Utah Valley - Can we be allowed to share our experiences? (Salt Lake City: lease, credit)

[stycotl]

Originally Posted by Keliko

As stated in my above post, both of my parents condone drinking, smoking, foul language, skimpy, or baggy clothes.

My mother has tried to to communicate with the neighbors about the lack of socialization also, it was commented "we have nothing in common, not the same up bringing, not the same interests and activities" on many occasions. Uh, my mother wanted better school programs for the local schools, isn't that a common interest?!

Funny thing, had a family move in next door from California, were also not LDS, we were pretty close, would go over to each others houses for dinner, play with each others dogs, etc... my friend from a LDS family informed me that her mom and quite a few other ward members were gossiping about them...This family moved about a year after back to California.

I have met some great LDS families though in other areas, very accepting, gracious people. People I could consider family.

sounds like you had a rotten bunch. sorry about that, and thanks for realizing that the majority of us are not like that.

don't worry too much about people like that though. they are irritating, and are good at hurting feelings, but they never really amount to much as far as social or emotional intelligence is concerned. and when that is the case, they hardly ever amount to anything in the end. best you can do with them is to offer your support or advice, and then leave them to their own fiery ruin if they don't accept it.

aaron out.

[carlymac]

From my experience growing up in Utah, there were lots of kids I had no idea about. No idea what church they attended. I honestly didn't think about it. They were simply classmates. But there were some who were pretty vocal about not wanting to associate with LDS kids cause we were "no fun, too straight, boring". I had a friend across the street who never wanted to join in with the mostly LDS kids on the street cause she didn't relate to us. She never invited us over either. It was her choice. She thought we were stupid airhead ninnies. LDS kids can be wierd by the world's standards and no fun depending on what the definition of fun is. So I do believe the "shunning" goes both ways.

I would want to get to the bottom of why the school didn't want the extra programs. That really shouldn't have anything to do with religion. The explanations I can dream up are that possibly the school didn't want to add in any science "ideas" that weren't sanctioned by the district. I suppose the district is influenced by LDS ideals. (No promoting theories about evolution or stem cell research- that sort of thing. I'm sure there are more controversial subjects that I can't think of off the top of my head. ) Maybe it was a budget issue. Or perhaps what your parents wanted to do conflicted time-wise with something a big percentage of kids were involved in after school- scouts or sports or the different achievement programs LDS kids do. I honestly don't know. But if your mom really wants to do this, I suggest she keep trying. Or ask for a well defined reason for her efforts being rejected. Not being LDS isn't a valid reason at all. I'm sure any LDS person would agree with me. That reasoning makes zero sense! That's why I'm saying there must be more to the story, some communication slip up.

There probably are some very ignorant LDS people who would say that their kids couldn't play with non LDS kids. My husband's grandmother was biased like that but that was 50 yrs ago. Maybe some young kids are picking up some distorted views from adults in their lives and twisting the truth. But it does make sense that you would be sent home if other guests arrive. We send our kids' friends home if there is a family party or something about to happen. Families have the right to their private parties IMO. As for the adults who don't want to socialize with your mom , perhaps they are simply being honest. Maybe they truely don't have anything in common. I'm very sorry if that's the case. Sad for anyone who would miss a chance to expand their horizons. But I don't think that kind of behavior is exclusive to LDS people. I've never been invited into the Somali home down the street. Nor would I want to be because they speak loud and fast in a different language. My daughter was invited into a different Somali home once before and it was scarey for me because there were all kinds of grown men coming and going and not speaking English. The friend's mother couldn't communicate either. I found out later that the mother was asleep the whole time my little girl was there because she worked the night shift. I preferred the girls just be friends at school after that since I didn't really know if my daughter was safe there. This is what I mean about there being more to the story. I don't dislike Somalis as a whole (like some people seem to generally dislike Mormons). I just don't fit into their culture very well. That's OK. I have no ill feelings towards them.

Best of luck in trying to understand. And again, sorry for sounding abrupt without fully explaining where I was coming from.

[Keliko]

Originally Posted by carlymac

From my experience growing up in Utah, there were lots of kids I had no idea about. No idea what church they attended. I honestly didn't think about it. They were simply classmates. But there were some who were pretty vocal about not wanting to associate with LDS kids cause we were "no fun, too straight, boring". I had a friend across the street who never wanted to join in with the mostly LDS kids on the street cause she didn't relate to us. She never invited us over either. It was her choice. She thought we were stupid airhead ninnies. LDS kids can be wierd by the world's standards and no fun depending on what the definition of fun is. So I do believe the "shunning" goes both ways.

