church real estate 'space', or do they simply open up their pocket book to the land owner/developer each time a community is announced? I'd love to learn more about that, as its fascinating for many reasons to me, even though its a practice I disagree with.

If you read this far - take care!!

[edschred]

Hi All, It’s my first post here. I work and live in Manhattan, NYC, as a real estate broker. 15 years selling residential here. Anyway, I've been to Park City skiing a couple of times. I was thinking of getting a second home there and maybe living threre part time. I don't have a family yet but will someday in th enext five years or so. Manhattan is just too much fun to settle down right now. I am religious but not Agnostic. Just spiritual. I believe in one God and that Gods presense is shown to me in others by the love I see them giving. I enjoy the practices of others that worship their God either in a group or individually if it comes from a place of love and respect. When people get preachy or demanding, I step aside. Anyway, I didn't originally come here to talk about religion. I was interested in Real Estate Investment in Park City, and the SLC areas. Mainly because it's so beautiful in the Mountains and the skiing and other outdoor lifestyle stuff rocks there. So, I found this site and stumbled across this thread. WOW! This hits the nail on the head. What's more important than where you live and what you believe in? I only read the first and last parts of the thread. It seems that DP stated in the beginning that "Utah was going to have to do without him". At the end he's talking about which subdivision to live in that's close enough to work, but far away enough from religious people. Hey DP, what changed your mind? Was it the money and career? Was it that you now agree and want the religious lifestyle that Utonians have? What was it?????

[chazcrew]

REguy, I don't know what kind of answer you expect, but there's a very simple answer to your question. This state is full of churches and temples because they're needed. Believe it or not, most of those church buildings have three separate wards (congregations) meeting in it each Sunday. And the temples have been so busy that new ones have had to be built. I know it seems like overkill, but it's true. Even in my little town, each time a new development goes in, so does a new church, because that development is chock full of active LDS families, and one neighborhood will fill an entire ward.
And the money used to build these churches and temples comes from tithing funds, so in essence we're all paying for the buildings ourselves.

As for the real estate, I think the church buys land as things are being developed, if it sees a future need for a church to accommodate its growing membership. But I don't know for sure how that works.

Space needle? Really? Huh. Needs a big round flying saucer thing at the top to really resemble that, I think.