I would want to get to the bottom of why the school didn't want the extra programs. That really shouldn't have anything to do with religion. The explanations I can dream up are that possibly the school didn't want to add in any science "ideas" that weren't sanctioned by the district. I suppose the district is influenced by LDS ideals. (No promoting theories about evolution or stem cell research- that sort of thing. I'm sure there are more controversial subjects that I can't think of off the top of my head. ) Maybe it was a budget issue. Or perhaps what your parents wanted to do conflicted time-wise with something a big percentage of kids were involved in after school- scouts or sports or the different achievement programs LDS kids do. I honestly don't know. But if your mom really wants to do this, I suggest she keep trying. Or ask for a well defined reason for her efforts being rejected. Not being LDS isn't a valid reason at all. I'm sure any LDS person would agree with me. That reasoning makes zero sense! That's why I'm saying there must be more to the story, some communication slip up.

There probably are some very ignorant LDS people who would say that their kids couldn't play with non LDS kids. My husband's grandmother was biased like that but that was 50 yrs ago. Maybe some young kids are picking up some distorted views from adults in their lives and twisting the truth. But it does make sense that you would be sent home if other guests arrive. We send our kids' friends home if there is a family party or something about to happen. Families have the right to their private parties IMO. As for the adults who don't want to socialize with your mom , perhaps they are simply being honest. Maybe they truely don't have anything in common. I'm very sorry if that's the case. Sad for anyone who would miss a chance to expand their horizons. But I don't think that kind of behavior is exclusive to LDS people. I've never been invited into the Somali home down the street. Nor would I want to be because they speak loud and fast in a different language. My daughter was invited into a different Somali home once before and it was scarey for me because there were all kinds of grown men coming and going and not speaking English. The friend's mother couldn't communicate either. I found out later that the mother was asleep the whole time my little girl was there because she worked the night shift. I preferred the girls just be friends at school after that since I didn't really know if my daughter was safe there. This is what I mean about there being more to the story. I don't dislike Somalis as a whole (like some people seem to generally dislike Mormons). I just don't fit into their culture very well. That's OK. I have no ill feelings towards them.

Best of luck in trying to understand. And again, sorry for sounding abrupt without fully explaining where I was coming from.

I don't think you read my previous posts, because I don't know if you noticed that I wrote my brother's school now has these activities after the three(from the same ward) in charge were dismissed. My mom fully funded her time and the volunteers. They didn't want to talk to her the minute she entered the room.
To clear up.
My mom is an engineer, not a evolution scientist, wanted to teach kids about electricity, mechanical devices, how energy works, etc, it had nothing to do with evolution or creation, she also brought back the science fair to the school. Also, came up with an after school program for kids who wanted to learn Chinese (since Spanish and French are offered).
Funny, my mother taught at the University of Utah, took me and my brother to sports and music activities like other moms does, take my brother to boy scouts, walks the dog, does garden work, reads, watches tv and movies, kept her house clean, loves to shop at Maceys, listens to Celine Dion, yet she has nothing in common with them?!
...
It's okay really, I have met some really decent and great LDS people, you don't need to keep coming up with reasons for those who were considerably cold and rude to my family. I don't judge people base on their religion, race, etc... it's their actions, interests, personalities that matter to me.

[carlymac]

Kudos to your mom! Who really knows what those other ladies meant?

[skrit]

Originally Posted by Cycle

The truth is, be very careful if you are non-lds about where you move especially if you have children, would like to be a part of a community, would like to have neighbors who speak to you or would like to have your existence acknowledged

While I understand what you are experiencing, choosing to live in an area with people that are not like-minded to me would be like choosing to live in Chinatown if you are not Asian, Harlem if you are not black or parts of LA if you are not Hispanic. It really is not their fault, you are the one that is different in their neighborhood.

Just as there are concentrated ethnic neighborhoods, there are concentrated religious ones too. The thing with concentrated religious neighborhoods here in UT is that most everyone is the same race, so if you are white and living in Utah County, there is no easy way to superficially tell if someone is LDS or not (well sort of...superficial being the key word here). So in the outside you probably feel like you could be and should be part of the community until your neighbors realize your personal values and moral convictions do not jive with theirs and slowly stop acknowledging your presence. Yes if your neighbors are snooty Mormons then you will be shunned, however there are just as many snooty non-Mormons that would do the same.

Let's not overgeneralize the LDS population. You live in a snooty area with folks that ALL go to a different church than you. Your chances of finding acceptance in an area like that are dismal. If you were to live in Hollywood do you think you would easily be accepted in the elite social scene there if you are not famous?

This is where un-biased research and boards such as this one help you make informed decisions on where to live or move before you actually do.

[stycotl]

evolution is real.

heck, this is something that i even agree with byu about.

[carlymac]

BYU doesn't teach evolution (or do they?)

[stycotl]

they do.

[Cycle]

Skrit,
Thank you so much for helping me make my point. Everything looks so perfect from the outside that it is almost impossible to tell before getting stuck in a neighborhood that this is going to happen...this is what this post is about, letting people who are considering moving to this area know that this intolerable behavior exists and to make sure they do their research.
Cycle

[kaytidid]

Originally Posted by Cycle

Everything looks so perfect from the outside that it is almost impossible to tell before getting stuck in a neighborhood that this is going to happen

I do believe that to be totally true. I think I must have hit it lucky, as sometimes happens.

Truly hope you can find a better place for you and your family.